Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

[Aksannyi]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

So, how bout those whm adjustments, huh? >_>

I took my WHM to the Chiropractor. They adjusted my back, my knees, and my shoulder blades. Hurt like hell when it was happening, but damned if I don't feel like a brand new cure bitch.

Musta thrown my back out from raising my right arm so much in casting white magic, he said. Psh. Like he knows what I do all day!

Dumb "doctors."

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

The thing is, trolling is allowed on BG, and often, it's encouraged. There's an entire forum dedicated to spam. Trolls trolling trolls. There are some threads which are monitored and cleaned up (the relic thread comes to mind) but most threads the mods pretty much leave alone.

He might actually fit in. O.o Briefly, anyway.

Tekki might jump all over him if he posts his BS in the relic thread, but elsewhere, I'm pretty sure plenty others can take care of it. BG is not for the faint of heart, that's for sure. I get most of my "lulz" there these days. Which I guess is kinda sad, but, well, I spend three hours in Dragon's Aery every day, what the fuck else am I supposed to do between windows?

I think in BG's case it just got to the point where if they did something about the trolls, all you would have left were the handful of people that actually tested things. At a certain point the amount of trolls just got so overwhelming that they just couldn't manage all of it.

At the very least, it keeps them going and they have cannon fodder for donations.

Of course, I don't begrudge BG for not having a plan against this sort of behavior, I don't think they initially planned to be the endgame resource for FFXI as much as it ended up being. But when it did, all the trolls and no-lifers came out of the woodwork.

But I have better things to do than amuse myself with the fodder over there, I can play DS while camping windows. Not that I want to camp them to start with, but if I have to, I'm gonna get something else done while I do it.

------------------------------------------------------------------

Going back to the WHM update, I think its a really interesting twist on the SAM and SCH concepts. Rather than ape SCH's deisgn, they just took the Light Arts and Dark Arts concepts and applied them to spells directly. Instead of supplying charges, the situation WHM finds itself in will power up other aspects of the job when used properly.

From what I've read of it, though, I don't think Solace will be providing Stoneskin effects to cures that are that potent, nor do I think they will overwrite the Stoneskin itself. If SS is already active on someone, they will just likely get the cure effect until the real Stoneskin effect wears off. The SS effect on Cures will most likely scale to some decree with the cures as well.

I don't see a Cure IV or V exceeding the 250 Cap or even matching it, though. That would be rather broken. I just see it coming in some ratio to the base cure caps themselves.

Overall, I think this gives WHM a nice, strong distinction from RDM and SCH in terms of healing while not taking an immense amount of ground away from them.

[Yellow Mage]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

So, how bout those whm adjustments, huh? >_>

White Mage for Healer, '09! <_<b

[Yellow Mage]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

From what I've read of it, though, I don't think Solace will be providing Stoneskin effects to cures that are that potent, nor do I think they will overwrite the Stoneskin itself. If SS is already active on someone, they will just likely get the cure effect until the real Stoneskin effect wears off. The SS effect on Cures will most likely scale to some decree with the cures as well.

I don't see a Cure IV or V exceeding the 250 Cap or even matching it, though. That would be rather broken. I just see it coming in some ratio to the base cure caps themselves.

The way I read it, the Stoneskins will "not stack with nor overwrite" other Stoneskin effects, as in, it'll keep the current Stoneskin in tact, but won't add to it, either, solely recovering already lost HP.

I could have sworn that the words "short duration" were there as well, so even if high-tier cures matched or even beat the Stoneskin spell(s), it wouldn't make a difference unless you're fighting something that could tear through that much HP that fast in the first place, anyway.

[WishMaster3K]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

...I can play DS while camping windows. Not that I want to camp them to start with, but if I have to, I'm gonna get something else done while I do it.

I've been thanking, hell, AGREEING, with BBQ a lot lately. Must be something in the water.

I blame the lead.

---

I only hope that the comic was made in jest and doesn't turn out to be a self-fulfilling prophecy about RDMs. Holy hell, maybe "charges" or similar concepts is the new wave of the future? If it can work for WHM, maybe it can work for RDM.

(Every successfully landed enfeeble results in a pool that can be used to increase the potency/accuracy for a spell of your choosing? I see this working good for Gods, because the pots and other fodder that exist outside their teleports. Also, for those HNMs that have random mobs spawned in their romping grounds..)

I don't care about RDM Solo. I don't care about RDM Nuking. I don't care about RDM Melee. For all that is holy in the name of Altana, I stopped meriting on anything that wasnt a Troll because I couldn't enfeeble.

I'd love something that would give us a snowballs chance at enfeebling end-game. Seriously... Slow and Para sticking on a HNM and still being Potent would save a lot of shadows, MP, etc..

RDM Specific Enfeebling-Seal? Explaining how the hell INT and MND and Magic Accuracy work? Have EnSpells count as "Antenna" for spell strength (I'd live with Enblizzard on)?

[Mhurron]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

I'd love something that would give us a snowballs chance at enfeebling end-game. Seriously... Slow and Para sticking on a HNM and still being Potent would save a lot of shadows, MP, etc..

Seriously, this.

And damn people, you're going to give Taskmage carpal tunnel or something.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

Well, I think RDMs should be looking at this update with cautious optimism.

