The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

[Malacite]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

It was supposed to be an inventory item you could bring with you and go into the water to fish. I can see why they didn't do that though, since they'd have to greatly expand some areas to allow this and it would only just complicate things.


While very cool aesthetically, it's not a practical idea in the least. Oh well.


And yes, if enough people bitch at SE (oh hells yes please!) maybe they'll cave at some point in time and give us our long-awaited Mega Flare ^^

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

I just want my own ship with a casino below deck.

I'll give up my Mog House for one, just let me dock in any port I want and give me a crew of moogles. >.>

[Malacite]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

AH HAH! I FREAKING KNEW SE SAID SO!


http://www.playonline.com/ff11eu/top.../060330_2.html

Summoner
Currently, the trend is for summoners to only call out their avatars to use a blood pact ability, but we want to create something that will encourage summoners to keep their avatars out for longer periods of time. Also, we will adjust the abilities that avatars use so that they are based on the summoner's summoning skill. We have no plans to add Bahamut as an avatar, because we would like to preserve his powerful image. We would have to make him weaker if he became a player's avatar, and we do not want to do that. We are thinking about new avatars for Treasures of Aht Urhgan, however, so stay tuned.

EDIT: I was browsing both of those pages again and I couldn't help but notice:

White Mage
We want to make it so the white mage remains totally dedicated to keeping their party alive, no matter what. No other job should fulfill this role as well as the white mage. We also want white mages to be able to contribute to the party in a way exclusive to their job, aside from just curing. This may be accomplished by adding an ability where white mages could share their HP and MP with party members. Also, we are considering adding the effect of removing status ailments from the Benediction ability.

WTF is SE waiting for? They've done all of that except make them that much better than RDM or SMN for healing. Sure, they rock with Cure V in HNMs and other scenes, but what about EXP? RDM's are still taking their place most of the time.

Then there's the BLM comments... enough with the empty promises SE please.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

WTF is SE waiting for? They've done all of that except make them that much better than RDM or SMN for healing. Sure, they rock with Cure V in HNMs and other scenes, but what about EXP? RDM's are still taking their place most of the time.

WHM is already better at keeping party safe when fighting one monster at a time; I don't really see what needs fixing there.

If you've tanked Magmatic Eruca, you'd appreciate Cure V. As a PLD, I greatly appreciate stuff like Barfira, Regen II/III, Flash, and Haste (mainly to reduce recast for Flash) as well.

RDM/WHM has many of those tools, but not all. While SMN does have some interesting "keep party safe" ability with Earthen Ward, Spring Water, and maybe Shining Ruby, the half powered Bar- spells and limited only to Cure III means it's still a distant third.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

WHM is already better at keeping party safe when fighting one monster at a time; I don't really see what needs fixing there.

You conviently phrased it with "one monster at a time."

The problem is that WHM isn't invited as much now because PTs aren't like that. Not even manaburns always deal with one mob at a time. RDM's White Magic Side needs to be toned down, because no matter how good Cure V is, Cure IV is more than sufficent for most scenarios. SE fubared by giving RDM Tier IV White Magic, then giving us incredibly weak mobs in a future expansion.

Now RDMs are invited as healers and don't even get to do what they specialize in - enfeebling. And when you're healer, there's no hope for the melee most RDM still seem to covet.

Healing skill needs to be more relevant to its actual skill level and RDM could stand to lose some healing power, I don't think many would mind, either, so long as it didn't destroy thier soloability.

[Legal Fish]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

That link isn't too convincing considering how it isn't really "promise" nor has all the changes they list on that page have actually happened.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

You conviently phrased it with "one monster at a time."

The problem is that WHM isn't invited as much now because PTs aren't like that. Not even manaburns always deal with one mob at a time. RDM's White Magic Side needs to be toned down, because no matter how good Cure V is, Cure IV is more than sufficent for most scenarios. SE fubared by giving RDM Tier IV White Magic, then giving us incredibly weak mobs in a future expansion.

Malacite specifically said exp party, while you seem to be talking more NA merit style. Plus, I was addressing the "keeping their party alive" idea. The "one monster at time" refers to how RDM would be better if sleeper for adds/links plus healing need to be handled by the same person. If that's not an issue, WHM does a better job.

WHM is welcomed in exp parties, at least on Ifrit; I've only done two PUG's for PLD, but both of them had WHM's. (Lv.65-66.) Granted, RDM is even more welcomed, but I saw WHM's frequently in parties when I was on RDM.

JP style merit parties do use WHM's, I think. My sister's weekly Sky merit party, too. Makes me think WHM's invite rate isn't so much S-E's problem as NA players' problem.

WHM isn't broken; the player base is.

[BurningPanther]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

Not just NA merit style, it seems to be becoming the norm in general. And regardless of WHM's strong function in normal exp parties, by your logic, all this means is that opportunities would be solid up to the merit level, where they start to taper off.

Do WHMs still get parties? Yeah, of course. You'd be crazy not to pick up a WHM if there's one seeking. However, it's suddenly not so crazy to pass over the WHM if you already have 4 lolmelee, a BRD, and happen to see the RDM seeking alongside the WHM.

Is player social consciousness kind of... skewed? I tend to think so, but like with so many similar issues, it's something that is within the developers' capabilities to change.

People will continue to exclude this job over that, and exploit the functions of this job over that, so long as doing so results in the accrual of fast, easy exp. Path of least resistance. But that path won't be changed by getting up on the soapbox, it'll change when the game mechanics are.

