PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

[Raydeus]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

The only way SSDs will improve performance is if they get rid of disk requirements to play the software.

If you see the PS3 (I don't know about the Xbox) it isn't even taking advantage of the regular HDD transfer rates to begin with because the system still needs to read from the disk for most games.

So, the only way to improve loading speeds is getting rid of the disks altogether. This will require full installation PC style instead of a limited one like it's currently used. So hopefully digital distribution will take over for the next generation and instead of SSDs they will include 2TB disk for installation data.

With SSD (TRIM, etc.) support for people wanting to upgrade, of course.

[Icemage]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

The only way SSDs will improve performance is if they get rid of disk requirements to play the software.

Not explicitly true. A small (~4GB or so) SSD which is used exclusively for caching game data and maybe starting the console firmware could provide a significant boost to performance if it's provided as a standard feature (so that developers can be sure it's there and make use of it).

The reason SSDs don't help PS3 games much is because developers can only reasonably expect there to be a 5600 RPM hard drive available, and so a lot of processes are developed with that in mind. It's not (usually) because of the Blu-ray drive, per se.

Assuming that the next gen PS and Xbox don't come around for another two years or so, I suspect one or both will feature something like this. By that time, the smallest SSDs should become "commercially viable" to include in other devices. It absolves the need for a full-blown SSD for general storage - and the associated gigantic costs - while still offering high performance for developers who need to cache game data for streaming purposes.

It's also worth noting that the PS3's Blu-ray drive is 2x, and we now have 12x Blu-ray drives in the wild, so even that bottleneck will be less of an issue. My guess is that the PS4 will probably ship with an 8x BDXL drive. Maybe the next Xbox as well. As for the Wii U, the only thing Nintendo's said is that it will be a 25GB optical disc. If I were forced at gunpoint to guess, I'd guess it is a variation on single-layer Blu-ray, with maybe a 4x equivalent drive.



---------- Post added at 07:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:01 AM ----------

oh yeah I agree as well.... I am getting the WII: U when it comes out, as I do every Nintendo system....but I swear if it's online is not on par with PS3/360..... well *sigh* I dont know anymore -.-

...as for this, I'll go ahead and predict it now: Nintendo's online service will never be the equal of either Xbox Live or PlayStation Network. They are way too attached to their squeaky-clean "fun for everyone" image to let go of the reins on things like voice chat. The chaos which is Xbox Live's banning system is simply anathema to everything Nintendo represents as a company. They don't want users bickering, or calling each other names in games, or disputing bans, or even to have to police their users - they'd prefer to simply engineer their services so that such things aren't necessary. Unless this philosophy changes, there is no way - ever - that Nintendo can put together a functional online community. If you're expecting the Wii U to have equal functionality to Xbox Live, I guarantee you will be sadly disappointed, and you can take that prediction to the bank.


Icemage

[Raydeus]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

I don't know, I'm still having trouble seeing Sony including SSDs as a feature rather than a supported option.

And SSDs do help the PS3 for obvious reasons, but it's just not as noticeable as most people would expect on anything that involves BD reads. Which is why I'd much rather see them going with a globalized digital distribution model (lulz console Steam) and/or a disk solution with full install from the disk and online activation (and code sales.)

Which is also why I'd rather see the PS4 including 1-2TB 7200RPM disks than a 256GB SSD.

[DakAttack]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

Whatever reason on Earth would you have to need TBs of storage space on a console?

[Takelli]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

Whatever reason on Earth would you have to need TBs of storage space on a console?

To store all of his porn on that he will surely download, Duh.

[Cheezeman3000]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

Whatever reason on Earth would you have to need TBs of storage space on a console?

Because of all of the games going digital download. As it is now, if I had my entire PS3 library in digital form, it would definitely not fit on anything less than, say, a 500GB HDD. And now with Sony's huge push on digital media, I think a minimum of 1TB will be expected in next-gen systems. Or at least the ability, as Nintendo is supposedly granting with the WiiU, to attach any external drive you want. I'd be more down with that option if it lowers the cost AND if they allow USB3.0 so that the system can read directly from the external drive without hiccups. I know Nintendo will just stick to 2.0, but I could see Sony doing 3.0.

[Raydeus]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

Because of all of the games going digital download. As it is now, if I had my entire PS3 library in digital form, it would definitely not fit on anything less than, say, a 500GB HDD. And now with Sony's huge push on digital media, I think a minimum of 1TB will be expected in next-gen systems. Or at least the ability, as Nintendo is supposedly granting with the WiiU, to attach any external drive you want. I'd be more down with that option if it lowers the cost AND if they allow USB3.0 so that the system can read directly from the external drive without hiccups. I know Nintendo will just stick to 2.0, but I could see Sony doing 3.0.