There's still a chance they won't get much this update, but when SE does get around to them, it will probably be a good one.

I was just going over the interviews over on JP button recently and I think this update is going to potentially focus on SMN, BST and RDM as well. There's a good chance SMN will get another pact adjustment based off what was said, something to prevent pacts from failing was mentioned.

So WHM for certain, SMN strongly possible. BST and RDM? Who knows. Just give my BST some new jugs to play with and you can put RDM ahead of BST for an update for all I care.

Have EnSpells count as "Antenna" for spell strength (I'd live with Enblizzard on)?

Interesting idea, but without some ability or second tier enspell to apply it to, SCH could just AoE it on everyone. And technically, we already have something akin to it via Storm Spells, as they give you those chance weather bonuses.

[Raydeus]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

<---- Zero optimism, nada.


Speaking of enfeebling, that's one of the reasons I enjoy soloing so much (and many mission/quest fights.)

But yeah, I miss the time of IT+ killing when RDM's main job was to actually weaken the mob.





PS > Is optimimism like a +1 version of optimism? Like Optimism-ga and stuff.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

Raydeus is a strange one. Not enough time to play, but plenty of time to take forever soloing something.

I think in some cases that gimping enfeebling is fair in regards to endgame. Some mobs should be resistant as hell to things or we end up having RDMs cripple them to the point of being a joke.

That said, I think since DNCs enfeebling Steps always land if their accuracy is up to par that RDMs should have some series of unresisted enfeebles. And the Tier II line should have a far better chance of taking effect given the MP spent for them.

Perhaps something along the lines of Dia and Bio is in order. The damage of these spells can be resisted, but the secondary effect never is.

Or some ability that lets RDM merge a nuke with an enfeeble for a better chance at getting an enfeebling effect off. RDMs always like to downplay nukes, but any unresisted Tier III nuke is still a good one.

[Raydeus]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

Technically I have a decent amount of free time, problem is it's mostly divided in chunks of an hour or two at a time. I mean it's great for playing PSP games and soloing (or posting on a forum), but makes xp parties and end-game events pretty much undoable.

[WishMaster3K]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

BBQ, what mob types/families aren't covered by jugs, if any?

[Malacite]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

Quite a few actually... (not counting mobs you can't charm)

Lady Bugs, Colibri, umm... I know there's probably several more but I've got other things to do atm.

[Yellow Mage]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

Or some ability that lets RDM merge a nuke with an enfeeble for a better chance at getting an enfeebling effect off. RDMs always like to downplay nukes, but any unresisted Tier III nuke is still a good one

You make a few good points, but this isn't one of them. There's a reason us Red Mages downplay nukes: we're better at practically everything else other than nuking, enfeebling included. Maybe in a backwards world where Red Mages had a better nuking skill than Enfeebling skill, but even in such a world, we'd be talking Black Mage right now.

Unless you meant something like Bards adding their Singing skill to their instrument skills to whatever their singing, but that's a weird case to begin with . . .

I think in some cases that gimping enfeebling is fair in regards to endgame. Some mobs should be resistant as hell to things or we end up having RDMs cripple them to the point of being a joke.

Except we aren't playing a one-player Final Fantasy here. This is Final Fantasy XI, where Enfeebles are supposed to be worth casting, otherwise Red Mages would be out of a specialization, and then we end up being meripo Haste whores. If something has to be unable to be enfeebled in order to be considered a challenge/not a joke, then I postulate that said mob is artificially difficult in the first place.

[WishMaster3K]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

Part of the reason that the ENTIRE end-game scenario is so skewed is because mobs are over fucking powered. Having some enfeebles to bring a mob back down to reality and having support to buff the party levels the playing field.

Now, we have super powered mobs, so we are resorting to simply, out-marathoning them.

Byakko would be so much easier if he just had some slow or paralyze stuck to him. People now fight easier mobs because they were impatient - granted, the exp is better - but I definitely remember times when if a RDM didn't enfeeble a mob, it meant death for the party.

It's like how people USED to exp - Have a couple of DDs, a tank, a buffer, and an enfeebler and all your bases are covered. Shit, most of the time, I could enfeeble and slight DD in the form of magic bursts. Sometimes I had a RDM splitting duties with me (healing/buffing) and we'd BOTH magic Burst.

I'm sure that AV would be manageable if he was just able to be enfeebled. But as it stands, to enfeeble an end-game mob, you need all sorts of gear: That you can only really get from end-game. Isn't it established that you shouldn't bother enfeebling unless you're over 320 or some shit?

I don't care about Silence. I get the fact that having a lot of these bosses silenced would remove 50% of their terror factor. But no way in hell should we be forced to fight an un-enfeebled boss.

Mammets deserve to be enfeebled. Diablos deserves it too. I could go on and on.

[Taskmage]

Re: Job Adjustments and Additions Part I (03/26/2009) [WHM]

Hang on, what's wrong with rdm nukes? I tend to nuke for ~600 on most targets and resists are only a major problem on things on the caliber of wyrms, gods and kings. For 90% of the game nukes are a perfectly valid way for rdms to contribute to a fight. In nuking certainly blm is an ace, sch a king, and pup lol a queen but that still makes us - oh how about that - a jack of that trade.