The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

I'm just more intersted in seeing what comes of FFXIV and DCU Online, as they have writers behind them that I very much love getting stories from and teams with ideas that interest me.

I totally appreciate what EVE tries to do, but I've sworn off MMOs til FFXIV and DCUO arrive.

[Shirai]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

selective reading

Red mage is still one of the more wanted jobs wether it be in endgame or an exp party, red mage lost only a little aspect of the job it wasn't designed to do anyway.
You keep whining that SE ruined red mage and the game mechanics.
I got some news for you;
You're not the 2005 Ranger, you're not the 2003 Dragoon, Red mage isn't the new Puppetmaster, so get over your hissy fit and eat it or level another job.

Come back when SE really puts a nerf on the job so much it makes worthy of calling lolrdm.

There is no need to change my main argument, we're done talking.

[ShadowHolyFlyingDragon]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

Well, Relic Weapon owners did not get passed up on the Trial of Magians.

Yoichinoyumi can go as far as 96 base damage +25 Racc +15 Ratt. It takes about 2 trials to get there. The final one is: 2000 aquan type creatures with Namas Arrow on the finishing blow.

loooooooooool

Yeah, the trial I want to do requires me to kill fukkin mobs during fire weather. My final bow will be called Bateleur and can come in at 80 damage +6 STR +16 Ratt. So, for a free bow I just simply have to work for, that's ok in my book.

Something tells me though, the new weapons are hinting at Dynamis-esque style of upgrading; with, I'm sure, a few little nasty twists to make you possibly /wrists.

I've never talked to the weather check more in all my life on here in 8 years...... /facepalm.

Back to smashing crawlers~~~~

[Feba]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

loooooooooool

Honestly, that's par for the course.

They're relic owners. They live on doing repetitive shit to an absurd extent.

[Malacite]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

They're relic owners. They live on doing repetitive shit to an absurd extent.

Eh, I don't see that as a valid excuse for SE's bullshit relic trials. I would think that they've put in enough fucking hours on the damn things.

Some of us have a life you know. Owning a relic doesn't have to contradict that.

I'm semi pissed about how you get the Empyreans, but at the same time relieved; I just had to cancel my trail for Kurodachi and am now working towards Radenotachi (which becomes Masamune, as do the rest of the +DMG weapons)


Did some playing around with the new stuff, can't say for sure what the exact bonus is but holy crap Magic Burst Bonus is just pure win. So is the XI update, as our COR tonight in Limbus popped an XI Wizard's Roll. 10 mintues of MAB +16? BOOYA! Dude on BG said he manged Burst II (I think on birds in Lufaise?) for 1.6k normally, but a massive 2.7k on MB - that's just pyschotic. Can't wait to see what it does to Tier V.

Sengikori is reportedly 35% SC damage and 25% MB damage, with SC Bonus being 8% SC damage. That last one's a bit weak but oh well.

Lastly, oh man I can not wait to get my hands on those Elemental Staves for BLM. SE actually fucking listens; they all have unique names (thus can be macrod) and have a whopping <element> Affinity: Magic Damage +4 Magic Acc +1.


HQ staves are 2/2. This means these new staves give a 1.25% MAB modifier! Coupled with Tier V nukes and that's some sick damage...

[Firewind]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

To be honest I think I'll wait until FFXIV. I can forsee another population hit to FFXI as people go to FFXIV and WoW (Honestly I can see Blizzard releasing Cataclysm at around the time FFXIV comes out regardless), maybe Aion if we ever get the 2.0 patch since the US/EU version of the game is badly outdated and needs the new 2.0 content. How long before the population goes back to FFXI depends on the content of those games really.

I for one have no intention of going back to FFXI or giving Cataclysm more than a token trial upgrade peak to see if they finally un-nerfed Rogues (unlikely and since Rogues are the only thing about WoW that interests me I'll probably just wait for Diablo 3). FFXIV interests me as something NEW, a fresh game with a fresh start and not something that has been stagnant for the last 5 years. If FFXIV took Aion's approach towards levelling (Solo very possible and doable in a reasonable time and encouraged if you can't get a group. Group much better and more encouraged since you can really rake in the XP if you know the good camps and how to farm instances) so it's actually possible to consistently achieve things and have a life I don't think I would see a reason to to back to FFXIV. That would be especially so if they keep international servers so there are always people to group with no matter when I'm working or when my lectures fall (Australian, German, Polish and mature US and UK players tend to be the nicest people you can play with too).

