High Def format war

[Caspian]

Well, I'm a pretty big BD supporter, despite my general hatred for this damn format war we're in the midst of. (Bad grammar, I know, never end a sentence with a preposition, I dont care.) Basically Universal is the only studio giving exclusive support to HD-DVD, while BD has Sony, Disney, Pixar, I think MGM, and maybe one or two others. Basically, if Universal starts giving support to BD, then this whole mess will go away and we won't have to put up with this crap.
If you want, you can email Universal here and ask them to start supporting BD.
If you're not convinced that BD has a strong upperhand and doesn't deserve to win, then click here. Ending the format war is best for all consumers. I really hope ya'll read this, and email Universal with the request of supporting BD (in a calm and intelligent manner).
Thanks for reading this.

-Caspian

[Pai Pai Master]

Re: High Def format war

Studio Canal, one of the remaining few HD-DVD exclusive studios recently went neutral. As you said, Universal is the only remaining major HD-DVD exclusive studio, with a handful of smaller studios like the Weinstein Company.

Personally I believe Universal will go neutral next year. HD-DVD is in an obvious decline and Universal seems to be it's only major supporter; there are more BDs coming out this month than there are HD-DVDs this entire year.

With studios like Buena Vista and 20th Century Fox getting into high gear with BD-exclusive content, the already unstable competition between the two formats is likely to grow into something far more one-sided.

[Raydeus]

Re: High Def format war

*Hugs the PS3*

I can't wait to get a new 1080p display.




Btw, when you say calm and intelligent does that mean I can't tell them "ZOMG u n00bs every1 knows BluRay > HD-DVD !!!1"?

[Icemage]

Re: High Def format war

I'm a mild Blu-ray supporter. Things are looking good for an end to the format war soon.

*also hugs his PS3 and his 5 Blu-ray movies*

HD-DVD can bite me. Lower bitrate and storage is not a good trade for lower player prices.


Icemage

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: High Def format war

Honestly, I still don't see this bizarre need to move up from DVD. Shifting formats every 8-10 years - especially when streaming and digital distribution are catching up so fast - is not smart business, nor is it progressive.

Keeping media content bound to plastic discs and ribbons should have died out long ago, yet here we are still buying "advanced" stone-age formats. But Hollywood and corporations lining politican's pockets to pass legislation - in addition to restricting how we recieve content through the internet - has much to do with that.

Beuracracy at its finest. They still want us to buy stuff at stores at a higher price when we have the means to get it for less now.

[Effedup]

Re: High Def format war

If I HAD to choose between one format and the other, I'd prolly go Blu-ray. The larger disc sizes are probably going to secure it's place in terms of the future, although I've read somewhere (don't remember at all now, maybe gizmodo) that the HD-DVD consortium is working on a higher capacity version that will be backward compatible with established HD-DVD hardware. If that all goes down, who knows?

Personally, I think anyone that's adopting either technology now is foolish. I mean, if you have a 360 and decide to get the HD-DVD player add-on, that's one thing...you're only dropping $200, so if the format ends up going south in a couple years, bfd...it was only 200 bucks. If you buy a PS3 you've got blu-ray technology for less than a stand-alone player, and if THAT technology goes south, you've still got the higher capacity discs for gaming. You're not really losing out either way.

We sell the Blu-Ray and HD players where I work, and every other day I find myself talking to a customer about the new formats, and I always tell people the same thing...to wait. When I was a kid, some of my friend's parents went out and bought Laserdisc players right away, spending thousands of dollars on the hardware alone. I bet they were pissed 3 years later when they realized they basically threw their money away.

This whole format war is bullshit anyways...the VHS format was around for 20+ years before they started pushing DVD's, and up until a few years ago VHS tapes were still not impossible to come by. It wasn't until DVD players dropped below the $100 mark that they really became the dominant format. If the studio's really wanted to secure their place in future markets, it'd be really simple...drop the price of the next-gen players to the $100-$200 price point and take their losses now...they're just going to make it up on the discs (BD and HD discs both hover around the $24.99 price point, and it can't cost more than $2 to make one). If the hardware prices were more reasonable the customer base would jump all over it, and that would pretty much end the format war. Besides, I don't know about anyone else's experiences, but the first-gen DVD players were a big, glitchy mess. I have no reason to believe BD and HD players are going to be any different. Hell, you should have saw the crap I went through setting up an HD-DVD display...we're talking 2 hours of farting around with settings until I could get the stupid thing to put out 1080p via HDMI and DTS over optical. I'd get video setup and lose audio, then get audio setup and lose video...then the res would downgrade itself from 1080p to 720p for no reason at all...I wanted to drop kick the stupid thing, but my boss was watching so that prolly would have been a bad idea anyways...

