The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

[BurningPanther]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

Plague is a garbage spell, why RDMs even want it? Sure, its "enfeebling," but the only thing this would ever even be useful for would be BC or NM fights to keep a mob from recovering while allies were recovering.

There exist in the game two forms of the Virus effect: Disease and Plague. Disease is the one that simply stalls TP and MP recovery, and is pretty much only useful against PCs, I assume this is the one you were thinking of. Plague, however, drains TP and MP over time. Because the Virus effect is Fire-based, it makes a nice little flip-side(and compliment) to Poison, which is why I wish for it so fervently. It'd also be fun to put a WAR's "Resist Virus" trait to the test in Ballista.

[Vonlock]

Re: The OFFICIAL "Wings of the Goddess" @ E3 2007 Thread!

I think we saw how PUP turned out.

What do you mean by that?

PUP turned out GREAT .... it's just that folks don't want to spend the gil or take the time to LEARN how to play the job. PUP is amazing once folks stop jumping on the "OMG PUP IS LAME" bandwagon. People are scared of what they don't understand... yet they don't take the time to learn it themselves.. they would rather go on the opinions of those who SUCK at puppetmaster.

PUP can out damage alot of the DD jobs up until mid lvl (40-50) ... but that's only if the player knows the right kind of attachments to buy. Remember they still have more adjustments to make to pup.. so the job isn't finished yet.

Remember a long time ago when Red Mage was the LAME job.... pup just needs that one thing that will make them valuable in end game... right now they are awesome from lvl 1 - 50 ... and yet STILL GOOD from then on... just not out damaging everyone like before.

PUP turned out GREAT.. and it's a job you actually have to THINK with. It's not some "/t <bt>" and hit till it dies type job. You have to stay on your toes.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The OFFICIAL &quot;Wings of the Goddess&quot; @ E3 2007 Thread!

There exist in the game two forms of the Virus effect: Disease and Plague. Disease is the one that simply stalls TP and MP recovery, and is pretty much only useful against PCs, I assume this is the one you were thinking of. Plague, however, drains TP and MP over time. Because the Virus effect is Fire-based, it makes a nice little flip-side(and compliment) to Poison, which is why I wish for it so fervently. It'd also be fun to put a WAR's "Resist Virus" trait to the test in Ballista.

We've seen how well Subtle Blow inhibits a mobs TP (which is to say that it really doesn't)and I have to wonder if mobs really even do have a limit on MP reserves. I'd assume most NMs just don't have that limitation. Some NMs use TP moves at will without building TP, which defeats the purpose of either spell.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The OFFICIAL &quot;Wings of the Goddess&quot; @ E3 2007 Thread!

What do you mean by that?

PUP turned out GREAT ....

What I mean is SE threw together some leftover ideas they had from DRG and Fellow NPCs and tried to work it around the demands for a Necromancer class. What players were expecting was a job where the pet could conform to various different roles, but few of them are powerful or consistant enough for your party members to take notice.

See also the problems that plauge DRG, SMN and BST. Same problem. SE has gone back and forth so many times on whether or not BST and PUP were meant to solo that I really can't take thier comments seriously. Only thing that is clear is that players don't want or think to invite these jobs to thier parties, so soloing becomes a necessity to level at all.

PUP still feels like an afterthought, and arguably so do DRG and BST. PUP has some great ideas, but they end up going nowhere at high level. Meanwhile we can say otherwise for COR and BLU, they're still young to high levels and endgame, they're just not cemented yet in strategy, they're getting there and the will. PUP is far behind them in that regard.

I'd love to see PUP do well and get further adjustments, I think its an interesting job overall. But personally, I'd rather SE not make any more pet jobs til they fix the pet jobs they have, plus I'd like to see the remaining classic jobs see the light of day.

[DakAttack]

Re: The OFFICIAL &quot;Wings of the Goddess&quot; @ E3 2007 Thread!

I don't see Dragoon as being an after thought since it's based on the Lancer. I think our reliance on the weak little wyvern is what does us in.

[BurningPanther]

Re: The OFFICIAL &quot;Wings of the Goddess&quot; @ E3 2007 Thread!

We've seen how well Subtle Blow inhibits a mobs TP (which is to say that it really doesn't)and I have to wonder if mobs really even do have a limit on MP reserves. I'd assume most NMs just don't have that limitation. Some NMs use TP moves at will without building TP, which defeats the purpose of either spell.

Well, not every spell has 100% usefulness, does it? There are mobs immune to Silence, mobs that absorb magic... everything would have use at a particular time, PLague would be no different. Certainly can't be crazier than wishing for Break, right?

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The OFFICIAL &quot;Wings of the Goddess&quot; @ E3 2007 Thread!

Well, not every spell has 100% usefulness, does it? There are mobs immune to Silence, mobs that absorb magic... everything would have use at a particular time, PLague would be no different. Certainly can't be crazier than wishing for Break, right?

OK, point taken.

