New Zelda arrives....

[cidbahamut]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

No, it's that the Wiimote is a terrible input device. The basic technology behind it results in lag on input or sometime even missed input altogether.

[Malacite]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

Sorry, but the Wii Mote is a piece of shit.

Motion Plus helps, but as not many games use it (though this new Zelda will thank God). The thing is just prone to fucking up. Hell, it even crapped out on Shigeru during his live demonstration at E3! Don't tell me the hardware isn't faulty because it sure as shit is.

I wish they'd just stuck to the TP art style though, instead of this loopy hybrid. TP is still one of the best looking games I've ever played, period which is really saying something (and makes me wish they'd make an HD console already but they won't)

Yes, when it all comes down to it gameplay is the most important thing, but the argument that graphics don't matter, IMO, is becoming less and less valid as visuals are dramatically improving. I can't be the only one who loved the realistic, gritty (yet at the same time stunningly beautiful in some areas) artwork of TP. The Sky Dungeon with the Twin Hookshot was my favorite Zelda dungeon ever.

[Yellow Mage]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

but the argument that graphics don't matter, IMO, is becoming less and less valid as visuals are dramatically improving.

3D Dot Heroes and Half-Minute Hero each say hi. Neither are Nintendo titles.



Also, epic thread tag.

[Feba]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

Hell, it even crapped out on Shigeru during his live demonstration at E3!

That was clearly a software issue.

Is there a slight lag in the Wiimote? Why yes of fucking course there is; there's a slight lag in every controller. Laws of physics there buddy. Is the wiimote a buggy piece of shit? No. There's a lot of shitty software out there for it, but games that use it properly are just fine.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

Sorry, but the Wii Mote is a piece of shit.

Motion Plus helps, but as not many games use it (though this new Zelda will thank God). The thing is just prone to fucking up. Hell, it even crapped out on Shigeru during his live demonstration at E3! Don't tell me the hardware isn't faulty because it sure as shit is.

They said the problem in the presentation was interference, which is not impossible. Steve Jobs seemed to have that problem and they were even keen to poke fun at that while the difficulties were going down.

The impressions from the floor said the controls were quite good. So if we just look at Miyamoto's demo of it, I guess it sucks. But there are plenty of stories, videos, blogs and such that run counter to that idea.

I wish they'd just stuck to the TP art style though, instead of this loopy hybrid. TP is still one of the best looking games I've ever played, period which is really saying something (and makes me wish they'd make an HD console already but they won't)

Twilight Princess is a Gamecube game with bloom lighting. Just how low are your standards here? I happen to like cel shading because it adds a certain dreamy surreal quality that suits Zelda perfectly, seeing as they like to go that way a lot. Nintendo did not run away from the cel-shaded style, seeing as two more games were spun out of the Wind Waker style on DS.

Yes, when it all comes down to it gameplay is the most important thing, but the argument that graphics don't matter, IMO, is becoming less and less valid as visuals are dramatically improving. I can't be the only one who loved the realistic, gritty (yet at the same time stunningly beautiful in some areas) artwork of TP. The Sky Dungeon with the Twin Hookshot was my favorite Zelda dungeon ever.

The art to Twilight Princess and the in-game models are two totally different things, which isn't something I could say about Wind Waker. If Twilight Princess had that earthly, pencil drawn look of the concept art it would have been better for ir, but it doesn't really look close to that at all,

There was nothing realistic or gritty about TP's look. Had it been cel-shaded, its surreal concepts would have been better-realized.

Go find a copy of SMT: Nocturne or Digital Devil Saga - they bear that surreal quality I'm talking about. They have the qualities that Skyward Sword will likely improve upon.

[Armando]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

Is there a slight lag in the Wiimote? Why yes of fucking course there is; there's a slight lag in every controller.

