FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

[Feba]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

Her mother was forced to flee their home in the north and died at the train station in Midgar. She's been hounded by Shin-Ra since she was little so they could use her for their twisted experiments. Her only true love left for a mission one day and never came back or responded to her letters.

Then why the hell is she such a wimp? Generally hard life = tough character, not sissy.

[BurningPanther]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

Then why the hell is she such a wimp? Generally hard life = tough character, not sissy.

Keyword: generally. Not everyone who's had a hard life comes out of it tough as nails. Some actually become more compassionate for it.
OR generally, those sorts that listen to earth spirits are the soft type.

Take your pick, either can apply just fine.

I love it when people get emotionally wrapped up in backstories for poorly-written characters.

If you're calling it poorly written, I hope the games you're comparing it to make Hemingway, Dickens, and Wilde look like rank amateurs.

And getting emotionally attached is kind of what you do in RPGs. Your fondness for Kefka doesn't seem to be purely analytical.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

I wasn't aware Hemmingway, Dickens and Wilde made poorly localized RPGs.

Kefka doesn't talk to the disembodied head of his mother. Kefka would just kill his mother. Kefka does not derive joy from killing one cast member, he gets joy from posioning thousands of people.

Basically, he's The Joker with the god-like power to match the god complex The Joker already had. A Joker with no Batman to stop him. Ultimately, he wanted the same thing Sephiroth wanted, but had much more finesse about it.

[DakAttack]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

I love it when people get emotionally wrapped up in backstories for poorly-written characters.

I love it when subjective subjective get subjective subjective in subjective for subjective subjective.

It's hard to debate subjective topics. There's a lot more to it than what's at face value. What might have been poorly written could be excellently recieved. In video games, as in books, you still require an imagination to fill in the gaps.

[BurningPanther]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

I wasn't aware Hemmingway, Dickens and Wilde made poorly localized RPGs.

Kefka doesn't talk to the disembodied head of his mother. Kefka would just kill his mother. Kefka does not derive joy from killing one cast member, he gets joy from posioning thousands of people.

Basically, he's The Joker with the god-like power to match the god complex The Joker already had. A Joker with no Batman to stop him. Ultimately, he wanted the same thing Sephiroth wanted, but had much more finesse about it.

I can see why you like the character, madness for it's own sake is a compelling motivation.

Sephiroth, however, might be compared to Stryfe(of X-Men fame). Epic amounts of power and potential, squandered from birth, and resultantly turned against the world.
Compare to Cloud, who might be likened to Cable. Given up for lost, eventually rises above his tragedy to become something great.

I prefer my villains with a touch of depth--when they don't truly believe they're in the wrong. You prefer yours to view the means as the end. If you simply don't like the characters, that's all that needs to be said. They aren't poorly written simply because you disapprove of their motivation. The localization might have been bad, but apparently there are others that saw a depth to the story and characters that you didn't. Your condescension is woefully misplaced.

[Malacite]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

Crisis Core actually did a lot to flesh out Sephiroth a little more. Until recently, I would have sided with BBQ on the matter of Kefka vs Sephiroth (note: I still think Kefka is the best villain ever ^^) but CC showed the hero side of Sephiroth. Quite frankly, he was much better as a good guy and makes it all the more sad how he just lost his marbles. I've always said (even before DoC confirmed it) that Hojo was the real villain in FF7, the dirty meddling bastard.


Oh and you mean "mother" BBQ (Remember, he only thinks Jenova is his mother. Lucretia was his actual mother, and by all rights she shoulda been with Vincent but oh well... damn, FF7 is just chalk full of people getting bitched isn't it?)


The thing with Kefka was he was genuinely evil. Sephiroth was just misguided. That said I still rate Kefka as being far more evil for destroying the world for shits and giggles. Sephiroth has a lot more depth of character to him, but then Kefka really doesn't need a lot of explanation; like BBQ said, he's basically the Joker with the power to match his sick ego.

[Feba]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

Anakin Skywalker wasn't always evil, and basically had good motivations (wanting to save people's lives and such); but he did become twisted, and Darth Vader is a bad guy (at least, up to a point).

Sephiroth is evil. I mean, he basically planned to kill everyone to further his own goals. He might have been fueled by insanity, or he might have thought it was justifiable, but he knew he was going to hurt many people, and didn't particularly care.

He might not be "pure evil for the sake of being evil", but he's very close to it.

[BurningPanther]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

Anakin Skywalker wasn't always evil, and basically had good motivations (wanting to save people's lives and such); but he did become twisted, and Darth Vader is a bad guy (at least, up to a point).

