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Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

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  • Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

    Some people are discussing how significant partying will be in FFXIV ARR, mew (besides endgame/high level content). It's understandable that FFXI was generally not solo friendly and people ended up getting stuck without help. but an mmorpg that is a landslide stroll to level cap solo can hurt communities as well, mew.

    Here are some quotes going on in FF communities:

    So I'm super excited BUT there is one thing that very much worries me...

    With all of these new changes that are in some ways drawing from WMMORPGs...we're not talking about more soloability are we? Because I really am tired of MMO's where you can solo to max level no problem.

    I find that when an MMO essentially forces you to do things in groups by level 15 or so...it really makes a community bind together more closely. In MMOs like WoW and all of its clones, you just sorta powerlevel yourself to max and then group dungeons and raids.

    But what I loved about EQ1 and FFXI is that you really had to rely on meeting people and making friends and such to even begin to progress in the world. Monsters were scary and we all had to band together to survive.
    Yup, exactly. EQ and FFXI are the only ones I have played with true group play, and that's sad, because the a major point of MMOs are to play with one another.
    I don't think full groups of 8 are supported from the start if there isn't beginner content and mid levels content for parties to get involved in, mew.
    Parties could still be faster to get EXP and Quests completed than soloing. (I'd relate it to, for example FFVI, 1 member could technically solo the whole main story, but a party can defeat enemies faster and survive more easily.)

    Honestly, I hated with *insert mainstream mmorpg here* the lack of partying to get to max level. It felt lonely
    FFXIV ARR could find a better balance between rewarding soloers and party members from the start, all the way up to level cap, not saving partying for endgame and raids and stuff, but for the overall journey from level 1, to the mid levels, to the high levels. I think SE said there will be content for both playstyles throughout their leveling and questing journey.

    The problem is the line is rarely if ever drawn in the right place. I can't personally think of an MMO where soloing was actually faster, and/or more rewarding than grouping in a direct 1 to 1 comparison. However, it never looks at it in a dynamic environment. There's always a degree a hassle involved in partying, you have to find people, coordinate, have afks, dc's, people leaving etc. The easier it is to solo the more people will do it cause it's just less hassle, thus removing more people from the pool of potential party members, which then makes it even harder and more of a hassle to form a party.

    When it comes to things like the crystal tower, or other high level group/raid content, you essentially fragment the community into small cliques. Anything like that is going to be done by guilds, and so you'll socialize with your guild and everyone else in the game might as well not exist.

    Soloing doesn't need to be impossible like in XI, but I do feel it should be strongly discouraged. That way people can solo if they want, but a majority will do so LFP and that way both groups win. Also, it is called an MMO for a reason, doesn't it kind of make sense that soloing should not be the majority of players and majority of the game?

    Despite all that they still do manage to keep me interested, it definitely will be nice if this is the mmo that breaks the current template.
    Well with these various examples of people's thoughts regarding solo vs. parties, what do people here in regards to soloing vs. parties, mew?

    Who should get the bigger piece of the pie from start to finish. I would say parties. An mmorpg is hollow if the easiest way to level up is solo, it just ends up distancing the people further and of course you know when it comes to optimal progress, people will choose the fastest and easiest route to the best content, so maybe they won't make it too easy and fast for soloers.

    It doesn't make sense to have soloing be more rewarding and convenient than partying. Soloing should always be an option, but Parties should always be the better and more rewarding option no matter what level, quests and stuff people do.

    I haven't found any producer comments regarding parties vs. solo. They said something about guildleves helping soloers level, and the main quest could probably be completely soloed, but I think the main quest still supports full parties and there will be content for parties, not just high level content, but throughout their entire leveling journey, mew.

  • #2
    Re: Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

    Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?
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    • #3
      Re: Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

      I think it should lean toward parties. Only Ray likes to play solo. The best experiences I had in ffxi were party experiences. Well, soloing some tough NM was fun and memorable, but that's not what we are talking about here.
      75: Sam, Nin, Blm, Thf, Pld, Cor, Rdm
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      • #4
        Re: Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

        Originally posted by Mezlo View Post
        Only Ray likes to play solo.
        You keep saying that over and over, and over again while completely disregarding most of what I've said on the subject. XD

        Do you have a learning disability I should know about?
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        • #5
          Re: Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

          hmm they have yet to clarify what content is planned for early level and mid level parties.

          For raids the focus will be on 8-person parties.

