Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

[TheGrandMom]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

I don't think they are going to make it easier.

Are we absolutely sure? Nope.

I don't know, call it woman's intuition or something, but with SE's track record; they are going to f**k it up somehow. le sigh

[Cotners]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

Duration adds difficulty. No matter what you're doing, the longer you have to do it the harder it gets to do. Example, hold your arm out straight with a 5lb weight. Not hard right? Now do it for an hour straight.

One example does not make it true in all cases. Alot of time wasted on JoL is waiting around til you get though 9 sets of babies so you can actually dmg it faster then it regens. Waiting around doing nothing is not hard.

Actually the issue was to make the fights not last as long so a few choice words don't cause a mass media frenzy based on false information and create bad PR. Absolute Virtue has been in the game for three years and people regularly would fight him for 20+ hours. But no one ever reported getting sick and passing out. However one fairly small group of people goes 18 against a new mob, and the emotional rollercoaster caused by the fight, not the duration of the fight caused people to get sick and it makes headline news. This change is to prevent people from being in the news again, not to allow joe-schmo average to come to AV and have a grand ol' time.

I am going to need to remind you that only a few groups in the past have had marathon runs at AV... and they were very big news in the FFXI community. The PW thing just happened to leak and get blown out of proportion.

Oh look, I can multi quote too!

Quit argueing with people for the sake of argueing.
______________________________

Are we absolutely sure? Nope.

That's why I said 'I think'...

[Ziero]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

One example does not make it true in all cases. Alot of time wasted on JoL is waiting around til you get though 9 sets of babies so you can actually dmg it faster then it regens. Waiting around doing nothing is not hard.

So while you're waiting, nobody does anything? Or are people doing stuff while others wait? Because for the people actually killing the babies, they're not waiting around, so your example doesn't hold true.

I am going to need to remind you that only a few groups in the past have had marathon runs at AV... and they were very big news in the FFXI community. The PW thing just happened to leak and get blown out of proportion.

Plenty of people in the past three years (that's a kind of important point) have had marathon fights with AV. Hell, the first real fight with PW went 20 hours in and of itself (BtL weren't the first to go that long on him). This situation is the exception, not the rule.

Oh look, I can multi quote too!

You better be able to, it's simple as hell \(O.o)/

Quit argueing with people for the sake of argueing.

How about I argue to debate points made that I disagree with, I mean if that's all right with you.

[Caspian]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

I'd be pissed about having to buy enough quivers for an 18 hour fight, only to not beat the damn thing.
Have to agree on some sort of enrage timer. Assuming they weren't BS'ing and there is a way to do it much faster, it would be nice to not give the option to fight it for hours the wrong way, only to lose.

[LyonheartLakshmi]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

Duration adds difficulty. No matter what you're doing, the longer you have to do it the harder it gets to do. Example, hold your arm out straight with a 5lb weight. Not hard right? Now do it for an hour straight.

Not all difficulty is a good kind of difficulty. Take the classic "Track & Field" arcade/video game, where your success is based on just how fast you can repeatedly mash the same button. I found this to be terribly difficult. But I also did not find it enjoyable in the least. I have no clue why Kojima felt it necessary to subject us to such backwards gameplay mechanics in MGS with the "survive this torture session" mini game.

Rubix cubes are difficult. Obscure riddles are difficult. But those are different kinds of difficulties. I would much rather face an enemy where figuring out the solution was akin to solving the Rubix cube, as opposed trying to solve the riddle of his weakness by having to simply guess at the solution.

[Ziero]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

While I won't agree that having to solve the problem is a great way to add difficulty, there's also the problem that once it's done...it's no longer difficult. I mean once one person figures it out, how long until everyone makes use of the trick and makes these supposedly super monsters into little bitches.

However, I wouldn't complain at all if SE added some in game NPCs to give hints and clues as to how to beat them. And I'd actually applaud them if they added hints and tips that changed with each fight so even if you knew the old method, you'd need to figure out the new method to win again.

