Powell Endorses Obama

[Feba]

Colin Powell - Google News


Wow.

Video: msnbc.com Video Player

[Kitalrez]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

I notice they already spun it, the original story that appeared on Yahoo! News was by Mike Allen and Jonathan Martin, here's the actual link.

Notice that it tries to "balance" itself halfway through to blunt the impact of this thing. The problem is that the writers just use poor journalism to pull it off. You have "one prominent conservative who knows both McCain and Powell", and this is contrasted with "a friend of the former secretary of state." That's just sloppy journalism. You never run major points of an article on the unnamed sources. They corroborate or lead into your data, but they don't constitute it's foundation. Should've lead into a quote by someone who was willing to be named in the story.

But yeah, this is a pretty big deal. When a major player in your party's campaign to connect with independent voters decides the other party has a better guy, you've pretty much killed your outreach to that voting bloc. A center-right Republican party had a pretty decent chance in this election. A far-right Republican party probably doesn't. Don't be surprised if more Republicans from the center start jumping ship if McCain's poll numbers don't improve. I think McCain probably lost himself this election when he worked so hard to court the Conservative wing of his party, and lost sight of the fact that most Americans aren't that conservative.

This'll be spun all over the place in the next week or so.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

I think McCain probably lost himself this election when he worked so hard to court the Conservative wing of his party, and lost sight of the fact that most Americans aren't that conservative.

The last three decades seem to tell me Americans are quite conservative.

That aside, it seems to me this is the first election I've seen in quite some time where people are pretty apathetic about both candidates and ask, "Is this really the best American had to offer for president?"

People see McCain as out-of-touch and they see Obama as a good, inspirational speak with no actual substance. The more this election has progressed in the last several weeks, the more I'm inclined to agree.

Still, its funny to see people get worked up about the president right now when god-knows-what is getting ninjaed through the senate right now. People should really be looking into it right now, because these are the people we are really giving the power. The presidency is far less of a concern right now.

[Shoope]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

The last three decades seem to tell me Americans are quite conservative.

That aside, it seems to me this is the first election I've seen in quite some time where people are pretty apathetic about both candidates and ask, "Is this really the best American had to offer for president?"

People see McCain as out-of-touch and they see Obama as a good, inspirational speak with no actual substance. The more this election has progressed in the last several weeks, the more I'm inclined to agree.

Still, its funny to see people get worked up about the president right now when god-knows-what is getting ninjaed through the senate right now. People should really be looking into it right now, because these are the people we are really giving the power. The presidency is far less of a concern right now.

I agree with you there, and it seems to be a popularity contest lately more then about the issues that we need to fix. All everyone keeps talking about is bashing either candidates, I really don't like either McCain or Obama. If people really think that we need either of these people to be president is sad, and I am sorry to see what Americans have come to. We also need to start thinking more about the issues, then who to become president, every candidate can lie and say anything just to get votes, what we really need to look at is the problems that america is facing right now.

[Malacite]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

Am I the only one who didn't see this coming? Honestly I'm not surprised in the least that he endorsed Obama. This is the final nail in the coffin.


Here's what I think is gonna happen; Obama is going to win, Mc Cain will take the high road leaving that tool Palin looking like the mountain hic (or "Category 5 Moron" as Bill Maher says) she is.


I absolutely can not wait to see his inaugural speech. That's going to be something for the ages.


Also, I really have to pity Mc Cain. If he'd had his way, he likely would have picked Joe Lieberman as his VP and we wouldn't have seen such a nasty race. But unfortunately, he had all the wrong advice from Bush's people and he's really hurt his reputation IMO. A lot of people who know John say this isn't the real Mc Cain, and I can believe it. I can't see a war hero like him having done all of this of his own volition; the Mc Cain campaign reeks of Karl Rove and others. Well, here's hoping all's well that ends well.

[Feba]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

stuff

Agreed.

The last three decades seem to tell me Americans are quite conservative.

That aside, it seems to me this is the first election I've seen in quite some time where people are pretty apathetic about both candidates and ask, "Is this really the best American had to offer for president?"

BBQ, you really ought to take your medication.


I mean, seriously, people are apathetic about both candidates? Are you living in an alternate reality where we're watching Edwards v. Romney?

Am I the only one who saw this coming? Honestly I'm not surprised in the least that he endorsed Obama.

Fixed. Malacite, you really need to learn how to modify set phrases to be appropriate to the situation. And no, I don't think anyone is really surprised by this.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

BBQ, you really ought to take your medication.

Just because I talk about my life at times doesn't mean you get to make a cowardly crack about how I live. If you want to talk about trolling, THAT is some trolling. Get some fucking tact, please. It won't be funny when age visits you and you have to depend on meds to get by for a condition you have. It will happen, maybe it already has.