          For instanced dungeons there will also be 4-person party ones.
          Does that mean instanced dungeons will have party caps? or 5-8 members is allowed, mew?

          In regards to high-level content, we are planning to make it fundamentally focused on full parties,
          At first glance, that might bring concern that low level and mid level content might not have much for full parties. but maybe there will be 4+ person party dungeons throughout low level and mid level content.

          however there will be casual content as well. For example, one plan we have is for content called "FULL ACTIVE TIME EVENT." This is content that contains various elements such as fighting against a bunch of monsters that spawn and hamlet defense-like elements. For the time being, think of it as there will be a lot of different content in a variety of places.
          That sounds like a mix of solo and party based content. It's a bit vague, but maybe if new Q&A and interviews could get more info on their plans for low level and mid level party content, we can get an idea how much content there will be for parties besides high level content, mew.

          And also, how will the main quests support parties besides solo groups. Of course main quests may be designed so 1 person can complete them, but they could also encourage parties to do them too with greater challenges and greater rewards, mew (better items and gil)

          Maybe to add incentives for parties, each party member could increase everyone's EXP gain by +2%, Gil gain by +1%, and drop rates by +5%

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          • #6
            Re: Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

            Yes, we all loved grouping up and taking down big bad monsters in FFXI, but nobody liked sitting in Jeuno for days waiting to assemble a party. Nobody liked spending months finding just the right amount of people and the right jobs to complete an AF quest, or mission quest. But nobody mentions this stuff?

            Besides, FFXI's community wasn't as close-knit or small as people liked to believe. The game used a priority-based list of characters whose models should be displayed first in crowded environments. If you saw the same people often, it's because the game was doing it on purpose.

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            • #7
              Re: Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

              Originally posted by DakAttack View Post
              Yes, we all loved grouping up and taking down big bad monsters in FFXI, but nobody liked sitting in Jeuno for days waiting to assemble a party. Nobody liked spending months finding just the right amount of people and the right jobs to complete an AF quest, or mission quest. But nobody mentions this stuff?

              Besides, FFXI's community wasn't as close-knit or small as people liked to believe. The game used a priority-based list of characters whose models should be displayed first in crowded environments. If you saw the same people often, it's because the game was doing it on purpose.
              Exactly.

              _____


              As I've said repeatedly over the past 5 years or more, there should be an incentive to party with others and make friends. But there should also be the option to solo the content in case you failed to find people/help for <insert activity> or chose to go at it alone. Choice and option being the important concepts here. I'll always mention earlier Magian trials as an example of good community cooperation encouragement, and things like WotG and CoP as examples of how bad forced partying can be. Keep in mind it is only now, years after WotG was introduced that I finally was able to get the missions done. Why? Because I was finally able to solo them. Was it my first choice? Hell no, but I spent years trying to get help for them. And an exercise in futility that was.

              In Mezlo's world that probably is game design success, but any reasonable player will call it BS.
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              • #8
                Re: Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

                Originally posted by DakAttack View Post
                The game used a priority-based list of characters whose models should be displayed first in crowded environments. If you saw the same people often, it's because the game was doing it on purpose.
                Wait, what? Is that true? What are the criteria (linkshell, Flist, billing zip code)?
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                • #9
                  Re: Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

                  Probably LS and region were high in the priority list considering I would always spot/load LS people way before anyone else. For some JP players I used to know I had to actually /target them in order to see them. orz
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                  "In this world, the one who has the most fun is the winner!" C.B.
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                  その目だれの目。

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                  • #10
                    Re: Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

                    Originally posted by Raydeus View Post
                    You keep saying that over and over, and over again while completely disregarding most of what I've said on the subject. XD

                    Do you have a learning disability I should know about?
                    So teasing Ray is no longer allowed? Ok, I'll stop.
                    75: Sam, Nin, Blm, Thf, Pld, Cor, Rdm
                    RANK 10 Bastok
                    CoP: Done
                    ZM: Done
                    ToA: Done
                    Assault rank: Captain
                    Campaign Medal: Medals
                    Wotg: Complete the quests already and I'll start

                    Originally posted by Etra
                    This thread brought to you by Malacite's lack of understanding.

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                    • #11
                      Re: Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

                      Isn't this why they're adding the content finder and automatically grouping people who are close by in dungeons? So you DON'T have to sit around for ages waiting on an invite?