[Karinya]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

This change had nothing to do with the community (as you can tell, they're pretty upset by the nerf)

Only the people who are upset are bothering to post about it, so everyone who posts about it is upset. That doesn't say jack about the actual community, only about the community of whiners. Same thing happens with every update.

But there are tons of mobs people don't actually melee against, and in those situations, Rdm/Nin, Nin/Rdm, Nin/Drk and Pld/Rdm were great tanking jobs.

For every player who tried to tank with any of those combinations, there are 4-5 BLMs, SCHs, or RDMs not trying to tank who got their faces ripped off every time they slept an add. You do know that people actually cast those spells for their effects, right? They're not purely Provoke substitutes?

While I can understand wanting to keep Pld as *the* best tanks, there was absolutely no reason at all to nerf the hate on Black Magic spells used for tanking.

Except that they are also used for crowd control, and BLMs' biggest beef since forever has been getting their face ripped off every time they crowd control mobs because those spells have *too damn much* enmity.

You know who else wasn't meant to be a tank? Nin. But they're still pretty good at tanking. You know who was meant to be a tank? War. And they suck at tanking. You know who made a great tank? Rdms. But they got nerfed in their ability to tank. You know who did get an ability to help with tanking? War. But they still suck at tanking.

And you know this because of your day and a half of extensive testing with post-update WAR tanks? WARs who don't come to the party prepared to tank suck at tanking. And right now, that is most WARs. But asking most RDMs to tank (pre-patch) would have at least as horrible an outcome, even if there are a few who are good at it.

SE has been trying to bring back WAR tanking for a while now. Players are very hostile to the idea (while simultaneously whining about a tank shortage!), but I'd suggest getting used to it.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

Some of us have a life you know. Owning a relic doesn't have to contradict that.

I'd wager owning a relic has a high correlation with being unemployed.

That or who has fewer scruples than other players, just look at the correlation between relic owners and the Jan. 22 2009 bannings. Quite a few got caught.

To be honest I think I'll wait until FFXIV. I can forsee another population hit to FFXI as people go to FFXIV and WoW (Honestly I can see Blizzard releasing Cataclysm at around the time FFXIV comes out regardless), maybe Aion if we ever get the 2.0 patch since the US/EU version of the game is badly outdated and needs the new 2.0 content. How long before the population goes back to FFXI depends on the content of those games really.

Personally, I think Cataclysm is going to be where WoW loses people, because they're castrating the world and its lore in its entirety to rebuild it around new content. In fact we could consider this week the Cataclysm update, but for CoP. Just because that sounds ambitious doesn't mean its a good idea.

Really, its going to be strange to people that play FFXI in the future that there are level 75 mobs in a zone that has a level 30 BC fight. I think they're going to feel cheated of what were some interesting battles, just like how new WoW players are going to feel cheated of lore and quests based around the original world rather than the Cataclysm world.

[BurningPanther]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

Only the people who are upset are bothering to post about it, so everyone who posts about it is upset. That doesn't say jack about the actual community, only about the community of whiners. Same thing happens with every update.

So what are you trying to say?

"The only players that ever have a problem with anything are forum goers."

"If you are not expressing discontent on a forum, you must therefore be indifferent to or pleased with the progression of events."

Is that how it works?

I've met plenty who play the game without ever having set eyes on related forums, and have across-the-board opinions about every update. It's not simply the few who frequent forums that can be or are discontent, they're simply the ones you're aware of.

Conversely, there is an equal, perhaps greater number of people, on forums, expressing contentment. Using the Black Magic spells enmity nerf as an example, there are forum goers pouring from the cracks expressing spiteful glee to see RDM lose anything. Is it the case that people expressing said contentment are a vocal minority as well?

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

RDMs act like this is the biggest nerf to ever hit the game.

No nerf tops 2005's Ranger nerf - where the main job was crippled and left crippled for the better part of a year and a half. It was a nerf where the central purpose of the job was destroyed, completely and utterly. This job was not just nerfed, it was punished and left broken so other melee jobs could benefit.

