Things I'm waiting for:

[Aksannyi]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

Most people who are paying to play an MMO aren't gonna want to take a break to wait for endgame content. I'd cancel my sub and play something else.

I'm not saying SE should go ahead and rush endgame, too, because the whole fucking game is rushed, but there needs to be something to do in the meantime.

[jenova_9]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

Notorious Monsters are coming this month!

[Murphie]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

Most people who are paying to play an MMO aren't gonna want to take a break to wait for endgame content. I'd cancel my sub and play something else.

I'm not saying SE should go ahead and rush endgame, too, because the whole fucking game is rushed, but there needs to be something to do in the meantime.

Well, FFXIV players aren't paying to play. And the point is, those players who rush to the end need to understand that the game isn't created with them in mind. It's like the idiots who complained about no AF for new jobs the moment they were created, when they grinded PUP, BLU and COR to 75 days after the jobs were introduced. When the game first launches, endgame shouldn't be the focus. If you rush to endgame, it's your fault, not the creator's if you run out of content to burn through. I'm not saying that you shouldn't play at the pace you want to. I'm saying that if you do go at a faster pace, you need to understand the sacrifice you're making in order to be "first."

[Etra]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

Well, FFXIV players aren't paying to play. And the point is, those players who rush to the end need to understand that the game isn't created with them in mind. It's like the idiots who complained about no AF for new jobs the moment they were created, when they grinded PUP, BLU and COR to 75 days after the jobs were introduced. When the game first launches, endgame shouldn't be the focus. If you rush to endgame, it's your fault, not the creator's if you run out of content to burn through. I'm not saying that you shouldn't play at the pace you want to. I'm saying that if you do go at a faster pace, you need to understand the sacrifice you're making in order to be "first."

End game should be there. If you release a game, I except all aspects of the game to be there. Starting game, middle game, end game. End game is part of "the game," so why should it not come with the released product?

We have rushed and shitty games because of people that defend developers for not releasing full games. Yeah, you can blame the people funding the project for shouting at them to get it out as quickly as possible. However, the sponsors and developers wouldn't dare do so if people would shun the games that do not have the entire game finished. (And by entire, I mean something for end gamers to at least do instead of twiddle their thumbs.)

Side note: My highest rank is only 21. I'm nowhere near what you'd call hardcore.

[Kailea]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

When it comes to MMORPGs the first and main thing to get done, is getting the game playable, and more money coming in, then they can worry about endgame, it has been this way with every MMO ever. Why should it be different now?

[Pwnagraphic]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

My first MMO was EQOA.. It had endgame content at release. Just sayin'.

Murphie has a good point, but what are we supposed to think when other things were left out to rush this game?

[Aksannyi]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

To be clear, I'm not necessarily saying it's the right attitude, but I can see why they feel the way they do. Personally, I wouldn't make a huge rush to max level in a new game, I'd probably spend a good portion of my time just exploring and questing. (And if you look at my achievements in WoW, you'll see that's where I've gotten most of them - quests and exploration.) I'm not one of those people who enjoys grinding that much, so I pick and choose my times to do it, get through it as efficiently as possible, and then go do something else.

But if I manage to somehow hit the cap and there happens to not be "something else" for me to do when I get to that point, I'm gonna be a bit bummed. That's not likely to happen, as it did take me three years to get my first job to 75 in XI, but yeah. I can see where it would be a bit annoying. And like it or not, you're always going to have the tools out there who have to be the first just so they can scream "FIRST" at everyone, but even those tools paid to play (talking in general, not about XIV necessarily) and want something to do after they've ground out their levels. Truth be told, if I were one of those types and there was nothing for me to do at max level except maybe help out some lowbies - fun for a bit, boring quickly - I'd probably log out and play something else until there was something there for me to do.

[Kailea]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

I see your point, guess that is where I am different, I get to cap with no endgame and I would just shrug it off, and go do other stuff in game or not, till endgame was added.

[Murphie]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

MMOs are just different in that way. I've grown to accept its opportunities as well as its limitations. When someone starts a new MMO at launch, and burns their character to the cap, just because they don't have "Endgame" stuff to do, doesn't mean that they have nothing to do.

Are their crafts capped? Do they have enough money to buy anything and everything they want? Have they explored all of the maps in the game, and collected all of the various items there are to collect? Are there any quests undone? If the answer to any of those is no, then they still have stuff they can do. Just because it's not endgame content doesn't mean that the game is shitty.

FFXIV was rushed out and launched in September. We're just about at the three month mark now. Endgame WILL come. And hey, since you rushed to cap your level, you'll be ready and raring to go when said content is released.

I'd also like to point out that the people who bitch about no endgame content will be the same people bitching about there not being any NEW endgame content about a month after endgame content is introduced. When you are on the front lines of the leveling curve, you're going to outdistance the developers at some point. Either deal with it, or move on.

[Freelancer]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

Well, endgame shouldn't be an issue, the issue is what to do between R1 and cap, if there were better group events than behest and sharing leves I'm sure it'll be ok. (raids for newbies?)

I want another chains of promathia, to force people to want to work together for a common goal.

Though I miss the FFXI party-grind play, sure its tedious at times but I met some of my best game buddies in grind pts, and those same low lvl pts are what usually bring people together into making shells and friends in general, and help people shake off the anti-social behavior.

I'd like it at least as an option.