Long story short, don't play into Hollywood's games. Give BD and HD the finger and keep on trucking with standard DVD. By the time prices are reasonable, the winner will be apparent.

[Pai Pai Master]

Re: High Def format war

Honestly, I still don't see this bizarre need to move up from DVD. Shifting formats every 8-10 years - especially when streaming and digital distribution are catching up so fast - is not smart business, nor is it progressive.

Keeping media content bound to plastic discs and ribbons should have died out long ago, yet here we are still buying "advanced" stone-age formats. But Hollywood and corporations lining politican's pockets to pass legislation - in addition to restricting how we recieve content through the internet - has much to do with that.

Beuracracy at its finest. They still want us to buy stuff at stores at a higher price when we have the means to get it for less now.

There's certainly no need to shift formats yet. As Blu-ray and HD-DVD supporters, we're basically doing the dirty work for the average consumer; I certainly don't expect either format to be important to the everyday person for another 2-3 years at the least. That said, I'm 100% convinced that Blu-ray is the better choice. As Jei said, the specs of the disc are clearly better. Even then, the price is generally better. Blu-ray discs are getting cheaper in stores (they're actually the same price to produce as HD-DVD now, and getting cheaper), and more and more HD-DVDs are coming in those annoying combo DVD formats, which just drive up the price anyways (and one of the biggest reasons HD-DVD is starting to falter). Warner's Total-HD isn't going to solve anything because very few high-def consumers support both formats, and no one wants to buy a BD/HD-DVD combo disc for $45 when they could buy a BD for $24.99. Blu-ray players are starting to get cheaper so HD-DVD is losing its greatest advantage. First-gen BD players, while not as high-quality as the PS3, are hitting the $599 mark themselves, and the 2nd-gen Samsung player is debuting at $799 instead of the expected $999.

Blu-ray's certainly surpassed HD-DVD in sales as well, with the format constantly outselling its rival at a 3:1 ratio since the middle of January. I love and support my BD, but I wouldn't run out and tell everyone I know just yet to go out and buy a new 1080p-HDTV and start buying Blu-ray discs out the ass. I'd love to do that, but not yet, DVD's not done. However, I can certainly say that with a 1080p display at my disposal, it's nigh-impossible to bring myself to purchase a DVD these days. Unless it's from Universal or it's a TV-DVD that's taken this long to hit retail, I either buy it on Blu-ray or wait for the impending Blu-ray release. It's just way too hard to go back after buying 10 BDs already.

As for glitches, Effedup, DVD players didn't have the luxury of firmware upgrades. While the hardware in the units will always be the same (the PS3 reads discs decades faster than any other Blu-ray or HD-DVD player out there currently), the first Samsung players had a noise-reduction problem that seriously hindered the image quality, which was fixed with a firmware upgrade. With PS3 and the latest BD-player playback pretty much flawless, it's safe to say the experimental stage of high-def players is done with and now it's just a matter of the players getting even higher quality playback and, of course, getting cheaper.

[Eohmer]

Re: High Def format war

*Hugs the PS3*

I'm so jealous!

Btw, when you say calm and intelligent does that mean I can't tell them "ZOMG u n00bs every1 knows BluRay > HD-DVD !!!1"?

lol

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: High Def format war

If the studio's really wanted to secure their place in future markets, it'd be really simple...drop the price of the next-gen players to the $100-$200 price point and take their losses now...they're just going to make it up on the discs (BD and HD discs both hover around the $24.99 price point, and it can't cost more than $2 to make one). If the hardware prices were more reasonable the customer base would jump all over it, and that would pretty much end the format war.

This is a risk Sony can't really afford to take with Blu-Ray. Aside from thier games division and PS3, Sony has been on very shaky finanical grounds for years. Its not totally by choice they keep PS3 and Blu-Ray players at such high price-points, they pretty much have to sell them at that price to break even. Cutting the price to appease consumers now would destroy Sony.

Of course, this begs the question - Why push the format war in the first place?