RDMs want to cry to me about changes to enmity on spells? Try food and gear not factoring into your job's specialization for a year and a half, try investing gil in a job like that. RNG was supposed to be THE most accurate job and the game and food and gear bonuses were not being factored, our best weapon skill and even two hour was missing the target.

And you know what? RDMs aren't even complaining about the underutlization of their MAIN FUNCTION - enfeebling.

No, you are not a jack of all trades. Back when RDM truly was a jack of all trades, they weren't worth inviting. They could only do what WHM and BLM could do and not do it as well as those jobs did.

RDM was specialized in enfeebling and enhancing to address this and given spells and skill ratings to compliment those functions. But want do RDMs use those enhancements for?

To play a fucking White Mage and then they have the gall to complain about something they willingly accept invites to do. This is why no one respects RDMs when they come out to raise an issue. You guys get invited to parties to perform this function. You painted yourselves into that corner.

You took the colibri PT invites knowing full and well that enfeebling magic wasn't doing any good on them.

And then you fueled so many other jobs with merits that now other mobs aren't worth enfeebling and we can just burn through those, too.

The RDM community took their specialization and sacrificed it, and now you want to cry to the rest of us about some little fringe element of the job few RDMs embranced and endgame LSes exploited at the expense of PLDs? You're complaining about tanking when you've changed the community so drastically with your healing skills that they're now too powerful to need your specialization.

That's not what happened to RNG. We just had some scorpion arrow bandwagon RNGs exploiting the fact Sidewinder was totally ignoring mob defense. In other words, people who were doing the job poorly could outdamage any melee job and the good RNGs got that put effort into their gear and used the best ammo got punished right along with them.

And then they were left broken for a very long time.

Last I checked, RDM enfeebling and enhancing still actually works, you've just powered up other jobs so much your specialization as waned in EXP parties. Maybe if SE ramped up mob defense again and brought back SC/MB parties you could do your job and raise your skills with ease.

But people are likely to complain about anything they can't burn now so good luck with that.

[MrMageo]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

Red mage is still one of the more wanted jobs wether it be in endgame or an exp party, red mage lost only a little aspect of the job it wasn't designed to do anyway.

You know in that AV video, ya that RDM/NIN is tanking AV.

I don't get all the QQ though. All SE has done is put us on par with NIN tanks, and slightly behind PLD tanks. Instead of focusing on spell rotations, we will have to cheat cure and crap like PLD's do. Or spam en2's to build CE. Its not like we can't tank, we just got brought back down, because well we were the fastest to cap hate, and took the least damage. Tht on top of all of RDM's other quirks, is a liitle much. That is why the Nerf becaue a good RDM tank outclassed PLD on nearly every mob of interest, and that ain't right. But then again it ain't right RD outclasses WHM, or SCH out classes BLM, or PUP outclasses us all.

[Chromemage]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

I hate to derail any current convos about the update for my personal needs...

but

1) OF COURSE THE RELEASE THE $#*@'in update when I'm out of town.
2) How long did it take you guys to get the full update on PS2?
<s>3) How is the limit break quest?</s>

Super, super excited to get Knights Minne V.

[Truece]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

3) How is the limit break quest?

It requires trading 5 kindered seals to the Nomad Moogle in Ru'Lude Gardens while having at least 3 merit points.

The moogle will take your KS AND your merit points, but raise your level cap to 80!

[Ziero]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

How?

I'm not sure of the exact set up, as I didn't build it, but rather we just rent the maze from the goblins. All I know is that it involves birds, VT-IT mobs, and something that halves exp per kill but greatly boosts exp reward at the end. I easily walk away with two merits after three runs, if not moreso. And that's going in capped in the mid-50s, uncapped things would be even faster, and with a proper TP burn it would go even quicker then that. The Exp bonus at the end is even higher with Cor roll and someone popping an Exp ring.

I too would like to know. Also would like to know if MMM can be duoed or trioed and the like.

I doubt these runs can be duo'd/trio'd as they involved VT-IT birds of all types, including things like Cocktraices, Greater birds and Hippogryphs. Though I heard mention of ways to build it for Blms to solo through though. My guess is that it would involve amorphs and something to make them higher level.