This is the only issue where I can agree with Malacite. While it didn't make the game unplayable by any means, using the Wiimote for normal attacks meant sometimes they would come out late, or the game would register an extra swing. Pressing a button will always be faster and more precise. I could appreciate the motion controls in the game for other things, but not for spamming sword swings. The Spin Attack was also very inconsistent.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

This is the only issue where I can agree with Malacite. While it didn't make the game unplayable by any means, using the Wiimote for normal attacks meant sometimes they would come out late, or the game would register an extra swing. Pressing a button will always be faster and more precise. I could appreciate the motion controls in the game for other things, but not for spamming sword swings. The Spin Attack was also very inconsistent.

For Twilight Princess, yes, there was lag and it was pretty obvious.

And being a rather big Zelda fan since the very beginning there was something else about TP that stood out to me above all other games in the franchise.

It felt like a rushed port and that's because it was a rushed port. Mario was a no-show for Wii's launch, so they decided to have a Zelda there instead. They could have just left it a GameCube game, but they knew they'd never hear the end of it if this wasn't a Wii game.

There were tremendous gaps in the Wii version's tutorial, too. Apparently I was just supposed to figure out fishing and horseback combat or crack open the manual.

Oh wait, not even the manual gave adequate explanations for some of the things I was expected to do.

Shake the Wiimote to wiggle the lure and catch fish? That's what the manual said.

But it said nothing about the nunchuk, too. Nothing at all. So I'm there waggling for an hour before I give up and look it up on the internet.

Then there was saving Telma and Ilia from the raiders on boarback shooting flaming arrows at the carriage. Again, no explanation of how I'm suppose to resolve this matter. Again, I'm forced to an hour of trial and error. The Boomerang of Gales? Really? You're forcing a puzzle on me in action?

And even if I could knock back all the raiders, there were those pterodactyls dropping bombs and scare the shit out of the horses, knocking us off course and I have to start ALL OVER AGAIN.

TP's problems had nothing to do with the Wiimote. Nothing to at all. TP had a weak tutorial and bad scenario planning. Really, finding the twelve tears of light is the best way the could think of to getting me in the initial dungeons. That wasn't fun when it was the only way they could fill Hyrule Field with something. Sorry, but even as barren as Wind Waker and Spirit Tracks were in terms of over

TP's problems came from it being a GameCube game rushed on to the Wii. The Wiimote's potential wasn't even realized on this game, but rather, hampered by GameCube controls being grafted on to it. The "lag" issues were very minor.

If people are going to base the Wiimote on Twilight Princess and also without even having used Wii Motion Plus, you're headed into a flawed argument right off the bat. And, really, its pretty hard to not have a Wii Motion Plus controller right now, as they're the only way they're sold by Nintendo now. Hell, they've had three games where the Wii Motion Plus attachment was included with a game. I imagine Zelda:SS would even have a version packaged with one.

I'm looking forward to Skyward Sword because its not going to be held back like Twilight Princess was. TP was a low mark for the series in general, probably the worst game in the series if I were to rate it. Its certainly not above LTTP, Link's Awakening, OOT and Majora's Mask.

Skyward Sword also has the advantage of being five years in development, which says a lot about where this game could go. The interviews I've watched are really encouraging, it seems like they're ready to step back up and fill the overworld with interesting things - that's something that's not happened since Majora's Mask and never happened in OOT or the other games that followed it.

That's really been my only beef with Zelda - ever since fucking Epona came along the overworld has been dead. You could ride Epona in Majora's Mask, so they actually had to do something with Termina's overworld.

Additionally, it doesn't help that all the Metroid Prime games absorbed Zelda elements and actually used them better than Zelda has in the last decade.

If TP's first half had been as good as its second half, it would have been a great game, but no one should have to endure the kind of first half TP made you endure. The story was good, the dungeones were good, but its those bits in-between that were a pain and they shouldn't have been.

[cidbahamut]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

The "lag" issues were very minor.

I'd love some of whatever it is you're smoking.

They might not have been bad enough to prevent me from completing the game, but they were severe enough that I was always aware of them and irritated by it. Other games haven't been all that much better.