Sephiroth is evil. I mean, he basically planned to kill everyone to further his own goals. He might have been fueled by insanity, or he might have thought it was justifiable, but he knew he was going to hurt many people, and didn't particularly care.

He might not be "pure evil for the sake of being evil", but he's very close to it.

I concur fully. By the time we see him in Advent Children(hell, by the final disk), he's pretty much evil for evil's sake. However, it only came to the point it did after Sephiroth's sanity being rent asunder by a legacy of half-truths and outright lies. He didn't start out that way, which was what I wanted to convey.

damn, FF7 is just chalk full of people getting bitched isn't it?

... which is what drew me to FFVII, I think. The boundless tragedy, the sort where no one--be they hero, villain, or support--comes out unscathed. A cornerstone of any drama, I feel.

And to throw my $0.02 on the topic itself, I very much feel as remake is warranted, but with minor rewrites. The portions of the games mythos that were left floating in the game and explored before and after simply must be addressed, and can be in a remake written to include them. Thanks to the Gameshark, me and my brother found out about the "Letters to a Mother" and "Letters to a Daughter," which I felt were a story worth telling. There was also a number of seemingly useless items in the game, such as the Super Sweeper and 1/35th Soldiers---what were those about.

These things, to include the aforementioned sequel and prequels, would do well to be tied together in a remake.

(I'm also looking forward to sneaking Cloud and Co. into Don Corneo's home with next-gen graphics. )

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

Really, after having been through most of the FFVII compilation save for CC, I'd have to say Hojo was the truest villian of the game. First and formost, he kills Lucretcia in having her bear Sephiroth for his experiements. Then, there's the experiements on Zack and Cloud, the Mako SOLDIERs and his secret developments with Deepground, amoung other things. Then a bid for his own godhood in DoC through Wiess and Omega.

[BurningPanther]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

Yeah, I reached a point where it hit me: Hojo was pretty much behind everything.

[Malacite]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

>.> BBQ gets thanked for something I already pointed out?

[Tomato_Kai]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

Ok, I think I'd like to post here because I have a slightly differing perspective on the matter.

My first FF7 game was actually DoC. I actually hated it at first, with awkward controls and bizarre level-up mechanics. Then, one day, I had no other games left to play and found myself with an entire afternoon to just sit down and beat it. And you know what? I actually enjoyed the story. I don't like how SE likes to hold any and all plot advancement until the last 30% of the game (Cough cough - FFXII is guilty of this as well) but ... in general, I enjoyed it.

Following DoC, I saw Advent Children.

...

I don't get why people still like this movie. I seriously have no freaking clue. It's like a giant freakin' cameo montage of various characters making conveniant and important plot developments at the most critical moments. It was like they lined all the entire list of characters from any of the Final Fantasy events up in a cavalcade and introduced them one at a time until the climax. And so then, how exactly does it all end? With Cloud "powering up" and killing the Sephiroth-thing. Sure, it's pretty. Very very pretty. But why couldn't Cloud do that to begin with?! You coulda saved me an hour of my life!

(Rawr. Calm yourself Mato. You're ranting. Whew. Ok.)

Anyhow. I ended up reading the entire FF7 story on Wiki following that. Some of the characters actually, you know, made a bit of sense then - which was a nice change. Still, to this day I've not played the game itself. I've just seen SE's various attempts at add-ons. Personally, I can imagine any FF7 remake, redux, or however you want to verbalize it being hugely successful. It's an enormous world.

I honestly enjoyed getting to know Vincent (or more accurately, the characters who he's surrounded by. Shelk, for instance, was rather compelling in my opinion. Vincent himself is mostly just an emo/goth loner who's really really good at jumping) and the world of FF7, but also the epic quality of the story, and the huge development it represents.

Also: It just occurred to me: What would happen if a Vincent and a Dante (from the DMC series...) mated and had offspring?

What would their spawn look like? I'm not sure I want to think about it too hard, but I imagine it would involve alot of red leather, jumping around, and epic gun battles.

Actually. It's kinda funny. Vincent is like Dante on mute.

...

I wanna go play DMC without sound now, and see if it works. XD

[Feba]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

What would happen if a Vincent and a Dante (from the DMC series...) mated and had offspring?

First of all, science would be stupefied, as they're both male. Secondly, there's a good chance it would have horrible mutations. Inbreeding is an ugly thing, I can only imagine that breeding with your clone would make things worse.

[Tomato_Kai]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

First of all, science would be stupefied, as they're both male.

Are you absolutely sure? I saw a picture with vincent without his bandana-thing. If you saw that, I don't think you'd be so confident.

[TheGrandMom]

Re: FF7 Remake: Should SE Rewrite it?

First of all, science would be stupefied, as they're both male.

Didn't see Oprah lately huh?