[Akashimo]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

I don't know about completely skewed.... bone party had to be the most insane party in terms of speed/chain/making me spam regen/cures compared to a rdmx2/brd/ninx3 nyzle isle mamoo ja party I had. >_____> I got a taste of whm/rdm/brd/mnkx3 and I doubt I'd want to do anything ToAU exp related on whm... unless it involves whm/nin on trolls >:O Though both setups were good for fast exp for a party that ended shortly after starting. And its kind of sad seeing people trying to make those for long time... its just to draining and annoying to go longer than 2 hours for me in both setups. Still my favorite has to be the standard old school exp setup against Deca Weaps or Lusifue Meadows against the giant turkeys. One reason, big boom on the SC and MB ^.^ go go go thf/nin hyoton mb! Nothing more statisfing than scing and having a camp ppl would least go to =x

[BurningPanther]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

I mean skewed in the sense that the majority ruling has reached an extreme that values optimization in everything, else it's not worth doing.

"You aren't getting 20k and hour in a burn party? That's not efficient, not worth doing."

"PLD turtle tank having a place in a party? Inefficient, drop the PLD, get a NIN."

"WHM main healing? Why, when RDM+BRD is optimal for faster exp?"

"Party in Conquest areas? Nowhere near as fast as exp gain in Besieged areas. ToAU or it's a waste of time."

Some of the above statements are a touch exaggerated, but a good caricature of what it's come to.

[Akashimo]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

Yup, and usually they're wrong during packed time and people become to stubborn to change camps then insist on staying upon arriving >_>

[Malacite]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

That link isn't too convincing considering how it isn't really "promise" nor has all the changes they list on that page have actually happened.

No it isn't, and that's exactly my point. SE has yet to really pick up the ball and come through with their promises. Either that, or stop making promises they can't keep like bad(most?) politicians, and on their official website no less. And by EXP I meant from 50-75 and merits.

I have had parties where the leader said no to inviting a WHM because he wanted a RDM main heal...


The thing is Ifrit, RDM can heal just as good as WHM can for merits and even before then most of the time. What gives them the edge are convert and refresh though. They can stretch out
their MP much better than a WHM can and sleep links etc, which tips the scale in their favor all too often. That's where SE needs to step in and make WHM's more MP efficient than RDM
when it comes to healing and protecting the party. It's WHM's primary role, not RDM's or SMN's damn it.

[Kuro]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

I hate to admit, I refuse to go to Bibiki, and People just are stupid. They make a TP burn party, head off to say one ToAU camp, think its full then run off to Bibiki having no knowledge of what a party setup should be, where to go, what a SC or MB is!

I just say screw it and leave when I see people playing that bad, it’s a waste of my time. ToAU killed off experienced players and the concept of paying attention during fights. Now a robot could do the job of ToAU! Just need a RDM and BRD to pull and heal and you really don’t have to look at the screen.

[Malacite]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

I hate to admit, I refuse to go to Bibiki, and People just are stupid. They make a TP burn party, head off to say one ToAU camp, think its full then run off to Bibiki having no knowledge of what a party setup should be, where to go, what a SC or MB is!

I just say screw it and leave when I see people playing that bad, it’s a waste of my time. ToAU killed off experienced players and the concept of paying attention during fights. Now a robot could do the job of ToAU! Just need a RDM and BRD to pull and heal and you really don’t have to look at the screen.

Too true... I see so many idiots now, especially in the lower levels. Ugh, taking my DRG and SAM up were hell because everyone refused to skill chain. The gave me crap for it too - _ -

God forbid some of us actually had to learn how to play the game the right way, before the collective IQ of every server plummeted from ToAU's easy TP burns.

I love the easy EXP, but I hate the descrimination and stupidity that came with it.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

The thing is Ifrit, RDM can heal just as good as WHM can for merits and even before then most of the time.

I think you're confusing "good enough of a cure tank" with being the best at keeping a party alive.

As someone who has played PLD (66), RDM(69), and WHM (44), I can tell the difference between a good WHM and a good RDM in the main healer spot. Just Regen II/III alone is already a big boost for PLD tanking, and Flash is very helpful for keeping NIN's alive.

Granted, the differences are more pronounced at special fights, and many exp/merit party choose to trade RDM's endurance for WHM's safety, but it doesn't change the fact that WHM is pretty much what S-E said it should be.

What gives them the edge are convert and refresh though. They can stretch out their MP much better than a WHM can and sleep links etc, which tips the scale in their favor all too often. That's where SE needs to step in and make WHM's more MP efficient than RDM
when it comes to healing and protecting the party. It's WHM's primary role, not RDM's or SMN's damn it.

S-E wants this: "white mage remains totally dedicated to keeping their party alive, no matter what. No other job should fulfill this role as well as the white mage."

Look at the wording carefully: 1) The company does not want to give WHM substantially new role(s). 2) It says keeping the party "alive", not keeping the party "going".

WHM is all that already; what many player are whining about is going beyond S-E's parameters and make WHM a better endurance healer. That was never S-E's intention, I think.

This is why I disagree with the assertion that S-E isn't keeping the promise for WHM.

* * *

I'd agree with assertion that the promise to BST was not kept, though. I'm just not sure how the dev's can fix BST's Leave-to-rest-pet issue without making other players angry about reversal on MPK fix. Plus, that MPK patch made EM conversion a lot easier for Lv.35+.

There's no excuse not fixing the claim loss issue on successful charm, though. /sigh