Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

[Aeni]

I used to be a tank, but I took a 3102 to the knee.

^ Best quote in a thread ... I was a 16 MRD and hit with 3102 for pretty much a 24 hour period (managed to log in half an hour before emergency maintenance; locked out since yesterday afternoon)

According to this tweet, Yoshi-P was appealing to the players to roll MRD/GLA in order to reduce dungeon queue times.

This was not unexpected. I knew that we were going to have a shortage of either tanks or healers. During Phase 3, it was healers (every time I'd queue Duty Finder, my Conjurer would instantly get into a group) This time around, with everyone and their mothers running around with a Glaceon at their heels, we have a glut of healers and DPS, but not enough tank (although in that same forum thread, plenty of "tanks" were locked out by the Error 3102 ... coincidence?)

[Jarre]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

Problem is the tanks that do come on suck. Like this glad that was in a party with Firewind and I in Copperbell Mines. He died twice... Couldn't manage hate and didn't use flash or shield bash / fling at all. Firewind tanked better using carby than he and I had to balance hate with firewind as puglist to try and keep the party alive. I tanked as Marauder no trouble in another dungeon and am working on gladiator but alas servers are down at moment although they are extending till 3pm this afternoon so maybe get glad up a bit when NA/EU servers go back online.

[Aeni]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

You haven't tanked until you run with my friend ... he makes you hustle for your money. In every freaking MMO we've played together, he gives me the most gray hairs. Maybe that's how I can become a better tank by compensating for one jerk of a DD (I still love him) Talk about stressing out the healers though.

[Firewind]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

We should put him and Yyg in the same party together and see how long the Healer lasts before breaking down into tears.

[Nandito]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

I'm already a tank, foo'.

Rolling WAR main, woot woot.

[Etra]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

Just used my Carbuncle to tank Copperbell Mines with two other people (con and pug)... Wasn't very difficult.

[jenova_9]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

Maybe they will resort to Musketeer and/or Dark Knight being added as a tank, mew. Musketeer has a gun, but they could be a frontline shotgun type of tank.

[Aeni]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

J9 has a point ... that people will flock to the newest thing. The first of the new classes needs to be a tank. And each new "batch" of classes released needs to have a tank and a healer, cause it would be on Yoshi-P's head if all they did was release new DDs after new DDs.

[jenova_9]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

Does this mean Ninja will be a tank again, mew? Well I could be okay with that, though dps would be cooler and more fitting. It would be miffed up if Samurai becomes a tank instead of dps. Since Arcanist can tank somewhat, it makes sense for Red Mage to be a tank. I guess Dancer might become a healer.

[Firewind]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

Since there's only one class that can heal, then surely an extra healing class can't possibly harm queue times either. ACN is flagged as Damage in the Group Finder in spite of getting native heals. I just don't see how adding even more tanking classes to the mix would actually help queue times when there's already 2. Are GLD and MRD that unpopular with the Japanese playerbase that Yoshi-P is begging for more tanks?

[Aeni]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

Since there's only one class that can heal, then surely an extra healing class can't possibly harm queue times either. ACN is flagged as Damage in the Group Finder in spite of getting native heals. I just don't see how adding even more tanking classes to the mix would actually help queue times when there's already 2. Are GLD and MRD that unpopular with the Japanese playerbase that Yoshi-P is begging for more tanks?

Hmmm ... I queued up as a tank (MRD) with a friend (THM) and we ended up in a group after only 2 seconds spent in queue. I'm not exaggerating, that was the exact amount of time elapsed after I clicked on the "JOIN" button. We got lumped in with a THM and an CNJ, but the CNJ didn't use Cures, as he/she was using strictly Physiks. Didn't see a Carby out so I'm pretty damned sure it wasn't an ACN.

MRD THM THM CNJ (using ACN spells)

When I was healing in P3, my queue times as a healer were non-existent. I'd hit the JOIN button and after normal network latency (2 seconds) I was greeted with a message that said my group was formed. Contrast this with my MRD or GLA sitting in queues of over 15 minutes during P3. Now, it seems to be a complete opposite, where DPS are in impossibly long queues and healers are also having to wait for some time, while tanks are just *zap* instantly in a dungeon. Don't tell me there's a shortage of healers.

Edit: Also, it's not just JP, because Reddit had a survey on class balance and the combined number of GLA and MRDs was less than CNJ alone, and then everyone else was DPS. This was a survey of people before P4, so that could've changed during P4, but since ACN was on that list, I'm sure it's not off by very much. That surveyed showed consistency of choices between regions, where only deviations in Race choices were bigger than anything else that was listed.

[Hayde]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

@Firewind:

ACN can heal but their native MND is low. I took ACN and CONJ to 20 on a fresh character for fun this past weekend; at level 15 my Conjurer in the exact same gear (a few pieces of greens from the dungeons, and then quest rewards) can heal for 120+ whereas my ACN can only heal for a fraction of that. Dumping all my points into MND, my ACN's innate INT and PIE still came up to be 20 points higher than MND by level 20. The only reassurance is at level 20 you received a trait that increased your healing done--which bumped the number to a nice 120 (still less than what my CONJ was healing for at level 18, 155~).

I believe they could have allowed ACN to queue for healing, but you have to remember the average joe probably doesn't go on forums, and if they have any intentions of going SMN at 30--they probably dumped their points towards INT, which means their heals are even less than mine.

You can heal, certainly; but it requires good communication. There were points (bosses, big pulls) where I had to chain cast my Physick on my friend to keep him at 50% + -- it healed for a meager 64 at level 15-16 while I did the first dungeon, and came out to about 80ish at level 19 before the healing trait at 20. That means if you gave the ability for some guy to queue up as healing as an arcanist and they even stop for a few casts to throw up a nuke or refresh their dots, their tank might be dead.

One of the biggest slap to the faces for THM and ACN wanting to heal is--in beta phase 3, you could cross-class Cleric Stance which would invert your MND and INT values. The original purpose of this was to allow CONJ to nuke while questing more effectively, but this also allowed THM to heal. However, as of phase 4/retail this ability can only be used by CONJ, WHM, and SCH. I have more detailed info with ACN healing if you want to throw me a Skype some time.

One last thing I wanted to point out. I tried out both Cure and Physick at level 20 on my ACN; this sounds silly but I was curious if for some, weird reason SCH benefited from INT rather than MND (I noticed from XIVDB that SCH do not get any additional + healing or + MND traits) but they both heal for the exact same values at 20 (120~122 non crits) so they're both MND based, which should be obvious but I wanted to double check.

[Aeni]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

They could change MND mechanics for SMNs in that it strengthens the pet while INT is for their sole DPS output (which gives flexibility in either making a pet stronger or not relying on the pet)

[Firewind]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

Cleric Stance is not that useful for healing anyway since it cuts your healing by 20%. It is mostly there to normalise INT and MND for CNJ/WHM when playing solo or during phases where there's little damage so they can toggle the stance on and contribute to DPS.

SE could have just used the simple option and made CNJ Nukes Mind based, but I guess that would be too simple, and we know how much SE love making things needlessly complicated.

[Aeni]

Re: Yoshi-P Wants more Tanks

Cleric Stance is not that useful for healing anyway since it cuts your healing by 20%. It is mostly there to normalise INT and MND for CNJ/WHM when playing solo or during phases where there's little damage so they can toggle the stance on and contribute to DPS.

SE could have just used the simple option and made CNJ Nukes Mind based, but I guess that would be too simple, and we know how much SE love making things needlessly complicated.

You think they could give ACN + branches the anti-Clerical Stance, where damage is dropped 20% in order to boost healing?