General Discussion

[Firewind]

Re: D&D

Question 1: Is your character a member of an organization? Have they ever been? Do they want to be? Explain.

Question 2: What is your character's current current short-term goal? What's their long-term goal? Have either of those goals changed since the campaign started?

Question 3: What... or who... does your character love? If the answer is "noone/nothing", why is that?

Sorry about the delay, long and busy week:

1) Other than running around with fellow thieves, Lili hasn't really been part of any official group. She tends to work with whatever like minded people are around at the time be it thieves, mercenaries or the current group.

2) Short term goal: to make a load of money. Long time goal: to make a shitload of money.

3) My character has a soft spot for kids so loves helping them out. Other than that my character is your typical "in the adventure for the love of adventure" type.

Oh and GP, She loves GP. Those darn Rogues and their love the shinies.

[cidbahamut]

Re: D&D

Quote of the Day: "You cannot resist my magical Jesus powers."

[Armando]

Re: D&D

Quote of the Day: "You cannot resist my magical Jesus powers."

Source: Miss Dynamite XX

EDIT: Yyg, am I allowed to use Step Up from 10 foot range if I have a reach weapon?

[Firewind]

Re: D&D

I got to kill a Stone Golem with a hammer. That alone has made the campaign for me.

[cidbahamut]

Re: D&D

So Yyg, how many times can I take this feat: Fleet - Pathfinder_OGC

[Armando]

Re: D&D

I just realized I had Power Attack all along.

[cidbahamut]

Re: D&D

In other news: I loved The Hand. You could have just pitted us against a generic Gnoll, but that guy was freaking bad-ass. I kinda hope we haven't seen the last of him, since he was kind of interesting even if we didn't get to interact with him much beyond trying to kill him.

[Armando]

Re: D&D

I'm still trying to figure out why he jumped into the mushroom pit. Did he not know there were flesh-eating mushrooms down there?

[Firewind]

Re: D&D

What about Cultist #2? I don't think we have seen the last of him either.

[Armando]

Re: D&D

Yyg said he forgot all about the dude. Considering we found the mastermind behind the kidnappings, we could simply pretend we killed him off with the rest of the cultists. He never stood a fighting chance and was clearly too stupid to scheme against us in the future.

[Firewind]

Re: D&D

And I just realised there's so many Rogue builds out there I'm tempted to go for.

Rogue/Sorc/Arcane Trickster (Rogue3/Sorc7/AT10) would be fun though I won't be able to steal in combat that often FF Thief style, and I lose out on a ton of out of combat skills since Sorcs have shit skill point totals and ATs just have an average one.

Two Weapon fighting Rogue is fun because of all of the sneak attack damage but it's very expensive feat-wise and I already dropped a feat on Point Blank Shot

Archer Rogue is pretty fun but it's hard to get sneak attacks from range and it would be harder for me to steal in combat.

[Firewind]

Re: D&D

Actually a quick question to eliminate a build: are we still only allowing Prestige Classes at Lv10+ only? I'm asking this because waiting until Lv10 to take Arcane Trickster levels would massively gimp my character's skill ranks compared to say Rogue3/Sorc4 or Rogue3/Wiz3. Arcane Tricksters are ridiculously awesome out of combat due to their skill ranks and so I wouldn't want to lose that when I can just pump UMD as a Rogue and use Wands/Scrolls for the same effect really

[Mezlo]

Re: D&D

Yeah, Yyg said no Prestige classes until level 10. I have aquestion though fire. What are you going to gain by multi-classing with a spell caster? To me it just seems liek you are giving up valuable skills you'd pick up by investing that level into rogue. Gaining a +1d6 every other level on Rogue for sneak attack damage is just sick, plus you'd be giving up an additional attack you'd be picking up once your rogue hits level 8.

[Firewind]

Re: D&D

Arcane Trickster is basically "MacGuyver with spells" which does sort of fit into my character concept if you look at her inventory. The fact that we prestige at 10 does hurt what I can do with this a lot though since at 7th/8th Level I will be able to take the class but I will have 2-3 levels where I'm a bit stuck. Spending them on Rogue level loses me 2-3 levels worth of spellcaster level progression, spending them on Wiz/Sorc levels loses me 2-3 levels of BAB, Sneak Attack, Talents and increased Skill Ranks.

Don't get me wrong, I can work with it, and I haven't decided on if I'm going the AT route or a pure Rogue route (Lili's stats favour pure Rogue at the moment but that can be fixed somewhat with magical items later in the campaign).

Arcane Trickster gives the same Sneak Attack progression as a Rogue so you don't miss out on much actually if you go AT as soon as possible, you also really don't miss out on many skill ranks if you pump int and go Rogue/Wiz/AT.

Also losing the BAB is more than worth the utility that the spellcasting ability gives you. Arcane Tricksters aren't all about combat. Sure a minmaxed one is one of the best magical DDs in the game when you apply sneak attack damage to Rays or Meteor Swarm, but what you have to look at is this: a well made Arcane Trickster in Pathfinder has the skills of a Rogue, a great choice of in and out of combat spells, sneak attack and the ability to flank is necessary all rolled into one.

Playing one as a blaster or pure mage is a waste, just play a Sorc.

Playing one as a Rogue with spells is a waste too, just play a Bard.

I think this is the best description of an Arcane trickster at it's best:

You're the rogue with something extra. It bears repeating.

In one discussion of the AT on the Paizo boards, someone referred to an AT he played in 3.x as “MacGyver with spells.” This is an excellent description of how the AT works, and how he contributes. Regardless of your party's makeup, the AT can fill the stealthy skill-monkey role of the bard, ninja or rogue, and has the magic to solve or bypass some problems that they can't. He can also cast arcane spells like a sorcerer or wizard, and can fill that role to some degree, if needed. He's more effective, though, if there's another dedicated full caster taking care of the “god” role. The AT is a secondary party buffer at best, but by coordinating with your other caster(s), you can cover a lot of bases.

Rogues can use magic items like wands and scrolls, etc., but that gets expensive, fast, and they have to roll a check every time. The AT can reliably use the best spell list in the game, essentially for free.

So, when it's time for somebody to turn invisible, climb silently over the wall, knock out the guards, kill the one guard who made his save with a single cantrip, coup de grace the others while they're still knocked out, find and disable the pit trap, then unlock and open the gates from the inside, there's just one character in the group who can do all of that by himself without breaking much of a sweat, or expending a fortune in spells or magic items. It was all you, dog. At seventh level.

A rogue could do all that with the right scrolls and a few successful UMD checks (he's hosed if he fails one, though). A wizard could do most of that, by using a lot more magic than the AT needed (assuming he had it prepared), though he might not do so well with the trap.

The AT did it with the lowest expenditure of resources, and has plenty left over for whatever happens next. He needed two low-level spells, a cantrip, two climb checks, some stealth rolls at +20, a weapon and a tool kit. Take a bow, young Skywalker. The force is with you!

He could have also managed all that in other ways than the methods used here, depending on his spell and skill selection. The point is, “Arcane Trickster” is the name of the class, and having tricks up your sleeve is what makes you fun to play.

Simply put: the class rewards thinking outside the box. It is worth taking the hit to combat effectiveness for that, especially in a campaign like Yyg's where he rewards this kind of play and there are plenty of skill checks to do.

[cidbahamut]

Re: D&D

Why my character keeps throwing daggers on hand

For those of you who were wondering.