Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

[Raydeus]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

McCain should've picked Hillary as his VP instead, and by not doing so he lost a great chance to secure the presidency. With so many people in the US afraid of the change Obama can/might bring having Hillary would've put McCain ahead by 15 points easily. But he screwed up.

Now I can't see how any sane US citizen would vote for him.

[MrMageo]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

i think that would have hurt him in the long run party wise, and campaign wise hrc would be seen as a sell out. Although it would show his bipartisanship, but dedicated voters in either party don't care for bipartisanship.

[Feba]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

the women who will vote for McCain because of her youthfulness, family values, and conservative nature? Im pretty sure its about dead equal,

Again, there have already been polls on the subject. Check them out.

Just because it is not Obama.

Oh please. I don't think I've actually seen anyone in this thread on a pro-Obama argument. It's all been anti-McCain/Palin. There are plenty of good candidates out there that aren't Obama, he's just the one that happened to win the democratic nomination.

As to McCain/Hillary, I don't think even she's that desperate. Not to mention, with this election, McCain is banking on the right wing evangelical base-- which is the only reason he'd been holding up decently with Obama. Obama has a significantly smaller amount of democrat supporters than McCain does Republican. However, independents and moderates are more likely to pick Obama, and there are far more Democrats in general (Republican self-identification is at a low, and Democratic self-ID at a high). I don't think McCain/Hillary would've been beneficial for either one.


Also, I saw someone say that the support for Palin is almost entirely the Emperor's New Clothes, and that seems really accurate.

[Malacite]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

>_> Obama's policies are top notch IMO. And since when is drawing in tens of thousands of people to a political event a bad thing/sign of weakness? Am I the only one who finds it silly to knock the man for generating that much interest? (primarily in young, first time voters no less)

But yah, women who were for HRC aren't gonna vote for Palin seeing as she wants the opposite of what HRC's supporters do. And I told you already, those letters were all sent to CNN and reported by various staff members.

[Icemage]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

I'm just amused that the two people in this thread who are arguing most passionately about this topic are the ones who can't actually vote in the election.

There's a lesson to be learned in there... somplace.


Icemage

[Feba]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

Not really. It makes sense that people that can't vote would try to inform and persuade those who can, so their opinions might have some reflection in the election.

[MrMageo]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

feba, polls, newscasts, newspapers all have one thing in common, they mean jack shit. They are compiled in a biased manor 90% of the time.

Lets ask this question

What do you think of Feba

I dont like him much, He is pretty ignorant sometimes
I like him, he is very ignorant sometimes

Same fucking question say to other people oh we have an ignorant person on DiV some people like him some don't but they all agree he is ignorant.

See the flawed magic of your so called lovely polls.

Lets examine a sample poll question.

Would You show support for Palin.

No, I think it is terrible that someone would just pick a woman for a vote.
No, I don't like her policies, but I also dislike the way she came into it.
Yes. I like her policies, but im more focused on JM, it was kind of rude way to go for a womans vote.

See now we can have CNN or someone come along and say well 50% of the people on this poll won't be supporting her, but 100% agree it was a bad tactic for a womans vote.

Like seriously, do you think at all before you post?

Malacite: They are not Obamas Policies they are his parties policies. (Ie. his advisors and such from his campaign banged those home) He may support them, but they are definitally not his.

[Feba]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

MrMageo, your arguments have already been made and answered. Again, check out the links. I'm not talking about a single article, or poll, or column. I'm talking about looking at the big picture and seeing where things stand. I'm talking about listening to people on the street and seeing where they stand.

For information on 538, see FiveThirtyEight.com: Electoral Projections Done Right: Frequently Asked Questions, Last Revised 8/7/08 ; you might also be interested in PECOTA - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia which is another system worked on by the same guy. Politics and baseball are radically different games, obviously, but it still goes down to the math.

For the specific poll about Palin, from Rasmussen, see: Rasmussen Reports™: The most comprehensive public opinion coverage ever provided for a presidential election. ; questions aren't combined like you suggest at all, at least not by anyone worth paying attention to.
______________________________
Something interesting I just found out about:

From Palin's acceptance speech:

And I championed reform to end the abuses of earmark spending by Congress. In fact, I told Congress -- I told Congress, "Thanks, but no thanks," on that bridge to nowhere. If our state wanted a bridge, I said we'd build it ourselves.

What actually happened: Alaska ends plan for 'Bridge to Nowhere' - Politics - MSNBC.com

Palin supported the bridge, until it become unpopular nationally and the amount Alaska would have to pay for the bridge nearly doubled.


You'd think that someone could make it more than 10 minutes into their nomination before they had to lie about something.

[Malacite]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

Malacite: They are not Obamas Policies they are his parties policies. (Ie. his advisors and such from his campaign banged those home) He may support them, but they are definitally not his.

And thus the final proof that you are speaking out of your ass. Obama's policies were all outlined on his website long before, and actually the other candidates were stealing ideas from him.


And wow I didn't know she supported it originally >_> soon as the media gets wind of this...