I mean, seriously, people are apathetic about both candidates? Are you living in an alternate reality where we're watching Edwards v. Romney?

You're the one who's bought hardcore by any media you see. I'm the one that talks politics with RL people and not just little kids on the internet who can't vote, yet think they know the will of the people and the working man. People who work 40, 50 or more hours a week like I do have a bit more to say than the kids on the internet do. They have families to raise, bills to pay. The ones I know aren't enamored with either option.

Shit, I did a write-in for the last three elections. Clinton vs. Dole sucked, Bush vs. Gore sucked, Bush vs. Kerry was even more epic fail. And people were passionate about voting for them, much to my chagrin. This time, I'm slightly interested in both candidates, yet most the people I meet aren't. Maybe I'm destined to be the opposing viewpoint, but if the people aren't happy, I can't say my confindence in our proccess is excatly solid.

But then, I've known for years that we have several problems and corruptions in the electoral system. I've witnessed the government of NC deny the Green Party a spot on the ballot, ignoring thier votes and petitions alike. I witnessed this as a reporter for a newspaper. Voices going unheard.

I can't wave flags for democrats and republicans when that happens, I can't be happy when those two sides work together to silence the voice the people are supposed to be allowed to have.

Hate to break it to you, but once you actually get out in the world, things about politics won't be so black-and-white anymore. And no, a part time job doesn't count as real life.

Fixed. Malacite, you really need to learn how to modify set phrases to be appropriate to the situation.

Take your own advice.

[Feba]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

Just because I talk about my life at times doesn't mean you get to make a cowardly crack about how I live. If you want to talk about trolling, THAT is some trolling. Get some fucking tact, please. It won't be funny when age visits you and you have to depend on meds to get by for a condition you have. It will happen, maybe it already has.

Bahahahaha. You do realize I have no clue what your personal life is like, nor do I care, right? That you take medication of any sort is news to me.

I'm the one that talks politics with RL people and not just little kids on the internet who can't vote, yet think they know the will of the people and the working man.

Really. So in this 'real world' where people are completely apathetic to politics, have they completely forgotten about the huge crowds that each side is drawing to rallies, the HUGE ground game being performed by one of the campaigns (look at Obama's recently released Sept. fundraising figures, not to mention read some about their volunteer effort, and tell me that those people are apathetic)? Have they not SEEN the way people act at these rallies? Because yesterday, as you might have read, I went to a rally. It was in the real world; at least as I define real. That might be a correct definition of real, though, as Palin has pointed out recently, 'real America' is only represented by small towns. I might well be living in an unreal or fake America.


To the point, though, 75,000 don't show up, wait in line for hours, walk for miles, and shove themselves through a crowd just to get the chance to listen to someone speak when they're apathetic about them. That's what I saw yesterday.

People don't devote themselves to making calls and knocking on doors when they're apathetic about their candidate. You can see this clearly in the contrast between the campaigns' ground game, if you bother to look around.

HUGE amounts of newly registered and early voters don't show up out of apathy. They show up partly out of hard work in GOTV efforts, but also because people want to vote this time.

Maybe the people YOU talk to are apathetic, BBQ, but they are clearly not representative of the country as a whole.

Take your own advice.

OH BOY, BASELESS CRITICISM!

Two can play at that game! BBQ, google what an apostrophe is.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

Bahahahaha. You do realize I have no clue what your personal life is like, nor do I care, right? That you take medication of any sort is news to me.

You could have made any smartass comment toward me, but you chose me and "You really to take your medication." You didn't pick those words at random.

I went to a rally. It was in the real world; at least as I define real. That might be a correct definition of real, though, as Palin has pointed out recently, 'real America' is only represented by small towns.

...

To the point, though, 75,000 don't show up, wait in line for hours, walk for miles, and shove themselves through a crowd just to get the chance to listen to someone speak when they're apathetic about them. That's what I saw yesterday.

Oh, a rally. Here's a cookie. Your 75,000 is just as good as the people I meet day to day who pay attention to the news, read the internet and get involved in thier own communities.

You want to talk about campaign donations, then don't look at how much is being gained, look at who it is coming from. Its not you or Joe Shmoe. Money is a voice, even to democrats, and they are just as easily sway by special interest groups as any other politican is.

HUGE amounts of newly registered and early voters don't show up out of apathy. They show up partly out of hard work in GOTV efforts, but also because people want to vote this time.

Early voting is for the naive and uninformed. If you vote early to just go to vote for president, please do us all a favor and don't vote at all. You should be looking rather closely at what the senate and house have tried to ninja into law while the media has the people wound up about Obama and McCain. You should be taking it down to the wire here. It is critical to what what our senate, house and local government are doing in these last few weeks.