Maybe I'm blaming the game for its lack of social aspects a little too much, but oh well, just gonna work on getting 50 before the PS3 release, and if that doesn't revive the game then I wonder what will SE do, I know more JPs will play at PS3 release, but I'm not sure about English speaking players.

[Aeni]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

I find it silly that people are wanting endgame already -.-

People forget that end game didn't exist in FFXI for many months after release. People also forget that FFXIV was a worldwide release and FFXI was staggered across the regions, so they certainly thought end game came out relatively quick after the release. The game was out for several months in Japan before an NA version was pushed out and then several more months later for the PS2 version and that's about the time where end game was being fleshed out and where AFs were put in to "alleviate those pressures". I'm pretty sure the level cap initially was at 50 just like it is now.

WoW was the same way where BRD was end game for the most part (Level cap was like 45 or 50) It wasn't until several months later, heck, almost a year later, before they got a real meaty raid content out (I think that was Scholomance/Stratholme/Dire Maul for Dungeon Sets) and eventually Onyxia's Lair and Molten Core for Tier 1 (14-18 months later?) and level cap pushed to 60 for vanilla. And during the first few months, Blizzard had to do all it could to fight PR nightmares, server gremlins and PvP woes.

[Firewind]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

Well if you think about it, when you get to the level cap, there isn't much else to do except endgame. And people will reach cap quickly no matter what you do to hinder them (hi2u fatigue). WoW is pretty good about this, there's PvP battlegrounds, fishing, crafting, achievement hunting, so even if you're sick of the grind or if you're sick of raiding, you can find something else to run around and do.

But if you hit the cap in an MMO and there's no endgame ... what the hell else is there to do? Level a new toon? Or in XI/XIV's case, level another job? That gets old.

I'm just saying, I can see kind of see where these people are coming from. If you're gonna level up to cap and find nothing when you get there, what's the point? Unless you like the grind from 1-whatever, you're going to feel like you wasted a whole bunch of time.

This is pretty much what I was getting at. If there's nothing to work towards then what's the point in really going for the level cap when I can just play another MMO until Squeenix dangles that carrot in front of me? the utter lack of things to do other than grind in FFXIV makes it more pronounced. Doing nothing but crafting is frankly boring. In an MMO I want to explore and quest, not sit there stitching shoes for the entire time I'm logged in like I'm playing some Virtual Sweatshop game.

I do enjoy gathering in this game, not so much the minigames, the minigames are just stupid and arbitrary cockblocks to regular players because some people are too lazy to gather in MMOs without bots. It is because it encourages exploration but they are linked with DoW leves so I'm pretty much forced to pick between the game's very fun combat or having fun exploring. Why can't DoH and DoL leves be linked?

FFXIV even discourages party grinding as someone mentioned earlier. Being in a party when grinding is the one thing that makes it less horrible because you have an entire group of people working with you, suffering the same thing and more importantly, people to talk to and interact with. I've made some great friends on games like FFXI or WoW in random parties doing grinds or dungeons. Merely having someone to chat with and have fun with makes the entire experience more enjoyable. On FFXIV the only time I'm in a party is when I answer a /shout for a teleport because some people people have more gil than sense.

WoW was the same way where BRD was end game for the most part (Level cap was like 45 or 50) It wasn't until several months later, heck, almost a year later, before they got a real meaty raid content out (I think that was Scholomance/Stratholme/Dire Maul for Dungeon Sets) and eventually Onyxia's Lair and Molten Core for Tier 1 (14-18 months later?) and level cap pushed to 60 for vanilla. And during the first few months, Blizzard had to do all it could to fight PR nightmares, server gremlins and PvP woes.

At least there was something to work towards though, and BRD was a fun dungeon.

Well, endgame shouldn't be an issue, the issue is what to do between R1 and cap, if there were better group events than behest and sharing leves I'm sure it'll be ok. (raids for newbies?)

This. There are no group events at all and sharing leves only works for so long. Newer MMOs have started adding low level dungeons which not only gives people something to do but it also makes sure that players can always function in a party environment. One concern I have with FFXIV is that because you're forced to solo to 50, we may well have a large number of people who have no idea how to function in a party.

[Murphie]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

And on the other side of that coin, Firewind, is that a lot of players prefer not to have to do things in groups. I realize that FFXI instilled a bit of a pavolovian response in a lot of its players (must party to make friends!), but just because XIV is different doesn't make it bad (there are a host of other reasons why it's bad).

People in WoW soloed to 50 without doing any dungeons, and some of them grouped up for everything. Yet somehow they still managed to work well (-ish, this was highly player dependent) with each other when it came to doing instances. I'm sure it will be fine.

Again, folks - Launched in September. Three months ago. Three months ago. Three what? Three months. Three months what? Three months ago. Is the game unfinished? Of course it is. It was rushed out, and it's an MMO. You're playing for free. If you aren't happy with the gameplay to the point that you'd rather play something else? No one is forcing your hand here.

[Aksannyi]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

Well you're always going to have those who enjoy that climb from 1 to cap, and those that don't. I really dislike level grinding. I like what comes after. Others enjoy that journey, and don't care what comes after. (To an extent) And that variance is what brings MMOs their flavor, you have different playstyles all trying to meld together. But I can see both sides of the coin.

[Murphie]

Re: Things I'm waiting for:

Oh absolutely. It's just, you know: new, rushed out game. So, exercise a bit of patience, folks. Or don't! It's totally your call either way.