:D buh-bye

[MrMageo]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

LOL its politics if you don't lie you don't deserve to be there. The party the wins is usually the one who can tell the most believable lies. Which is the dems fault usually they suck at lying.

I don't like political news, it always has a spin, same with polls, and surveys. 90% of the time it is geared with a bias. Sure there might be some that pop up from time to time but with increasing rarity.

Polls are used to sway the opinions of voters. People think hmmm people like this guy maybe Ill listen to his lies a bit. Then another few weeks down the road a poll is done that favors the other guy so the sway voter says hmm must have missed something people seem to like him more now.

In the states the bias is much more open as both sides have their respective media outlets, CNN gobles up the information and displays it unilaterally but doing so only helps make the case for the bias. Instead of showing just 1 spin they show two, and it comes down to the sway voter thinking...Hmmm both are about even, so my vote doesn't matter guess ill just go golfing that day.

However in Canada our main outlet of news (the CBC) is pretty well useless, and with uselessness comes no bias, since we really only have one dedicated political channel it becomes a free for all, heck even our papers skip out on alot of political events, burying them in the back pages. Which is why we end up with minority after minority until someone fucks up so bad we need to give a party 10 years to make things right. (usually the liberal party gets that honor).

News media is the biggest joke in political races, they just beat around the bush and feed people with biased information on a constant basis, about every thing.

Obama is to young, McCain is too old, HRC is the ice cold hand of satan... etc etc etc, they play these meaningless bias' until it becomes embeded into peoples minds. With the only way out being changing up the strategy, then they work on something new. All the while, people generally just do not care overly that much about it, what they really wonder is why are my tax dollars (in McCains case) being spent on an attack add, that I can watch on fox news on a never ending cycle every day.
______________________________
Malacite: You do know that his campaign staff is made up of other politicians who essentially write his book for him. Sure some of the stuff may be his, but all Obama really brings to the table is his personality, the rest is done behind the magical blue curtain of the democratic party (including nomination-campaign branches.)

[Feba]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

Polls are used to sway the opinions of voters.

Of course. That doesn't mean that they aren't also good tools that can be used to glimpse the election. If you want to stick your fingers in your ears and go "NANANANAAAANA I'm not listening", that's fine, plenty of people do that in politics, but don't act like you have any clue what you're talking about. Read the FAQ. It's not perfect, but it's about a thousand times better than you claim it to be.

CNN, do you even watch CNN? CNN is biased just like every other major news network, they don't just put things out there and let people decide. Maybe you're thinking of C-SPAN. CNN has a bias to the right. Just look at Glenn Beck or whatever other talking heads they have now. I have laughed out loud watching CNN. Not nearly as often as FOX, but still. I've taken to NBC, since they have more of a left-leaning bias (if I have to listen to news with bias, it might as well not be bias that grates my ears. If I want opinion pieces, I'll read the opinions of people that matter) and C-SPAN (which is pretty much straight-from-the-horses'-mouth)

[MrMageo]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

I know for a fact CNN does not lean right, some of the reports and sections maybe but its about a 50/50 slant. I suppose I do go NANANANANA why because polls are fucking useless. If people seriously gave a shit, they can read the parties platform on the internet like I do. Then make a decision on the facts, not some BS media spin or person upfront talking.

[Pai Pai Master]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

I'm just amused that the two people in this thread who are arguing most passionately about this topic are the ones who can't actually vote in the election.

There's a lesson to be learned in there... somplace.


Icemage

By the time you can actually vote, you've come to find that it's generally not worth giving a fudgemonkey about.

[Malacite]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

Malacite: You do know that his campaign staff is made up of other politicians who essentially write his book for him. Sure some of the stuff may be his, but all Obama really brings to the table is his personality, the rest is done behind the magical blue curtain of the democratic party (including nomination-campaign branches.)

The Dreams of my Father: Published Aug 10 2004

The Audacity of Hope: Published Oct 17 2006


Both before he launched his candidacy. Pwned!


And Feba I'm fairly certain CNN leans a bit to the left if anything, but they are still the most reliable news network (It used to be MSNBC but then Russert died...) They are credible though. FOX is just a joke though, dear lord I can't believe anyone takes that network seriously (particularly when they kept spreading the muslim BS about Obama and then wondered why he refused to appear on their network)

But don't take my word for it. Just listen to Sean Hannity or Bill O' Reily for a few minutes (if you can even last that long. Colbert does such a good parody of him though XD)

[Feba]

Re: Palin announced as Republican VP nominee.

And Feba I'm fairly certain CNN leans a bit to the left if anything

I know for a fact CNN does not lean right,

Again, go watch Glenn Beck, and the conduct of any number of their other talking heads. Unless they changed in the past two months when I stopped being able to stand them, they're biased to the right.

EDIT: And no single network will ever really be reliable. You're always going to want to get multiple angles on the important stuff; in recent memory this would be of course picking Palin, as well as things like the situation in South Ossetia, or China's olympics bullshit.