FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

[Takelli]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

It's not hard to get exp ... since you can do 8 levels every 48 hours, you can theoretically gain 2-3 levels a week with a group and then another 2 levels a week crafting. At least that's the way I see it.

2-3 levels a week? That's not too bad for a casual player in FFXI. I was getting 1 level a day in FFXI when I was at level 60-75 (Damn exp curve got too large IMHO).

I just hope FFXIV doesn't have such a large exp curve as did FFXI when you got to higher levels. I like being able to pump away the levels fairly fast (Kinda like how GW has it, or how it is at lower levels in other game.)

[Aeni]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

2-3 levels a week? That's not too bad for a casual player in FFXI. I was getting 1 level a day in FFXI when I was at level 60-75 (Damn exp curve got too large IMHO).

Yes it is very possible ... I worked out the math in this manner.

Every 48 hours, you can (at least in beta, this may change) obtain 8 new leve quests (or maybe they'll let you redo them w/o the rewards, just experience? Not sure) If you do not want to spend anymore time to the game than necessary, only to have fun and to enjoy yourself, but not obsessively, then you can perform just 4 leves a day (perfect, that's the maximum number of leves you can get per camp per day) This way, you can always do 4 leves a day within the 8 maximum framework.

You should be able to obtain at around 60-90% of your level for every 4 leves completed. This assumes you do not just work on "old" leves ... leves that are marked for levels below your current (i.e., 10-20 if you're at level 40)

This is roughly 28 leves a week ... or you can go all out and do 8 leves every 48 hours and this requires you to just log on 3 times a week (thereabouts, some weeks more due to the rolling 48 hour period but you do not even need to have a schedule either) or even just logging on Friday and doing 8 and then Sunday it refreshes to do 8 and stop for the week. Up to you.

You can craft ... crafting has no limitations ... so theoretically a crafting whore could gain most of his/her levels just ... crafting. I'm not kidding you guys here ... it's entirely possible to never leave the city and gain a large amount of your levels (say the cap is currently at 50, it's possible to get to 30 or even 40 just on crafting) The only bad thing is if your main is War or Magic ... you're gonna need to grind up to get your weapon skill up and I'm not sure how that works (do you need to hit mobs your level or can you kill mobs at your weapon level?)

[Balfree]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

Well Bal, we are not allowed to have our opinion. The 13er's want us to shut up and drink the Kool-aid. Personally, I don't give a flying fart who puts up a video explaining stuff that I fully understood beforehand, I don't like the system and I don't have to. So keep your personal jabs to yourself and go get ready for the mothership.

You're kind of blowing my comment a little out of proportion. Like I said I'm not particularly fond of the idea myself.

[TheGrandMom]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

You're kind of blowing my comment a little out of proportion. Like I said I'm not particularly fond of the idea myself.

Thats what happens when you put your opinions out on the intertubes, so I guess you have 2 choices. And actually the only part that you could apply to what you said is:

Well Bal, we are not allowed to have our opinion. The 14er's want us to shut up and drink the Kool-aid.

I said it because you made comments that fly in the face of the 14er's mantra. Other that that, I said "Personally..."

[Balfree]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

I don't even know what that means :s

[Raydeus]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

The 13th generation. (Or generation X)

[Ziero]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

No, that's just a punk with shortsighted, self-serving goals. Again, they will be seen like the people that level and then leave a party in FFXI or any party-based MMO. They were better off soloing and not wasting a group's time.

And everything boils down to time. Waste the time of others and you will not be Mr. Popularity.

Because not being "popular" really hurt most of the asshats in XI.

How many events have we all had to endure where good players were selfish assholes and played only the role they enjoyed playing while you had to suffer some idiot that couldn't play the roles you needed well? Or maybe the roles you needed didn't show up at all and someone refusd to step up and use their job because it was "retired."

Seriously, how many sucky Bards or PLDs have your had to endure because your LS leader wanted to bring his very-not-needed THF or SAM to an event? He apparently values his enjoyment over the time of the group.

And how many RDMs are expected to grin and bear those healer duties? Oh, I'd think you'd expect that of ALL OF THEM. People dont' sign up to be a healer at every event, but its expected all the same.

Or how many daggers shot out of the eyes of other players because when you were new, you lotted on an earth crystal. EXP PT loot isn't worth jack in FFXI if its not silk threats, so why do people curse and spit at your name if you lot? How is loting different from just letting it drop at random?