Things like the Shawn Bentley Orphan Works Act of 2008. Whether things like this get passed or not is signifigant, but how the people we put in office have voted for these things should also matter. You should take time to consider your views on such matters. Follow the votes and, if you can, follow the money.

And this is just one example of many trying to get passed into law while you're not looking. While you're at your Obama rally listening to the same bullshit about change when the same old song is going on in Washington. A song a president cannot change by himself.

[Feba]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

You didn't pick those words at random.

"Take your meds" and variations thereof are not uncommon. It's a joke. As in "You're acting CRAAAAHAZY!". If you think I know what pills you take or why you take them, you're paranoid.

Your 75,000 is just as good as the people I meet day to day

Uh. No, it's not? You meet some people who watch the news and read some stuff online. They're apathetic about the candidates. They do not represent America as a whole. Perhaps where you live, people are far more conservative than the average American. This would explain why you think America is a conservative country, and why you think people are very apathetic about this election. When you look at things at a national perspective, though; read about the experiences of people in various parts of the country, especially battleground states, and such, you see that's simply not the case.

You want to talk about campaign donations, then don't look at how much is being gained, look at who it is coming from. Its not you or Joe Shmoe.

Not so. I read something earlier that of the $600 million something Obama has raised, nearly $200 million of it is from people donating less than $200. Compared to the maximum donation amount, that shows a lot of people who are not loaded and donating the full amount supporting money through donations.

And yes, I do hear Regular Joes talking about their donations frequently. Especially when McCain or the RNC does something dangerous or offensive. Palin, for example, drew in ten million dollars for the democratic ticket, compared to one million for her own. I've heard plenty of people outraged about the Ayers attacks channeling that anger into donations of time and/or money. The idea that the campaign is fueled by special interests is laughable; all the special interest money in the world still wouldn't translate into the huge grassroots volunteer effort you see in the Obama campaign. Your claims of apathy are silly and unfounded in terms of reality.

Early voting is for the naive and uninformed.

Or those who are well informed and have already made up their minds. Really, there is no good reason not to vote early if you're certain of who you want at this point. If all of what you've learned about your candidate and his opposition so far hasn't turned you away from your party, the chances that anything new is going to come up is very low. There are plenty of perfectly valid reasons to vote early, and unless you're unsure who to pick still (which would require you to be naive and uninformed) not much of a reason to put it off.

Even if early voting WERE a bad thing, however, your claims do nothing counter the large amount of enthusiasm in the election right now.

You should be looking rather closely at what the senate and house have tried to ninja into law while the media has the people wound up about Obama and McCain.

Yes, we know. That Congress is abusing the lack of media scrutiny and focus right now doesn't mean that people are apathetic about the race-- if anything, you're proving that people DO care about the race and the candidates to the point of it being excessive and neglectful, a claim I wouldn't argue against. That doesn't mean that the presidential election isn't still hugely important itself, however.

[Shoope]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

I am sorry Feba, but I have to agree with Omgwtfbbqkitten it seems like you are just taking the medias side and not looking at the big picture or of the people around you. Who the hell care what the polls say? Or the news papers say? etc..Its all just dumb and retarded if you ask me. I just think this whole thing is turning into some kind of game to "Americans". All the candidates especially Obama, keep being repetitive about what they are saying at rallys, they say "we need change" we need this we need that.


OK, stop telling us what we need and start telling us how you are going to do it OK? Don't keep spitting the same shit, that you have keep spitting, this election crap is getting so old, I am just over the whole political aspect of it, its nothing but a rat race turning horribly wrong.

PS. Feba, I could careless about this race, who wins, or anything that has to do with it, both candidates suck, and I feel like we are going to be doomed no matter who wins.

[Kitalrez]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

The last three decades seem to tell me Americans are quite conservative.

No, I actually disagree with this statement. If you look at the registrations from 2004, like USAToday did, you'll see that there were almost as many people registered as Independent as Republican. (There's about a 13 million difference in favor of the Reps, v. 72 million Democrat). That was at the worst stage of the Bush years, when you either really really liked him, or you didn't. Wiki the "Politics of the United States" if you want to see that chart reprinted.

I think you're citing the Battleground Poll, in which 60% of Americans were defining themselves as conservative. That's a useful poll, I guess, since it is bi-partisan and they check everything. I'm just not sure it's useful for proving that someone is a particular affiliation, rather than just considers themselves such. Its more effective, IMO, to look at what Americans actually do, rather than what we say we're doing. (Like Iraq... look, we're winning, and we went in to liberate the oppressed people!). If you look at how we've voted, Carter and Clinton shouldn't have had a chance based on how people defined themselves. Democrats shouldn't hold the majority in Congress, either. Most telling, people shouldn't be ready to lynch their own Congress people over the Stock Market Bailout. If you looked at the polls taken when that was announced, this was not a very conservative nation. If you look instead at legislation enacted, court decisions, and election results, we're looking way more like a Moderate nation. Perhaps at best center-right. Even that result could be seen just as slow correction for the big left gains from FDR and the Kennedy/Johnson era.