I mostly just think that if you're gonna add an enfeebling magic, there has to be a curative magic to answer it. Amnesia doesn't have a cure, for example.

[BurningPanther]

Re: The OFFICIAL &quot;Wings of the Goddess&quot; @ E3 2007 Thread!

OK, point taken.
I mostly just think that if you're gonna add an enfeebling magic, there has to be a curative magic to answer it. Amnesia doesn't have a cure, for example.

Doesn't mean a curative spell can't be made, though. I like your "Recollection" idea.

[Necropolis]

Re: The OFFICIAL &quot;Wings of the Goddess&quot; @ E3 2007 Thread!

We've seen how well Subtle Blow inhibits a mobs TP (which is to say that it really doesn't)and I have to wonder if mobs really even do have a limit on MP reserves. I'd assume most NMs just don't have that limitation. Some NMs use TP moves at will without building TP, which defeats the purpose of either spell.

I wouldn't say that Subtle Blow is completly worthless. Often it isn't utilized, but I find it very helpful. Cases where I see it help the most would be duo/trio-ing UFOs in sea. Thier TP moves are quite bothersome, but I've noticed if you just use Mnk or Nin DDs the TP spam is greatly lessened.

And Mobs do have very finite MP pools. Ask any blm that has PLed before. I can't aspir the same crab for 3 hours unless it loses aggro at some point. Mobs recover when unclaimed/unaggroed at the rate of about 10% per tick. A lot of beastmasters use that to keep the mob alive longer. Like a mini-reward. Have to be quick before it despawns of course.

[Mhurron]

Re: The OFFICIAL &quot;Wings of the Goddess&quot; @ E3 2007 Thread!

Why? Why can't the mobs be just as screwed as we are? It wouldn't last long enough to matter anyway.

It's already been added, its just not a player accessible enfeeble.

[Legal Fish]

Re: The OFFICIAL &quot;Wings of the Goddess&quot; @ E3 2007 Thread!

Bells sound like a bad idea. It just doesn't seem right for FFXI.

In FFT Geomancers had access to certain spells based on the terrain they're standing on.

How does Ninjetsu tool like items make less sense than basing it on what you are standing on? You make my brain hurt. The game would need to write data that isn't even there now.

We've seen how well Subtle Blow inhibits a mobs TP (which is to say that it really doesn't)and I have to wonder if mobs really even do have a limit on MP reserves. I'd assume most NMs just don't have that limitation. Some NMs use TP moves at will without building TP, which defeats the purpose of either spell.

Wow, can't you ever say, "Oh, I'm wrong" for once?

You have to stop talking out of your ass.

Plague would be very powerful.

Subtle Blow isn't exactly weak, it's just not worth it to give up on more useful stats like accuracy/attack/and so on. This is more apparent when there is more than one or two melee fighting the monster.

"I have to wonder..." you do, because most monsters in the game do have a limit on MP reserves.

Some NMs. Okay, some NMs... thanks for pointing out 2% of the monster's population would only be "partially" harmed by Plague. And you are wrong, it wouldn't defeat the purpose of the spell. If a NM gains 10 TP a tick and uses TP moves at 150% TP, a 3/tick subtraction from that will stall the monster for a handful of ticks.

Just. Stop. Jeez.

PS. Viruna cures Plague.

[DakAttack]

Re: The OFFICIAL &quot;Wings of the Goddess&quot; @ E3 2007 Thread!

The game does know what you're standing on. Foot step animations and sound effects are evidence of this.

[Raydeus]

Re: The OFFICIAL &quot;Wings of the Goddess&quot; @ E3 2007 Thread!

The game does know what you're standing on. Foot step animations and sound effects are evidence of this.

Seriously though, while actual terrain-based (like if you are walking on grass, sand etc.) Geo-spells would be a pain to implement zone-based would be fairly easy, which I think is the way devs would go if they added the job.

Now, like I read in another post (maybe same thread? don't remember) if you could cast all Geo-spells everywhere with varying levels of strength depending on the zone you are it would make Geo an interesting job to play.

Say you have a wind based spell, Cape Terigan would make that spell very strong, while Xarcabard would make it very weak, that's the kinda effect I'm talking about.

[Legal Fish]

Re: The OFFICIAL &quot;Wings of the Goddess&quot; @ E3 2007 Thread!

The game does know what you're standing on. Foot step animations and sound effects are evidence of this.

That doesn't mean they have data that could work with this idea of Geomancers.

Think about how impractical it would be. Just imagine it in play, instead of in your head. Not from a developer's point of view, but from a player's point of view. It would be so extremely limited. It's exactly what SE wanted to avoid making BLU, COR, and PUP.

Casting spells using tools just like Ninja is a proven formula that works, combining it with getting free spells based on location(as in entire area) to keep in flavor.

[Raydeus]

Re: The OFFICIAL &quot;Wings of the Goddess&quot; @ E3 2007 Thread!

In that case (item usage for spell/ability casting) I think Chemist would be a much better option than Geo.