Honestly, never. For the most part I played for fun and I played with friends. If we wanted to lot on something, even as stupid as crystals, we'd usually ask...because it's simply just polite to ask before trying to claim something. If one of us had to use a certain job, we'd use it. If we didn't want to use a certain job, no body would force them to. Our best Rdms and Whms wanted to be healers and debuffers, and they were always highly praised for their efforts (I still think my LS had the "best back line" on all of Cerb ).

All your problems stem from being involved in hardcore endgame, problems which I made every effort to avoid since I don't enjoy dealing with asshats. Even during random PUG leveling, no one ever forced someone to be another job or shoved them into a role they weren't willing to play. I enjoy playing the game and updating my gear and knowing my jobs to the best of my ability, but I don't enjoy all the politicking and backstabbing that comes from hardcore "event" shells. If SE is aiming the game more towards casuals, I shouldn't have a problem enjoying the game the same way I did XI.

Whether it makes sense or not and whether we like it or not, if you want to get ahead in an MMORPG, there's something you're going to have to do that you don't want to do. And if you only want to be one kind of job, then FFXIV and FFXI are totally the wrong MMORPG for you.

Get ahead of who? I agree that you can't succeed in XIV if you're only one job, but nobody should be forcing you to level or play those other jobs outside the game itself.

In other news, you may disagree with the entire system, but I do give the guys kudos for explaining the system better than the developers (which isn't too hard considering it's SE.) You probably wouldn't see any other community for a game / developer put together such a video to try and explain things in detail for the rest of the playerbase.

I think the biggest problem with understanding the system was just the sheer amount of blatantly false information that surrounded the concept and confused everyone. This video basically just took the same idea and explanation SE gave, added simple pictures and dumbed it down so much that you have to be an absolute idiot to not get it. SE's biggest mistake is explaining the system to people while assuming most of these people had half a brain, this video didn't make that mistake.

[Firewind]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

Which is going to suck seeing as you'll also need gear for those classes as well as skills. You'll also need to know how to play them, have the proper stat distribution to be effective in it and generally enjoy playing the class to put up with it long enough when needed. Not everyone likes playing magic jobs and the game nor the playerbase should force that on someone. I'm probably one of those people who won't have any mage skills leveled, though I'll have plenty of melee skills to choose from, and will most likely pick the ones that compliment Marauder, both offensively and defensively, the best, as that's the class I would want to play the most. Of course I'll also have choice Harvesting and Crafting classes leveled, as you'll need those to survive...financially...in XIV's game-world.

You clearly haven't played the beta at all.

1. Gear is equippable by any class. You just lose the stat bonuses for equipping sub par gear since well, what does a mage need the strength from Plate or leather for?
2. You are bitching about having to level separate jobs for skills yet you fail to notice you do the exact same thing with the subjob system in FFXI...
3. You can reassign your stats at ANY TIME so if you mess up a stat distribution you can reset it.
4. Mage skills for melee classes are only useful for soloing anyway...The only useful mage skills for a party setting are Stoneskin and Shock Spikes for the tank and guess what? You can get both buffs from the conjurer anyway.
5. You don't need to have Harvesting and Crafting classes to survive financially. You can get by fine by farming and doing Combat Leves. Not levelling the harvesting classes is pretty dumb though as it lets you hit up the gathering nodes while farming.

[Ziero]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

1. Gear is equippable by any class. You just lose the stat bonuses for equipping sub par gear since well, what does a mage need the strength from Plate or leather for?
2. You are bitching about having to level separate jobs for skills yet you fail to notice you do the exact same thing with the subjob system in FFXI...
3. You can reassign your stats at ANY TIME so if you mess up a stat distribution you can reset it.
4. Mage skills for melee classes are only useful for soloing anyway...The only useful mage skills for a party setting are Stoneskin and Shock Spikes for the tank and guess what? You can get both buffs from the conjurer anyway.
5. You don't need to have Harvesting and Crafting classes to survive financially. You can get by fine by farming and doing Combat Leves. Not levelling the harvesting classes is pretty dumb though as it lets you hit up the gathering nodes while farming.