You must do different MMMs to every other player on FFXI.

Apparently not seeing as someone else made the rune and put it up for rental.

Only the people who are upset are bothering to post about it, so everyone who posts about it is upset. That doesn't say jack about the actual community, only about the community of whiners. Same thing happens with every update.

That is the worst logic I have ever heard. Only whiners complain so if something happens you don't like and you complain about it you're instantly a whiner?

For every player who tried to tank with any of those combinations, there are 4-5 BLMs, SCHs, or RDMs not trying to tank who got their faces ripped off every time they slept an add. You do know that people actually cast those spells for their effects, right? They're not purely Provoke substitutes?

Really, I didn't know 4-5 Blms, Schs or Rdms chain casted Blind, Bind and Dispel regardless of whether they took effect or not. Because you do realize that for the most part the only spell that caused those jobs to get "their faces ripped off" was sleep...and most sleeps still produce the exact same amount of hate.

Except that they are also used for crowd control, and BLMs' biggest beef since forever has been getting their face ripped off every time they crowd control mobs because those spells have *too damn much* enmity.

Sleepga hates have remained unchanged, as have Blu Sleeps and Repose. They didn't nerf Sleep/Sleep2 hate to help Blms with crowd control, they nerfed it to kill Rdm tanking. Your comments are completely invalid. Blms will still get massacred doing crowd control.

And you know this because of your day and a half of extensive testing with post-update WAR tanks? WARs who don't come to the party prepared to tank suck at tanking. And right now, that is most WARs. But asking most RDMs to tank (pre-patch) would have at least as horrible an outcome, even if there are a few who are good at it.

...you really think giving Wars a crappy shield boosting trait will suddenly make them viable tanks? Really? You're grasping at straws because a single War is a terrible tank. They have been for the past five years on anything past level 40. Unless you can tell me what HNMs you solo tank on war. Because I'm not talking about silly little exp parties here, or things like voking a mob just long enough for the rest of a party to tear it apart before the voke recast is even up again. I'm talking about mobs that actually take longer then a minute to kill.

Rdms tanked some of the most dangerous monsters in the game, something only Pld could do. Mobs where you can not, in any way shape or form, melee the monster for hate, and had to do everything you could to avoid and prevent the mob from actually hitting you. Any event a War could 'tank' in, any other melee job could do just as well if not better. But the events Rdm tanked in were literally fights where you had all of two...maybe three...options.

SE has been trying to bring back WAR tanking for a while now. Players are very hostile to the idea (while simultaneously whining about a tank shortage!), but I'd suggest getting used to it.

Howso? A shield boosting trait? What war uses shields? It'd be like relying on Guard or Parry to tank. Though to be fair, both mnk and sam have much higher ranks in those skills respectively, and even have other ways to mitigate damage in combination with those skills. Oh and they can use them without completely destroying their DoT hate gaining abilities. Or perhaps you mean Retaliation...the defensive JA that doesn't actually do anything defensive. I mean, it's fun to use in TP burn parties where you're not moving around and can take a hit or two, but against anything big it's only going to get you dead fast. Ooh, ooh, I know, you actually mean the Balestarius, that kick ass looking Gaxe with the Damage reduction right? Except for the fact that it's virtually impossible to get and in all the time since it's been out I've only actually seen it once....on someone who transferred from a different server. So please, do inform me as to what actually useful steps SE has been taking to make War a better Tank? And I don't mean merit/TP burn exp party tank, I mean as a job that can tank something actually dangerous.

SE has said it themselves, they openly admitted to not knowing how to make other jobs viable tanks. They see Pld as the blood tank, Nin as the Evasion tank and can't think of any other way to have another job tank effectively.

RDMs act like this is the biggest nerf to ever hit the game.

Rdms aren't the only ones hurt by this change btw.

[Chromemage]

Re: The Version Update Has Arrived! (06/21/2010)

Seems like the majority of QQ has to do with SE attempting to get jobs back to doing what they were "intended" to do, and what people have become accustomed to over the years don't like that one bit.

Yep, no doubt RDM sticks out in that respect.