Insanity mixed with a huge spoonful of arrogance, that's why. That's business as usual at Sony these days.

[Pai Pai Master]

Re: High Def format war

Aside from thier games division and PS3, Sony has been on very shaky finanical grounds for years. Its not totally by choice they keep PS3 and Blu-Ray players at such high price-points, they pretty much have to sell them at that price to break even.

Personally I'd have to disagree with you there, Sony's become extremely successful outside of their games division lately. They've been #1 on the HDTV market for the last couple years, and in 2006 they had the most #1 box office films. They don't even break even on the PS3 at its $499/$599 price point. Sony was taking a $200-ish loss on each unit before launch and it's probably still around a $150 loss on each unit now. It probably won't be until later this year that they can sell PS3s to retailers at cost, and I don't think they expect to start turning a profit on hardware until late next year.

Aside from the PS3, Sony doesn't have much else of an effect on the format war. Their stand-alone Blu-ray player is around $999 and they're obviously pushing the PS3 in the market more than that. They do, however, have a lot to gain, as the success of the PS3, their film division, and their HDTV/electronics division could all be boosted by the standardization of Blu-ray.

[Murphie]

Re: High Def format war

There's certainly no need to shift formats yet. As Blu-ray and HD-DVD supporters, we're basically doing the dirty work for the average consumer; I certainly don't expect either format to be important to the everyday person for another 2-3 years at the least.

I have to agree with you there. I honestly don't care one way or the other with regard to High Def media, and I'm content to let other people test it out at a high price point.

[Caspian]

Re: High Def format war

Actually, Toshiba and MS are going to be putting out <$200 HD-DVD players this year. Sounds good, but problem is that its a HUGE loss per unit for the manufacturing companies. Player quality drops through the floor and its hard to get companies to even make them.
We're still in the early adopter stage of this whole thing too. Only people really buying them at this point are the ones who absolutely must check it out right now. I bought a PS3 both for the gaming aspect, and for the BD capabilities. I have yet to be disappointed. I also really like how the BD player remote is Bluetooth. Not something huge, just a nice touch.
As for setting up everything on the BD player part of the PS3, complete cake. It auto adjusted to 1080p when I got my new tv last week, and changing to an optical audio output took all of a minute. I've had zero problems in getting it to run properly.
Only re-bought two movies I previously owned on DVD, and I'm keeping the movies I'm buying on it right now to those that I don't have and are visually impressive enough for me to want to see them in 1080p (Sorry Hitch).
Nielsen polls are showing BD to be massively outselling HD-DVD as of late, and based on current projections they will probably overtake them in overall sales by the end of this month or sometime next. (Sony is saying they already have, but I'm disinclined to believe something that is most likely bad wording of a PR statement.)
Pai also hit the nail on the head in reference to the firmware upgrades. You nolonger get a bad player that can't be fixed, unless its an actual hardware problem. Both HD-DVD and BD players had big problems in the early month or two of release, but firmware upgrades have turned even the early players into pretty nice and very capable machines.

Btw, when you say calm and intelligent does that mean I can't tell them "ZOMG u n00bs every1 knows BluRay > HD-DVD !!!1"?

Yes, but only if the change the spelling of n00bs to nubs. It sound more professional.

[Pai Pai Master]

Re: High Def format war

How's your new TV, Caspian? What is it? I just got mine a couple weeks ago and I can't remember life before 1080p.

[Caspian]

Re: High Def format war

Samsung 56" DLP. Heard good things about Samsung, and so far I'm not disappointed. Beautiful picture, even on normal tv. Previous big screen was only 720p, so this is godlike. Really wanted a 56" Sony Bravia, but 5k is a little out of my price range. What kind did you get?

[Pai Pai Master]

Re: High Def format war

hehe, I grabbed the 50'' version of yours. They're really fantastic, aren't they?

Funny story, I went nuts looking for it on the night I was ready to buy. I was planning on buying it at Bestbuy with a 12% discount coupon I had, and it turned out most stores were lowering their stock on them, probably in preparation for the new 2007 models coming out soon. I went to about 5 different BestBuy stores that night before giving up, and I stopped by Circuit City as a last-ditch effort just to see what they had.

Turns out, they had the exact TV I wanted sitting there as an open box item at $800-off the retail price. Needless to say, I was pretty darn happy. I would have loved a Bravia myself, but these Samsung DLPs are definitely the best bang-for-your-buck.