The Wiimote is poor design because in all instances I've encountered aside from gimmick party games(Raving Rabbids etc), a good old fashioned controller would work so much better.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

I'd love some of whatever it is you're smoking.

They might not have been bad enough to prevent me from completing the game, but they were severe enough that I was always aware of them and irritated by it. Other games haven't been all that much better.

The Wiimote is poor design because in all instances I've encountered aside from gimmick party games(Raving Rabbids etc), a good old fashioned controller would work so much better.

Then if you really were paying attention you would have known sword swings were done by accelerometers and not by the IR sensor. Bow and Arrow, Sling Shot and and Hook Shot were done by IR sensor but such was not the case if you were just Z-targeting with them. If you weren't Z-targeting with some of them, boss fights could be tricky, especially the SKy Temple boss.

Face it - user error and selective memory are all that's going on on here. There was some IR lag, but it wasn't a Wii game to start with, so I'm not really surprised. The Metroid Prime Trilogy was not a rushed port, perfect 1:1.

Personally, from what I've seen of SS, standard controls would be very limiting to what they aspire to do with the game. I'd like the sensation of using all those weapons rather than just holding a standard controller. Some of the best aspects of Wii Sports are actually right in the game and they talked quite a bit about Wii Sports Resort lending some inspiration to the project.

So if those kinds of controls are "only good" for those kinds of games, they're now also good for a Zelda game.

[cidbahamut]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

There was lag in swinging the Wiimote, there was lag in swinging the nunchuck, there was lag in the IR sensor when pointing the Wiimote at the screen.

What's there to get? A wired connection is faster and more reliable on all levels.

The Wiimote adds unnecessary delay to input that negatively affects my gaming experience.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

There was lag in swinging the Wiimote, there was lag in swinging the nunchuck, there was lag in the IR sensor when pointing the Wiimote at the screen.

What's there to get? A wired connection is faster and more reliable on all levels.

The Wiimote adds unnecessary delay to input that negatively affects my gaming experience.

And if I imagine things are there long enough, I can start to believe they exist, too..



Look, a UFO!

Some people, when looking at this photo long enough see a unidentified flying object.

Other people see the tire tread and realize its a bike tire sticking out of the water.

Now if I make it a point to be frustrated by something, its only going to stick out more and more. Instead, I either adapt or stop playing. Something I don't do is sit there wanting to have a problem with something. usually because its a waste of time and energy.

[Kailea]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

There was lag in swinging the Wiimote, there was lag in swinging the nunchuck, there was lag in the IR sensor when pointing the Wiimote at the screen.

What's there to get? A wired connection is faster and more reliable on all levels.

The Wiimote adds unnecessary delay to input that negatively affects my gaming experience.

What Wii where you playing? I have had my Wii since it came out, and never had this problem with the games that are programed properly. I say it that way because in the system menu its fine, and with Nintendo 1st/2nd party games, its fine, and even with most 3rd party its fine, but there are those bad games out there, where the controls just suck, but hell that's on every system.

[TheGrandMom]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

You know instead of the "omgz you are so dumb, Wii rockzorz!", how about helping the guy out? Cid, are you using a HDTV? Do you have good component cables? If you do, did you put the settings on 480p? How far are you standing/sitting from the tv? Where is your sensor bar positioned?

[Feba]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

Also keep in mind that the sensor bar is just a couple of IR lights. If you have any other light sources, they can cause interference. I've played my wii by pointing at the lights on the ceiling before, largely for the lulz. You can try shutting all the lights in the room off, testing it, and going from there.

I can understand people feeling a lag in the shake sensor (it's not 1:1, you're supposed to shake so that your swing finishes when you want to 'press the button' generally speaking), that takes some getting used to. But if you think the IR sensor is slow, or that wireless communications are visibly slower in general, there's probably some kind of issue with your play environment.

[TheGrandMom]

Re: New Zelda arrives....

The Legend Of Zelda: Skyward Sword Video Game, GC 10: Scorpion Boss Battle Gameplay | Video Clip | Game Trailers & Videos | GameTrailers.com

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