HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

[Aeni]

I decided to spend some time comparing having all 8 HQ crafting AF sets to having one, over-melded Patrician's set (replacing the Coatee with the Dodore Doublet as they have identical stats and caps, but the doublet has 1 more safe materia slot)

Essentially I wanted to see how much it would cost if I went for "inferior" melding on the HQ AF sets (which saves me gil on a rough order of 15 to 20 folds on Siren) and foregoing some over-melding in the process to save additional money (If you have bad luck, you can totally ruin your finances trying to meld that first over-meld slot)

Link to the spreadsheet

It turns out that I would spend roughly the same amount of gil for materia and melding on all 8 AF sets compared to a single Patrician's BIS mode ("beese mode" lol) If you have armory space (and why wouldn't you) I would strongly consider foregoing the all encompassing Patrician's and instead invest on HQ Fish Soup to coddle your CP pools and focus on Vintage sets and Level II and III on craftsmanship and command for a pre-end game starting set.

The whole endeavor will likely cost me between 150K and 200K in materia, but if you're with an FC or have great friends, you could trim that back down quite a bit. If you're on a Legacy server, the Level 2 and Level 3 materia markets have all but collapsed due to the fact that everyone practically has max-level crafts, so you can even think about over-melding that Patrician's set with no problems, although on that same thought, it would be just as cheap to go with the whole buffet.

Let me know if there are any errors in calculations. It converted from Office 2010 to Google Docs.

(Please note that there will still be over-melding going on with the accessories as that is beese-mode no matter what your set will be - you can curb down the materia here, but be aware that it will drastically change your total values ... and that's because the accessories only have 1 safe materia while offering a variety of melding combinations - and there is no way around it)

[Malacite]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

2.2 will very likely introduce new crafting gear, so this whole thing is moot as we're gonna have new stuff in a month.

Personally I'm hoping for either unmeldable EX crafter gear for each job, or a new generalist set that has much higher caps (I've only melded my accessories so I'm not losing too much gil by upgrading)

Not to mention we're getting tier V materia as well.

[Aeni]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

2.2 will very likely introduce new crafting gear, so this whole thing is moot as we're gonna have new stuff in a month.

Personally I'm hoping for either unmeldable EX crafter gear for each job, or a new generalist set that has much higher caps (I've only melded my accessories so I'm not losing too much gil by upgrading)

Not to mention we're getting tier V materia as well.

I doubt they will add new crafting gear since they have not mentioned a single instance of new recipes to take advantage of those gears. Right now, I doubt SE wants ilvl 70 gear to be so easily available, but maybe for 2.3 or beyond. New crafting gear will only flood the AH with ilvl 70 gear and no one will want that. NO ONE.

(except for the turds who want easy peasy raiding gear)

[Malacite]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

YP already said 2.2 will introduce NEW item levels, which means 100+ gear, as well as new allagan tomes that may or may not be used for new crafting materials as well as gear (personally I hope not because philo items are a big part of the problem IMO - devalues DoL too much)

Tier 5 materia is coming for certain, and that means we have to have gear that can be converted into it (and he said in the live letter there will be new high level recipes for DoH). We already got some Tier 5 catalysts in the crystal tower quest, so that + the info in the live letter pretty much confirms it.

[Aeni]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

YP already said 2.2 will introduce NEW item levels, which means 100+ gear, as well as new allagan tomes that may or may not be used for new crafting materials as well as gear (personally I hope not because philo items are a big part of the problem IMO - devalues DoL too much)

Tier 5 materia is coming for certain, and that means we have to have gear that can be converted into it (and he said in the live letter there will be new high level recipes for DoH). We already got some Tier 5 catalysts in the crystal tower quest, so that + the info in the live letter pretty much confirms it.

It doesn't confirm anything. Without level cap lifting, it's nearly impossible to balance crafting stats with their current levels. There is way too much inflation at the moment and I doubt this is lost on Yoshi-P. I think they will just renumerate the raiding gear downwards like they did this patch, so that current ilvl 90 will be forced down to 85 or 80, and so forth. Currently, ilvl 70 is the highest gear you can craft and that's a two star rating. The stats become unbalanced and as well as over-melding calculations will be really off when you add in level 5 materia.

I think either (a) level cap increase is coming or (b) all other items are going to get demoted for the new ones (I think the latter is a higher possibility than the former)

[Malacite]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

Again, did you even see the live letter?

Level Cap isn't happening until the expansion (along with new jobs and Egi for SMN) and they've said nothing about lowering item levels, but rather adding new ones. Like I said in my other thread (and lots of people have been screaming on the forums for weeks now) Power Creep is setting in way too early. He basically said that there'd be new item levels, and that the leviathan weapons in particular would be quite powerful (and hard to get).

[Firewind]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

1) He never said what the item levels will be. Plus it wasn't very well translated IIRC since he was talking about adding iLv95 Armour, which is an entirely new iLv for armour. Plus if they are going with the current gear system, we will see Ilv95 gear sidegrades as well.

2) We don't know how hard to obtain the Leviathan Weapons will be. They may well end up being iLv95 sidegrades to the Allagan weapons. Like the Primal Weapons are sidegrades to Relic +1's (And we have Myth and Allagan Armour being sidegrades of the other, and Myth, Allagan and Primal Accessories being sidegrades of the other. We have nothing confirmed yet.

3) If you think that Philo items devalue DoL jobs too much then you haven't got a single DoL class to 50 have you? DoL classes have lucrative things to gather at all levels. Hell I can easily make money on my 21 BOT and 35 FSH without really trying.