^ What he said.

---------- Post added at 02:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:32 PM ----------

PS > Also, pr0n.

[Icemage]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

God I hope we don't get an all-download machine any time soon. With over 100 discs for my PS3, I'd be looking at probably 2TB if it were all stored on the hard drive instead of on optical media.

As it is, I'm using around 250GB out of my 320GB drive on my PS3 between DLC, game downloads, and a handful of game installs.


Icemage

[Cheezeman3000]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

God I hope we don't get an all-download machine any time soon. With over 100 discs for my PS3, I'd be looking at probably 2TB if it were all stored on the hard drive instead of on optical media.

As it is, I'm using around 250GB out of my 320GB drive on my PS3 between DLC, game downloads, and a handful of game installs.


Icemage

I'm with you. I think physical discs are here to stay for the time being, so no worries, but Sony is definitely pushing for everything being digitized as well, so we'll see how long it takes before discs go bye-bye...

[Malacite]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

Not only that, but in Canada we get fucked over badly on ISPs. If I had to download every game I buy, my internet bills would be obscene (hell they already are, fuck you up the ass CRTC)

[Raydeus]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

A retail disk with full installation (+online activation) would probably be best for those cases.

But digital distribution needs to be an option regardless.

[Feba]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

alternatively, external drives (like previously mentioned for WiiU/anybody with a hacked Wii worth two cents); disconnect them from your system, take them down to your friendly neighborhood Download Center. Hand your drive over to the employee behind the counter (or maybe even just plug it in to a kiosk), the game you want it transfered over; few minutes later presto-game-o.

[Raydeus]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

alternatively, external drives (like previously mentioned for WiiU/anybody with a hacked Wii worth two cents); disconnect them from your system, take them down to your friendly neighborhood Download Center. Hand your drive over to the employee behind the counter (or maybe even just plug it in to a kiosk), the game you want it transfered over; few minutes later presto-game-o.

That would work well with full installation disks, just like a MMOGs or Steam games you could simply install your game in any number of ways (digital download, from a friend's disk, from a gameshop disk/vending machine to an external drive, etc.) and just require an account* linked to your game codes and hardware to play the game.




* Global please, regional restrictions will only encourage piracy anyway.

---------- Post added at 08:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:27 PM ----------

PS > Oh! Remember Summer Wars (anime)? I'm thinking about something like the OZ account.

[Aeni]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

Implying that being underpowered in the graphics department makes it lackluster automatically?

I'm no graphics whore and I've been a big proponent of the Big N's emphasis on quality over quantity (i.e., good games over pretty games)

But, you have to understand, they are late to the party regarding (a) true HD and (b) 2008 graphic technology.

If Wii U can replicate the kind of graphic quality that is found in a game like FFXIV, then really, there's no need to push that envelope, because you'll start to hit diminishing returns for 1080p, assuming that's going to be the common standard for display going forward for the next 10 years.

However, if all it does is offer HD at 720p ... then all bets are off. Sure, they could probably introduce the Wii U at $199 with a hob-cob of dated technology, but that would just reinforce the stereotype that Nintendo just "doesn't get it" and this would make it less likely that 3rd party support will be there for the console.

Remember, this isn't just about Nintendo, but about the partnerships they can create and the environment that would be most friendly and most ideal for development. This has nothing to do with just pure horsepower of a console per se but if it also enhances that development, that environment, then that's something Nintendo cannot afford to ignore. If they cannot muster enough 3rd party support for the console, then it's doomed like the Nintendo GameCube was (anyone remember that fiasco?)



The key for Nintendo to continue with the success that Wii offered is to (a) expand their demographics to include "hard core" gamers and (b) attract both indie developers as well as marque 3rd party titles. While not mutually exclusive, both of these points require a beefier hardware and does require additional support for development, especially since the trend for development studios is towards cross-platform releases (e.g., FFXIII for both XBox 360 and PS3) Having a disparity in hardware will only turn developers off and you're forced to recycling your old IPs and risk "burn out" towards your platform. Afterall, you can only ask so much of Mario to sell your hardware.

[Cheezeman3000]

Re: PS4 to Launch in 2013, Xbox 720 to launch in 2014

However, if all it does is offer HD at 720p ... then all bets are off.

Nintendo made it clear that the Wii U will be true 1080p. PS3 and 360 are only 720 as it is, so at least they're improving on the current gen offerings somewhat.