Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

[Raydeus]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

Yeah, Nintendo's Wii was not a matter of innovation, but of necessity, luck and fortunately some slight insight from years of experience.

Nintendo knew they would not be able to compete with Sony and MS for this generation, just as they couldn't with the Cube before. So they went for the cheap, casual market that was being foolishly ignored by the big two. That's the insight part.

The rest was lucky pricing range for hard economic times and a gimmicky enough system to lure casual gamers who still thought Super Mario 64 was the latest game ever. So specially the kid/family market that was being ignored so much in recent console generations in favor for the actually innovative/hardcore yet kinda niche market made mainly of earlier gaming generations who grew up along with gaming technology.

So yeah... what was I talking about again? Uh... Wii... yeah, can't really be taken any more seriously than cellphone games. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing, I guess, maybe. /shrug

[Malacite]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

If we're talking about technological innovation, or even innovation in general, SEGA has always been ahead of the game.

FTFY. Unfortunately they never had enough really great games to save them until it was too late.

---------- Post added at 04:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:32 PM ----------

A Metroid that's actually good?

Woah woah woah ... WOAH. You did NOT just shit on Prime 3 and Other M.

---------- Post added at 04:36 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:33 PM ----------

This thread reeks of fanboy-ism.

It's not fanboyism (at least not on my end) so much as a deep-seated disappointment with Nintendo that's been brewing ever since the Cube. It's not that I want Nintendo to fail, far from it - but I feel like I've been largely ignored by them over the last several years looking at the majority of the software, and it only looks like they'll be trending further towards all the mouth-breathing casuals because that's where a lot of the money is right now; The hardcore gamers who've been loyal supporters for years be damned.

To me at least, it just feels like they're only tossing us the occasional bone now and then to shut us up, whereas MS and Sony continue to deliver huge blockbuster titles. Prove me wrong Nintendo, prove me wrong.

[jenova_9]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

Woah woah woah ... WOAH..

You liked Other M? >.>

[hexx]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

It's not fanboyism (at least not on my end) so much as a deep-seated disappointment with Nintendo that's been brewing ever since the Cube. It's not that I want Nintendo to fail, far from it - but I feel like I've been largely ignored by them over the last several years looking at the majority of the software, and it only looks like they'll be trending further towards all the mouth-breathing casuals because that's where a lot of the money is right now; The hardcore gamers who've been loyal supporters for years be damned.

To me at least, it just feels like they're only tossing us the occasional bone now and then to shut us up, whereas MS and Sony continue to deliver huge blockbuster titles. Prove me wrong Nintendo, prove me wrong.

The facts of the recent posts show its quite a bit of a fan boy war when this was supposed to be a FFXIII-2 thread. I would much rather see more FFXIII-2 info on here than people discussing the finer points of what consoles are better etc etc.

[cidbahamut]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

It was more about the innovation than it was about recycling IPs for moolah.

No....it was exactly the same.

[Jarre]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

The facts of the recent posts show its quite a bit of a fan boy war when this was supposed to be a FFXIII-2 thread. I would much rather see more FFXIII-2 info on here than people discussing the finer points of what consoles are better etc etc.

Well the rumour was true and I posted the linkt o the website, but it seems to have been glazed over and ignored..... Maybe the mods should just change this thread title to "pointless fan boy console bitching thread" and move the 2 or 3 relevant posts to a new thread...

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

All sequels ever are never about moving the medium forward - but sometimes that's not exactly a bad thing is it?

I mean, how does FFXIII-2, Mario Galaxy 2 and Uncharted 2 move their respective genres and the medium forward.

The honest answer is they don't.

They might be better games than the previous one, but the previous game was likely the one that did any innovation or moved the genre forward, if at all. And in this case I'd argue just barely. Mario Galaxy wasn't too terribly beyond the previous two 3D outings, I'd just say the physics were radically different and there was a wider variety of approaches to platforming, the ante constantly being raised.

Uncharted is, well, Prince of Persia for the bros. When Nathan isn't platforming, hanging from stuff and engaging in QTEs, he's shooting at people and involved in some Indiana Jones movie or Tomb Raider plot I've seen before. Sony's idea of moving the industry forward is, unsurprisingly, making them more like movies. I've seen Indiana Jones before, I don't need this game.

(Though I do agree Nathan Fillon would have been a better pick for Nathan Drake than Mark Wahlberg is for the Uncharted movie).

SE isn't far removed from that idea with Final Fantasy, they've just become too concerned with reinventing the wheel every time when minor changes to a traditional formula - a concept not terribly unlike what Nintendo adheres to with their games - is all that's really needed to keep Final Fantasy interesting and fun.

FFXvsXIII seems to be dabbling with the familiar. Kingdom Hearts style melee combat (though hopefully BBS-style) with traditional overworld maps since FFXI/FFXII-sized worlds seem impractical with PS3. Nomura is doing what works.

FFXIII sort of proved innovating the combat for innovation's sake didn't result in an RPG that was fun to play, but one that was frustration for many. I might be able to put up with that sort of bullshit, but most people clearly were not capable and that's a bad sign.

FFXIII also sort of broke the illusion of exploration FF games have been known for. Kinda like how Metroid Other M came dangerously close to breaking the same illusion. But instead of simply tagging an arrow on your radar like Metroid Other M did as a suggestion (which was borderline insulting to long-term fans), FFXIII just keeps herding you in that one direction. For the illusion of exploration to remain mostly intact, you can't herd people in a particular direction and expect them to be happy about that.