[Armando]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

While I won't agree that having to solve the problem is a great way to add difficulty, there's also the problem that once it's done...it's no longer difficult. I mean once one person figures it out, how long until everyone makes use of the trick and makes these supposedly super monsters into little bitches.

CoP 6-4 disagrees with you.

[Ziero]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

Well there's no real trick to that, sometime fights are more about luck then strategy. When a mob has a buttload of unavoidable attacks, it comes down to how often he uses them as to whether you'll win or lose.

[Malacite]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

Absolute Virtue uses Super Kamehameha.
Feba takes 1000000 points of damage.
Feba was defeated by Absolute Virtue.

Has a nice ring to it doesn't it?

How about Pandemonium Warden changes into GM Dave?

Something like 'toss this item at it while two people /dance and then pray to the various gods backwards' is so random and off the wall that you can't even consider that part of the challenge. You'd have to take every fucking item in the game, attempt to use it. Every spell, attempt to use it. Every ability.

If you don't /kneel before Odin when he readies Zantetsuken you die.

[LyonheartLakshmi]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

Now that I think about it, fighting PW is worse than solving a riddle. It's more like being asked to guess what the riddle is first, and then having to solve it, without ever getting any kind of confirmation that you guessed the riddle itself correctly.

[Cotners]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

So while you're waiting, nobody does anything? Or are people doing stuff while others wait? Because for the people actually killing the babies, they're not waiting around, so your example doesn't hold true.

I know what ppl do while the babies are being killed because I am always one of the people killing them. And yes it is a waste of time for everyone else. Even while killing babies all you do is stand up, cast a spell and then rest again until he summuns another set.

Plenty of people in the past three years (that's a kind of important point) have had marathon fights with AV. Hell, the first real fight with PW went 20 hours in and of itself (BtL weren't the first to go that long on him). This situation is the exception, not the rule.

Actually the first PW attempt was only about 7-8 hours. Get your facts strait before trying to throw your weight around.

[Daos]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

Now if only SE could find a way to remove the dumber players from its fanbase, they'd be all set.

[Ziero]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

I know what ppl do while the babies are being killed because I am always one of the people killing them. And yes it is a waste of time for everyone else. Even while killing babies all you do is stand up, cast a spell and then rest again until he summuns another set.

So you're wasting time...by killing the monster? The babies are a part of the mob. It's like saying (as 6-4 was already mentioned) the mammets are nothing but a waste of time for Ultima/Omega. The small things are part of the battle and dealing with them is dealing with the fight itself.

Actually the first PW attempt was only about 7-8 hours. Get your facts strait before trying to throw your weight around.

I said first real PW fight, the one where people knew what to expect in his form changing abilities. The first fight never got past the chariots while the second group who went at him got to the Serpent Generals.

[Cotners]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

So you're wasting time...by killing the monster? The babies are a part of the mob. It's like saying (as 6-4 was already mentioned) the mammets are nothing but a waste of time for Ultima/Omega. The small things are part of the battle and dealing with them is dealing with the fight itself.

/sigh...It's ok though, I don't think any less of you.

I said first real PW fight, the one where people knew what to expect in his form changing abilities. The first fight never got past the chariots while the second group who went at him got to the Serpent Generals.

You are right, it was the second fight I was thinking of that went 8 hrs... The first only went 3. BtL's fight was the only one that went 18+ hrs.

[Pteryx]

Re: Regarding Specific Notorious Monsters

Now that I think about it, fighting PW is worse than solving a riddle. It's more like being asked to guess what the riddle is first, and then having to solve it, without ever getting any kind of confirmation that you guessed the riddle itself correctly.

Well, perhaps what they have in mind as far as making things easier is implementing messages that show when you've done something right, rather than any cut in stats. (And I'm betting on them adding rage timers too.) -- Pteryx