                      Also, questing is going to be the primary method for EXP in ARR - not traditional grind parties.
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                      • #12
                        Re: Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

                        Originally posted by Malacite View Post
                        Isn't this why they're adding the content finder and automatically grouping people who are close by in dungeons? So you DON'T have to sit around for ages waiting on an invite?

                        Also, questing is going to be the primary method for EXP in ARR - not traditional grind parties.

                        yes but how that does work between soloers and parties? How does that work for people that ALREADY formed parties without going the quest/content finder route?

                        The content finder seems to be more of an extension for soloers for content they can't solo themselves.

                        or MAYBE it's like PSO where you can solo the content, but jumping in with people makes it easier?



                        PSO feels like such a casual mess, though, mew. I like PSO but FFXIV shouldn't be exactly like that.

                        but still, instanced dungeons where people can drop in through the content finder, with manageable mobs within their level, that can be soloed but parrties make it easier? That seems like a fair deal, mew.

                        but I wonder if the instanced dungeons will be strict. can 4 player dungeons still support 6-8 players if people have more friends that wanna come along? Or I guess larger groups will be directed towards persistent zone content like NMs and stuff.

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                        • #13
                          Re: Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

                          I don't get the obsession with forcing people to group up in order to level. To J9's point, no, it doesn't have to be LOLeasy either. SO, why are we having this argument again? Look at WoW. Granted, the reason soloing is so easy at this point is it's already an established product and some people are leveling their 8th character and DO NOT WANT TO GRIND DAYS to get it up again. However, you can still tweak it so that soloing isn't painful but isn't troll-easy (at least for the first few years ... it can be made easy after 2nd or 3rd expansion ... if the game is successful ... IF)

                          But I've already made my point. You spend less than 20% of your game time leveling. Most of it is "grinding" dungeons and raids for gear and content. If you told me you spent more time leveling than end-game in FFXI, it means one of 3 things: (1) you were a perfectionist, like Gulkeeva, and wanted all your jobs to cap (2) you're a casual ... end-game means nothing to you (3) you're lying out of your rear end. Note, people who raided and didn't have broad diversity in their jobs would fall under (3).

                          As for J9, the new dungeon finder system in FFXIV would fill your "need to make friends", whatever that means. Just don't come crying if you're disappointed with such a feature (if you played WoW, you would know what I mean)

                          - - - Updated - - -

                          BTW, PSO2 has made a lot of improvements of its predecessor, but I thought J9 didn't even have a PC to play it, let alone FFXIV.

                          - - - Updated - - -

                          Originally posted by jenova_9 View Post
                          Here are some quotes going on in FF communities:
                          It's a plural word? Pray, tell me, from where were these lifted? I checked the "official forums" and they, as always, are completely infected with low-IQ members who dribble nonsense and generally feel inclined to show the whole world that they are, in fact, stupid.

                          I find that when an MMO essentially forces you to do things in groups by level 15 or so...it really makes a community bind together more closely. In MMOs like WoW and all of its clones, you just sorta powerlevel yourself to max and then group dungeons and raids.
                          Even at a risk of being stuck for hours with incompetance? Let me be the guy that says what's on everyone's mind but no one will want to risk their credentials saying it: I have very little faith in other players. You can say stuff about "friends", and I will say, if you have friends, then this discussion is moot. You will choose to play the game however you choose to play this game if you have friends. That means, for the rest of the playerbase, let them decide to play the game in the manner in which it will provide them with whatever satisfaction they desire out of it. Afterall, they pay the same $15 a month as you do, so let's not act all self-righteous about what is "best" for the playerbase overall.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Party vs. Solo. Which side will FFXIV favor more from level 1 to level 50+?

                            Originally posted by jenova_9 View Post
                            yes but how that does work between soloers and parties? How does that work for people that ALREADY formed parties without going the quest/content finder route?

                            The content finder seems to be more of an extension for soloers for content they can't solo themselves.

                            or MAYBE it's like PSO where you can solo the content, but jumping in with people makes it easier?





                            PSO feels like such a casual mess, though, mew. I like PSO but FFXIV shouldn't be exactly like that.

                            but still, instanced dungeons where people can drop in through the content finder, with manageable mobs within their level, that can be soloed but parrties make it easier? That seems like a fair deal, mew.

                            but I wonder if the instanced dungeons will be strict. can 4 player dungeons still support 6-8 players if people have more friends that wanna come along? Or I guess larger groups will be directed towards persistent zone content like NMs and stuff.
                            This is why I adore J9.
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