To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

[Gentoo]

At my current level, the prey du' jour is crab. While I'm tired of seeing this particular critter, that's not the only vexation they cause me. These things spam their AOE bubble shower like I've seen no other monster spam an AOE move.

When I first started facing these crabs regularly in Kuftal, I'd see the crab ready it's bubble shower AOE. In response I'd hit Divine Seal, start casting erase on some front line melee, and remove the STR down effect right after it landed...
...Only to have the crab immediately peform another bubble shower after my Erase + Divine Veil landed.

Even if I start Erasing the STR Down player by player (starting with the tank), often I'll see another Bubble Shower before I've managed to get past the second player.
(I hate crabs.)

While Erase isn't a huge MP sink, constantly casting it does add up, and I rarely get any down time. Lately my strategy has been to just let Barwatera do it's thing (seems to reduce the amount of time the STR Down lasts), and keep the tank free of the status effect. If I happen to have Divine Seal handy, and the crab is really close to death, and it's recently performed a Bubble Shower move (most likely it has), I'll let Divine Veil + Erase do it's thing.

This is perhaps a n00b issue, but I'm confounded. There's got to be a better strategy for this that I'm missing.

[Icemage]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

Simple solution: Ignore it. It's not that big a deal, and costs you MP better spent on Dia II or Haste.

More important: Use Barwatera. Bubble Shower's main drawback is the area effect damage, not the -STR effect.

The only exception to this is Monks (and to a lesser extent, Puppetmasters using H2H). Because Hand-to-Hand attacks are affected much more by changes to STR than other melee attacks, it's a good idea to Erase away STR down on Monks as soon as is convenient.


Icemage

[AngryUndead]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

The only exception to this is Monks (and to a lesser extent, Puppetmasters using H2H). Because Hand-to-Hand attacks are affected much more by changes to STR than other melee attacks, it's a good idea to Erase away STR down on Monks as soon as is convenient.

Amen!

[Macht]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

Yeah, Icemage said it all. The -Stat on most spells isn't that bad of a problem it's usually the other effects or frequency that the spells have or are done.

Erase is better spent on effects like Attack Down, Evasion Down, Paralyze, Petrify. Mobs with those types of attacks don't usually activate them as badly as what you'd get from Bubble shower, so Erase + Divine Veil is better spent on them.

[Murphie]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

Plus, when you use Divine Veil the entire party thinks you're awesome (well, they do if they have any sense). And nothing beats looking impressive.

But yeah, don't worry too much about some of those abilities that they spam. Worry about the ones that really have a huge impact on the party.

[Fynlar]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

Don't use Divine Veil on this, it's a waste of your Divine Seal. DV is best used not against moves that are regularly spammed (because as you say, the status just gets put right back on 5 seconds later), but against those chance situations where a status effect that actually matters gets inflicted on more people than you would like... such as after fighting a ghost mob that does its stupid Cursega move; or when fighting a Tavnazian Ram, someone screws up hate and ends up hitting multiple people with its Petrify Breath thingy. Keep Divine Seal for Curaga to patch up the party after a series of Bubble Showers, that way you KNOW you're doing some good.

STR down is overall a minimal effect, and the STR reduction even decreases over time. It has NOTHING on the ATK down status (there's a reason why people don't EXP on triple bats or leeches, ATK down seriously hampers the melees). I don't know if the STR down overwrites itself (for instance, if it starts out at say, -10 STR, it weakens to -5 STR, and the crab does Bubble Shower again, does it go back up to -10 STR?), but overall, focusing too much effort on trying to remove this effect is a waste of time and MP. Erase your lowest dmg/hit DDs (like MNK and THF) to try to help them avoid hitting for 0's, but other than that, just let it run its course. It's far less stress and will save you MP in the long run.

Double Post Edited:

Erase is better spent on effects like Attack Down, Evasion Down, Paralyze, Petrify.