What I think has happened is that we've moved beyond ideology politics and more into issue politics. You define yourself based on your stance on a particular set of hot-button issues, and end up agreeing with whatever side supports your view on that. For instance, see how many of your friends are against abortion, but in favor of socialized medicine. Who wants their own taxes lowered, but doesn't see anything wrong with slapping another tax on Bill Gates or Ted Turner? If you ask questions like "Should the US regulate the stock market?" or "Should prisoners have rights?", I suspect you'll get opinions that are a little bit in the liberal side, and a little bit in the conservative side. There aren't a lot of us who are wholly one side or the other on every single topic. Take me, for instance. I'm for socialized medicine. I like higher taxes for the rich and corporations, (even though I used to own a corporation). I oppose the war in Iraq. I think the govt should regulate more industries and was really stupid for deregulating the ones it did, like telephones, TV and air travel. I don't care how many people AIG employs or how much money it put into the economy, these people should rot in jail and the company should be broken up and sold off. I support gay rights to the point that I've joined my local GLAAD law society as an ally. I may be pretty leftist on a lot of those things, but I think our discussion on feminism in the Off Topics forum have proved I have a conservative streak somewhere, too. For instance, if you hit on a girl I'm dating, I believe I should have a right to castrate you in front of her. If you did it in the restraunt we're out at, maybe I'd like an audience at the table... Not a particularly enlightened liberal feminist view. I will rather militantly defend certain "family values".

I think you'd find that same deal wherever you looked in this country. People will probably support some liberal and some conservative causes. They'll most strongly identify with only a few causes, though. Those are what inform that self-identification on the Battleground Poll. You could be for dozens of liberal causes, but if you oppose abortion, for instance, you might still define yourself as conservative. Its how you feel on the issues as a whole, including all the really boring ones, that defines you on your politics.

[Feba]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

OK, stop telling us what we need and start telling us how you are going to do it OK?

Obama did. A very, very long time ago. Barack Obama and Joe Biden: The Change We Need | Policy Issues

I am sorry Feba, but I have to agree with Omgwtfbbqkitten it seems like you are just taking the medias side and not looking at the big picture or of the people around you.

Then simply, you're not paying attention. The fact that you actually claim ignorance to candidate's policy (both candidates have been talked quite a bit about policy, did you even watch any of the debates?) is another great example of this. I do pay attention to those around me, but not to the point where I sacrifice my ability and desire to learn about how OTHERS, unrelated to my life, view things.

Who the hell care what the polls say?

Well, reality, for one. If you think that either campaign isn't paying attention to polls (as well as internal polls and canvassing), then you're just being silly. Polls give a good idea of how the race is in a place, how people react to things, and so on. They are not everything, but they're the empirical ying to the anecdotal yang of stories and opinions people have concerning the election.

[Malacite]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

No, I actually disagree with this statement.

As do I. Bush got elected because the man has a mouth and is a damned fear monger. The odds of actually dieing in a terrorist attack are what, 1 in a million? I forget the exact figure but it's pretty damned unlikely. What's happened to the national debt is far worse than 9/11 (yes you heard me right. I'm not trying to trivialize that horrible day, merely put it in perspective). In fact, the retard Bush has played right into their hands;

These people aren't stupid. They know they can never physically destroy America. But they can sure as hell fuck with people's minds which is exactly what has happened and gotten the USA into a terrible economic crisis. You want to deal with this shit? Start with getting the hell out of the Middle East and securing the ports and borders. Less then 1% of incoming cargo is inspected!!! (though I'd attribute a lot of that to the Mafia paying people to look the other way) And then there's the BS with the airports...

Then you've got the Mexican drug cartels... there's enough shit going on at home. Let the rest of the world deal with their problems. Of course, had the god damned Oil companies not gained so much influence over the years expanding America's dependancy on foreign oil, well then this would all be a different story.

That's the real reason you invaded Iraq; stability in the Persian Gulf. Unfortunately, as Ted Koppel put it on Charlie Rose, if you think the economy is bad now, just imagine if all out war broke out in the Middle East. It's a god damned shame that we're only just now making progress on alternative fuels and energy. Had this been started 20+ years ago like it could have (any efforts in congress were blocked by lobyists) and Gore gotten elected and paid off the damn National Debt (Clinton did in fact leave enough of a surplus to do so) who knows where the US would be right now.

It'd be a mighty different world I can say that much.

[Shoope]

Re: Powell Endorses Obama

As do I. Bush got elected because the man has a mouth and is a damned fear monger.

Just like Obama and McCain