4) Power Creep isn't really setting in much if you look at how much there is between an iLv90 and iLv80 piece. Nevermind iLv90 to ilv95. People are just wailing "ERMERGERDPWOACREEP!11111one" because they can't just faceroll anything better than CT Gear with Darklight Accessories, and they are falling even further behind because they don't bother with these wonderful things called Friends Lists and Linkshells. Hilariously these are the same idiots that can't do Turns 1-4 of Coil in Darklight with Relic +1 too like the rest of us had to before CT and the Myth Cap lift.

[Aeni]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

Again, did you even see the live letter?

I did look over the Q&A posted on the official forums (because that's the one that Michael-Christopher Koji Fox aka Fern Halwes has a direct hand in translating and I trust him more than Reinhart) and I didn't see anything that was concrete, other than more of Yoshi-P's "beating around the bush", "known unknowable knowns" regarding future expansion and features.

You also forgot that gears were already demoted this patch (renumeration) I believe there was gear that came from certain dungeons/raid event-ish type encounters that were scaled back because they were too good (or even better in some cases) than hard mode drops. I can't name the specifics because I don't raid, but even I knew that much.

During 2.0sh (Pre 2.1), Yoshi-P had answered questions regarding concerns from the community about stat inflation and he said, and I'll paraphrase, "the developers are really concerned about this and will take such measures when appropriate at that time". One such thing in the tool-kit is stat renumeration. Another is demotion of items of values (e.g., making rare items more common or decreasing the costs of items from vendors) This is pretty much standard playbook for MMOs, although it might be something new for you if you've only had FFXI to draw upon.

[Malacite]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

1) He never said what the item levels will be. Plus it wasn't very well translated IIRC since he was talking about adding iLv95 Armour, which is an entirely new iLv for armour. Plus if they are going with the current gear system, we will see Ilv95 gear sidegrades as well.

2) We don't know how hard to obtain the Leviathan Weapons will be. They may well end up being iLv95 sidegrades to the Allagan weapons. Like the Primal Weapons are sidegrades to Relic +1's (And we have Myth and Allagan Armour being sidegrades of the other, and Myth, Allagan and Primal Accessories being sidegrades of the other. We have nothing confirmed yet.

3) If you think that Philo items devalue DoL jobs too much then you haven't got a single DoL class to 50 have you? DoL classes have lucrative things to gather at all levels. Hell I can easily make money on my 21 BOT and 35 FSH without really trying.

4) Power Creep isn't really setting in much if you look at how much there is between an iLv90 and iLv80 piece. Nevermind iLv90 to ilv95. People are just wailing "ERMERGERDPWOACREEP!11111one" because they can't just faceroll anything better than CT Gear with Darklight Accessories, and they are falling even further behind because they don't bother with these wonderful things called Friends Lists and Linkshells. Hilariously these are the same idiots that can't do Turns 1-4 of Coil in Darklight with Relic +1 too like the rest of us had to before CT and the Myth Cap lift.

1) It specifically said "new". 95 is possible but 100+ is more likely.

2) Leviathan is already looking pretty unfriendly to melee ><

3) I have them all @ 50 and they're pretty much worthless. I can make more money just selling FATE trinkets or grinding dungeons. The situation on your server is clearly far different from Excalibur.

4) That remains to be seen, but the fact that we even have iLv crap already isn't a good sign. WoW didn't do that until Burning Crusade IIRC.

[Mezlo]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

3) I have them all @ 50 and they're pretty much worthless. I can make more money just selling FATE trinkets or grinding dungeons. The situation on your server is clearly far different from Excalibur.

Umm.... what trinkets and dungeon grinding are you doing? I spent 45 minutes - 1 hour crafting and made 120k this weekend. You're doing better than that with that small time commitment? Crafting classes are definitely not worthless...

[Firewind]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

Some FATEs and leves can give lucrative awards depending on what the markets are like, and how many people are jumping on it. Boar Leather from leatherworking leves is a great example.

[Malacite]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

Again, prices are relative to your server.


All the crafted endgame stuff (rose gold, darksteel etc.) are sold at break even if HQ'd, or sometimes even a loss - it's often cheaper to just buy the finished product. All the farmable endgame stuff (gold & darksteel ore, spruce, etc.) are worth jack shit now. Twinthread and Rosegold Nuggets used to be worth a decent chunk but they dropped like rocks too.

Other than maybe food, there isn't a whole lot of profit to be made form DoL + DoH. I make far more gil just grinding dungeons and dailies, particularly if I get lucky with a dungeon chest. It's entirely moronic...

Materia's taken a pretty big dive too. There's too much gil in circulation and too many people like myself who have everything @50 (the undercutting doesn't help either)

[Etra]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

This thread brought to you by Malacite's lack of understanding.

[Firewind]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

Also players like Mal have already declared the game dead when Yoshi-P that a patch that introduces Leviathan would also make the first 5 turns for The Binding Coil of Bahamut and the fight against the Moogle King easier in order to allow lesser skilled players to catch up in content. You know this is despite the fact that this is almost certainly how everything was initially designed and intended, exactly so players can (eventually) see the content and so that it isn't impossible to gear up any replacement members for your static group if necessary.

[Mezlo]

Re: HQ AF versus Patrician's Set

This thread brought to you by Malacite's lack of understanding.

lololololol... if I wasn't lazy, I'd save this into my signature...

- - - Updated - - -

not as lazy as i thought...