All RPGs really are linear, but its all a matter of how that illusion of non-linear play is maintained. FFXIII really dropped the ball in that regard. FFX nudged you foward, too, but you never felt discouraged about heading back in the other direction just to look around for a bit.

Also, J9, it would be wonderful if you didn't talk about games you don't play. Metroid Other M suffers from being a merely decent game in a series of awesome games, suggesting it was bad, however, is being extremely dramatic.

[hexx]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

I get what you mean kitten, but I still think the linearity of FFXIII fit the bill. They're on the run from the law in a society that has been force fed that l'Cie are the harbingers of death and destruction, so being able to explore the world at their leisure just doesn't give you that sense of urgency and survival.

And yeah a sequel doesn't HAVE to move the game forward, just the story in most respects whenever a loose end is left hanging, so long as it's tied up =P

[Malacite]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

I get what you mean kitten, but I still think the linearity of FFXIII fit the bill. They're on the run from the law in a society that has been force fed that l'Cie are the harbingers of death and destruction, so being able to explore the world at their leisure just doesn't give you that sense of urgency and survival.

I didn't mind the linearity to an extent - I did miss having full-blown towns & a world map (or at least some way of backtracking to older areas other than Gran Pulse) but as far as dungeons went, I was greatly appreciative. Exploring Dungeons is all well & good until you freaking get totally lost and have to deal with incessant random encounters while trying to find the way out.

[Khalus]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

Exploring Dungeons is all well & good until you freaking get totally lost and have to deal with incessant random encounters while trying to find the way out.

Thats like one of the best parts of exploring a dungeon IMO, especially when you start running low on supplies and it gets even more dangerous when you're near death and could lose all your progress from before you entered. Guess I'm a masochistic gamer the more I think about it, and greatly enjoy an annoying challenge than having it a walk-in-the-park. Plus I like to spend time getting my characters overly powerful and well prepared.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

I get what you mean kitten, but I still think the linearity of FFXIII fit the bill. They're on the run from the law in a society that has been force fed that l'Cie are the harbingers of death and destruction, so being able to explore the world at their leisure just doesn't give you that sense of urgency and survival.

You mean kinda like being part of a terrorist group called Avalanche, yet everyone you meet conveniently hates Shina too and joins you cause as you pursue one evil and are chased by Shinra. Meanwhile a meteor is just hanging in the sky for as long as it wants to?

I've already suspended my disbelief for more ridiculous plots.

[Raydeus]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

Sometimes I think some producer(s) at SE just throws a tantrum every time players are not satisfied with their games.

People was like call XI FFOnline instead! (Not DiV mind you.) so XII was an open world offline-MMOG like but with a battle and quest system so badly implemented most of the openess went to waste because of how painful it was just playing the game.

So then after people didn't like that so much (and after another tantrum) they completely removed the openess in favor of a completely linear experience for most of the game (meaning they probably also went over budget trying to go HD and could not afford making an open world like it was required from a game like this. Also see: FFXIV)

/tinfoilhat +1



I just hope Versus is better.

[jenova_9]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

There's nothing wrong with FFXII, mew, except the license board and the removal of using any character you want in towns. (and making all of the ninja weapons dark element and unable to dual wield!)
That has the best non-mmorpg world of all the Final Fantasies and best side quests with brilliant monster designs (the Espers are fun to find and battle too!)

[hexx]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

You mean kinda like being part of a terrorist group called Avalanche, yet everyone you meet conveniently hates Shina too and joins you cause as you pursue one evil and are chased by Shinra. Meanwhile a meteor is just hanging in the sky for as long as it wants to?

I've already suspended my disbelief for more ridiculous plots.

Pulse is WAY more confined and monitored than the world of FF7 was. The world of FF7 still had many areas of lawlessness as well as areas well outside the influence of Shinra Corp. so you cant really compare the two Kitten.

The world of Pulse was one where people were so indoctrinated that save for a select few, most would turn in their own grandmother to the authorities if she has a fal'Cie crest on them, all in the name of saving their precious little slice of heaven.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Final Fantasy XIII-2 Rumored

Sometimes I think some producer(s) at SE just throws a tantrum every time players are not satisfied with their games.

People was like call XI FFOnline instead! (Not DiV mind you.) so XII was an open world offline-MMOG like but with a battle and quest system so badly implemented most of the openess went to waste because of how painful it was just playing the game.

So then after people didn't like that so much (and after another tantrum) they completely removed the openess in favor of a completely linear experience for most of the game (meaning they probably also went over budget trying to go HD and could not afford making an open world like it was required from a game like this. Also see: FFXIV)

/tinfoilhat +1

I blame the internet, too.

Franchises tend to go the wrong way when they start taking too many criticisms to heart. You have to come to a point where you can see the points of some of your detractors, but ultimately have to go with what you feel is right rather than just giving people what they want and little else.

SE is a company that, quite honestly, should stop listening to their fans because their most ardent fanboys are the most mentally unstable people in the room - but they think they're normal.

You can tell which one they are each time SE announces new games that aren't a remake of FFVII or console installment of Kingdom Hearts. They're the ones with veins bulging out of their foreheads and think SE is a company with a handful of teams that should be making what they want instead of a company with numerous teams making as many games as they can to keep all fans happy.

I mean, damn SE for putting Production Studio 4 (aka Quest, the FFXII team) on a Tactics Ogre game. Let's not have a taste of the classic IP Final Fantasy Tactics was born from, they should just make a sequel to Final Fantasy Tactics after we complained so much about FFTA, FFTA2 and the update to FFT for PSP. Get them on that FFT game! I am a logical consumer, listen to me!

/End Malacite impression