Processor Upgrade - Need advice

[Doppelganger]

Originally posted by sandman53


The problem with those is the fact the the FSB is low....you would get better performance from and 800 FSB than a 400 or 533....and the ECS board doesnt mention what kind of AGP it has...and the Pc chips only had 4X.......i guess they are ok if you are on a budget though.......

what the hell are you talking about?
533fsb can support ddr400 (not dual channel, but then again, most boards don't have that, even the 800mh ones), and it can support dual channel ddr 333 and rd 1066 memory.

4x agp vs 8x agp isn't a big deal right now, specially in most games. the extra bandwith is just wasted because no games need it.

i have a p4 @ 2.53, 533mh fsb, rd 800, and ti 4200 64mb version (the source of why my score is this low). i get 3400 on high, 4400 on low. if you plan on getting a good graphics card (9600pro, 9700/9800), then this will let you play games for at least 2 years, in decient quality too.

japan, get a decient cpu/mobo (if you got the money, a 865 or 875 p4 board +ddr 400 in dual channel). KEEP YOUR VIDEO CARD, IT IS THE BEST PART OF YOUR COMPUTER.

[Booola]

Thanks for the help... here's the motherboard/cpu I'm thinking of getting http://www.bzboyz.com/store/product1312.html any thoughts about that combo? I'm also curious about something else. I'm planning on getting a Radeon 9600pro 128mb, but this http://www.dvcentury.com/Merchant2/m...96-230-9601and a few others are listed as such on pricewatch. This doesn't mention anything about being the pro model, and it's listed under that. Am I missing something? = p

[Rubik]

With the Via chipset, in order to get the ATI card to work correctly, you will need to download some drivers for your mobo. This is really easy and the instructions for doing this were in the manual for my Radeon 9600 Pro. Just make sure you do this before you install the video card (or at the very least, before you install your video card drivers. I forgot and installed the video card first - the only problem I had is that my AGP was stuck at 4X until I got the 4 in 1 drivers installed. According to ATI there can be more drastic results.

The other thing is that the mobo you indicated has kind of a funky memory card setup. You can use 2 sticks of either 168 pin DDR RAM or 184 pin SDRAM (the older kind) of memory but not both. Go with the 184 pin and remember that you only have 2 slots open. Also, the best memory you can get is 333MHz. This is called PC2700 RAM and is a little slower than the latest and greatest. I am running PC2700 and it is fine.

You also only get 2 USB ports so you may need to get a USB hub or card at some point - those are cheap though.

As for the card, I would definitly get the PRO (there is a 9600 PRO and a 9600). I am not an expert on vid cards unlike some here but the PRO makes a huge difference. The PRO is a gamer card, the other is not so much.

This is a pretty basic board but if you get the 9600 Pro video card and a decent amount of memory (I would get at least 512MB) you should be pretty happy with the system you have.

[Booola]

I have one more question =p. Since I wouldn't be able to use both types of ram simultaneously with this motherboard, I couldn't use my current 256 pc133 sdram with the new 524 pc2700 ddr i would get. I see that people recommend getting two identical pieces of ram to run faster. So would my 256 actually do more harm than help anyways?

[Kitta]

So you all know, 800mhz fsb is not necessarily better than 533mhz fsb. 800mhz pretty much means "hyperthreading enabled."

I ran the ffxi benchmark in two modes on a p4 2.6 w/hyperthreading, 2x256mb corsair twinX XMS LL, an abit is7, and a Ti-4200 64mb video card. These tests were done on windows xp, sp1 (hyperthreading enabled).

Modes:
1> 800mhz fsb, ddr 400 (dual channel enabled)
2> 533mhz fsb, ddr 400 (dual channel disabled)

* All other configurations remained constant.

Results:
Mode 1: 3300 +/- 4 pts (ran tests a few times each)
Mode 2: 3330 +/- 4 pts

As you can see, hyperthreading actually has created a performance decrease in FFXI. This has been documented in other tests as well - there's an overhead cost in using hyperthreading. So, for FFXI a 533mhz fsb should perform just as well (perhaps a little better) than an 800mhz fsb. Of course, the 800mhz fsb will outperform the 533mhz fsb on most windows applications (explorer, office, etc..)

[Rubik]

Booola -

Well, the 256 you have is better than, say, no memory at all . You will be able to play with 256 of PC 133 but I have a suspicion that the weakest spot in your PC will be the memory. Not only do you have less memory than I would recommend (there does appear to be a performance increase with 512 vs 256 from the tests I have done) but the memory speed is an issue as well. My PC actually benchmarked higher with 512 of PC3200 RAM than with 1024 of PC 2700. Not only will the lower amount of memory hurt you, the slower speed will too. I'm not sure just how much of an effect this will have on your benchmark but I think it will be visible.

My first suggestion would be to assume bigger and faster is better. If you have $50 to spend you can pick up 512 of PC 2700 or 3200. You won't be getting 'top of the line' memory for this price but I think it will do the job. You get what you pay for with memory so the more you can spend the better. Corsair is a good brand of memory if you want to spend a little more.

If you are trying to avoid spending money, try your 256 of PC133. The only way you'll know if you're happy with what you have is to give it a shot.


Kitta - Good observation about the 800MHz. From what I understand you only see a gain from HT if your application supports it. But you don't necessarily have to have an 800MHz system for HT (although anything else seems very uncommon). My 533 mobo says it supports HT, though I had not heard that there were P4's that supported HT at 533. Maybe there aren't ant the board is BS. I have never really cared enough to look

[jzhang]

the only p4 i know that has HT and ran at 533 is the 3.06GHz P4... and yes it does exist, not made up

yes right now HT will pretty much benefit only from Windows XP with SP1, i can just mash on my multimedia keyboard to start programs like winamp and icq etc. when i startup windows... and trust me they load much faster than normally do

[Kitta]

Looks like I should perform a bit of research before I post. I'm surprised to find that, in fact, 800mhz fsb is not synonymous with hyperthreading.

Sorry about that.

Well, at least my benchmarks make their point: 800mhz w/ hyperthreading is not superior to 533mhz for FFXI.

[Booola]

I understand to get bigger and better at all costs. I was planning to get at least a 512 pc2700 anyways. What I mean is should I spend a little more on a motherboard that allows both types of memory at the same time so that I could use my old 256 along with my new 512? If the performance would barely increase, I won't bother.

[Rubik]

I am not aware that such a mobo exists. Even if it does I wouldn't bother. Memory is cheap enough that the cost of such a board would probably be greater than another 256 of PC2700.

[Booola]

haha alright, thanks for all the help. no more questions