Just as a note, Erase does diddly squat on Paralyze and Petrify. Erase doesn't remove any status that there's already a -na spell for.

I say this in part because there was a WHM I saw in Lufaise Meadows a couple days ago that kept trying to use Erase against the ram's petrify attack.

[Gentoo]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

Thanks for the answers. I guess I was making much ado about nothing, and it looks like the best course of action is the one I'd already resigned myself to.

[Nakti]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

Erase is better spent on effects like Attack Down, Evasion Down, Paralyze, Petrify.

Just to clarify...unless SE changed this in the last update...Erase doesn't work on any bad status which is cured by a -na spell.

Paralyze => Paralyna
Petrify => Stona

Attack Down, Evasion Down => Erase

Otherwise, good thread and good points. But I don't have Erase yet... >.> ...What? ...Why are you looking at me funny?

[TheGrandMom]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

Just as a note, Erase does diddly squat on Paralyze and Petrify. Erase doesn't remove any status that there's already a -na spell for.

I say this in part because there was a WHM I saw in Lufaise Meadows a couple days ago that kept trying to use Erase against the ram's petrify attack.

LOL I saw a whm on my server doing the same thing! I was like WTF did you buy that account!?? But yes, Paralyna for Paralyze and Stona for Petrify, not Erase.

[Murphie]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

But do remember that you can use (not waste) a Divine Veil to do a quick AOE removal of those particularly nasty status effects, depending on the casting time/MP usage of the removal spell. With something as innocuous and easy to remove as Blind, I found that it was just faster and more efficient to remove them individually. But spells like Paralyna take a while to cast, and are really necessary asap, so I was more than happy to use Divine Seal on those to remove AOE statuses.

Really it just comes down to using your judgement. Don't just automatically do what everyone else tells you - figure out what works best for you and your party and go with that.

[Tirrock]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

I always get confused when people use divine veil for poisona/paralyna. Both spells have a really fast cast/recast time...it's a total waste. Even stona cast/recasts fast. On rams, I save divine seal for their max HP down move.

As for MNK...during the 50's I'd definately suggest erasing STR down off of them. MNKs get a ton more powerful in the 50's, but it's so hard to notice until you stop hitting crabs. High DEF/VIT monsters vs low base damage weapons...MNK/THF/NIN get the most benefit from erase there.

Honestly though...I didn't notice the STR down from bubble shower as much as I noticed scissor guard. I hate that TP move.

[Murphie]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

Well, it's been about a year since I've used WHM, maybe I'm thinking of a different status removal spell? Regardless, (as I mentioned in my post) I used my judgement in regard to when to use Divine Seal/Veil. If the party was going well, I rarely needed Divine Seal to throw out a huge cure or curaga, so I didn't mind using DV. Otherwise the ability would have just sat there unused. But in a party where I found myself often needing a little extra boost to my cures and curagas, I just threw out my status removals as fast as possible, and let those who had a problem with being low on the removal chain deal with it.

[Jei]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

Icemage

[Feenicks]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

I always get confused when people use divine veil for poisona/paralyna. Both spells have a really fast cast/recast time...it's a total waste. Even stona cast/recasts fast. On rams, I save divine seal for their max HP down move.

I agree with regards to Poisona and Paralyna, but for AOE Petrify and AOE Virus, Divine Veil is a godsend purely because you're getting potentially six times the effectiveness for the MP cost of one. Especially for Viruna, since it costs 48 MP a pop.

But with regards to the original post, the only things that should take Erase priority are things like Def Down, Atk Down, Acc Down, Max HP/MP Down and Spider Web.

[avhmia]

Re: To Erase or not to Erase -- or how to Erase?

When it comes to crabs, if you have a nin tanking, I would suggest erasing them right away as well. Even a good nin can start having a little hate control issue when their katana swings start bottoming out... especially if you have a RDM or BRD that's a bit slow with dispel. Of course, as a WHM, it's good to train yourself to see any mob TP move and immediately think, "How will that effect the tank?"