1) Mages and Melee will still need different gear.
2) I'm bitching about the idea that to get parties you'll have to be able to be both a mage or a melee when some people only prefer one or the other. I personally hate magic so I avoid it, but I'll certainly level multiple melee classes. But the game shouldn't "make" me play a mage if I don't like mages, even FFXI didn't force that on people.
3) There is still a time limit, so if you were running around with your stats speced for Mining then adjusted them for DD when you got a party, but they want you to be a healer, well that's gonna suck(depends on the limit though, I've heard 15 minutes and I've heard 3 hours). But the game does seem to push towards more of a balanced stat distribution system so it doesn't seem like that will be too terrible in the long run.
4) I don't know much about the mage classes myself, but I thought attaching affinity skills in conjunction with the right class abilities boost the effectiveness of sub-class abilities? Or is this something that's just not in the beta yet?
5) I'm sure at some point crafting and gathering will allow a player to have a far better cash flow then simple farming. Especially now that NMs are relegated to Guildleves only. But then again, maybe Gil in and of itself won't be as important in the long run as it was in XI. Also, it'd be nice to be able to repair your own gear.

[Malacite]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

Gear is equippable by any class. You just lose the stat bonuses for equipping sub par gear since well, what does a mage need the strength from Plate or leather for?

You're still going to end up with multiple sets because some gear is more ideal than others. Not to mention that each crafting and gathering class = -2 inventory.

You can reassign your stats at ANY TIME so if you mess up a stat distribution you can reset it.

It doesn't do them all at once only in chunks, and there is a restriction on it.

Mage skills for melee classes are only useful for soloing anyway...The only useful mage skills for a party setting are Stoneskin and Shock Spikes for the tank and guess what? You can get both buffs from the conjurer anyway.

Err, wrong again. The MP recovery abilities are potential life savers.

You don't need to have Harvesting and Crafting classes to survive financially. You can get by fine by farming and doing Combat Leves. Not levelling the harvesting classes is pretty dumb though as it lets you hit up the gathering nodes while farming.

Yeah, if you don't mind being at the mercy of the community at large.

[Kailea]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

2) I'm bitching about the idea that to get parties you'll have to be able to be both a mage or a melee when some people only prefer one or the other. I personally hate magic so I avoid it, but I'll certainly level multiple melee classes. But the game shouldn't "make" me play a mage if I don't like mages, even FFXI didn't force that on people.

uummm FFXIV does not force you to play both mage and melee -.-

[Raydeus]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

No RDM, no Raydeus in XIV!

Btw is there anything resembling AFs in the game after all?

[Ziero]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

Not to mention that each crafting and gathering class = -2 inventory.

Oh you'll be losing a lot more then 2 inventory for every crafting and gathering class eventually. There's no way they won't have their own sets of specialized armor and gear, as well as various different tools that serve different purposes. These skills aren't being pegged as full on classes just to look pretty, these things are full on classes, with their own quests, their own abilities and in time most certainly their own specialized gear.

uummm FFXIV does not force you to play both mage and melee -.-

I think if you want to party in FFXIV, you're inevitably going to have to accept you might be asked to change to healer or tank.

Ya see that? Ya see the comments BBQ made where he's stating that people will get the idea in place that to actually play this game you'll have to be able to suit every possible role? Yea, that's what I was arguing against. I never said the game makes you play every role, I was complaining about the idea that the community would force people to play every role in order to get anywhere.

No RDM, no Raydeus in XIV!

Btw is there anything resembling AFs in the game after all?

XI didn't have AF at launch either, prolly won't see anything close to "AF" until a few updates in, if they even ever add any.

[Yellow Mage]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

No RDM, no Raydeus in XIV!

You should be able to get a similar effect from using Conjurer spells on Gladiator, from what I've perused.

But yeah, no Tamarsamar in XIV, either, simply due to being busy with so many other things. Like XI, for example. And if there's anything that XI's checkered past has shown, it's that trailblazing, particularly in a Square-Enix game, is rather overrated.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: FFXIV Tactics: Understanding the Fatigue System

I'm bitching about the idea that to get parties you'll have to be able to be both a mage or a melee when some people only prefer one or the other. I personally hate magic so I avoid it, but I'll certainly level multiple melee classes. But the game shouldn't "make" me play a mage if I don't like mages, even FFXI didn't force that on people.

Party's Good Time > You having a good time
Party's needs > Your wants

The game isn't making you play a mage, but if you want to party with others, party leaders will strongly imply you bring diverse roles to the table. That's going to be part of the culture that forms within this game.

Don't like it? Well, just like the people that wanted to focus on one job and not subjobs in FFXI, you can always go solo. We had plenty of people who thought they were awesome RDMs solo to 75 and never levelled WHM or BLM along the way.

How well do you think those RDMs were recieve din endgame? Some of them didn't see the problem as they believed themselves to be awesome RDM/NINs.

But as far has healers and even support healers go they weren't very popular as players.