About raises and home points...

[Koyasha]

In leveling several classes, I've found something very annoying about the 20-30 group of players.. They waste huge amounts of my time wanting raises, when they're bound nearby and could easily run back, wasting neither my time (the group) or the white mage's time. This is particularly noticeable in Qufim and Kazham, where the time it takes to run back from a death is less than it takes for the resurrection weakness to wear off (point in case, me and a couple other party members died - I released instantly, one of them got a raise, I was back over a minute before their resurrection weakness wore off). Especially in Kazham, where people generally die less than 30 seconds from their bind point.

Now I'm leveling my White Mage, so my question is this.. Do you people indulge these fools and give them raises? And if you do, *why*? It's clearly a waste of your MP, a waste of their party's time, and serves no useful purpose whatsoever. And I don't consider the exp saved to be a valid reason, it's inconsequential at these levels. Infact, a quick look at a chart shows that even at level 50, the difference between being raised and not, is a mere 154 exp, which any competent party can pull in with one, or two mobs. At 52 the difference goes to 300 exp, but more importantly, Raise II has a difference of 600 exp, which is *finally* worth the time, in exp terms.

Admittedly, at level 50 I doubt anyone will be fighting near enough to their home point for running back to be more useful, and that's where I see Raise actually having a purpose - getting the person back to the fight quickly, if they are far from their home point - but I'm talking about people who die in the next zone over from their home point, and insist on waiting for raises.

[riceburner4540]

depending on how i'm feeling...if i'm accepting raise requests while on whm, you can find me with search and ask....but if it gets out of control or i want to concentrate solely on leveling, i stop a majority of the requests with /anon. as for why people don't just respawn even though they're 30 seconds away from HP and can easily run back within 2 minutes and instead, wait 5 minutes for (raise) weakness to wear off? simply put, they're idiots. thats why i HATE qufim and kazham...

when i was lvling blm in qufim, often times our party would be without a whm. shit happens and someone dies...instead of respawning and running back, that person would waste 15 minutes waiting for a whm to arrive then an additional 5 minutes for raise weakness to wear off...instead, they could have easily respawned and ran back within 5, 10 minutes tops and easily regained the lost exp. these people are (imo) inconsiderate of their fellow party members. most won't even listen to reasoning -_-;; til they learn, u will always receive n00b requests for raises. do what i do, type /anon.

[SkaBoss]

I'm glad to do raises for people who ask, especially if I get a tip This seems to be happening more and more frequently. Even if it's only 500 gil, that's 500 more than I had before, and for almost no work.

[Mookie]

I've thought about the same thing.
Countlesstimes have I seen someone die and they ask for a raise.

They are willing to wait 5-10 minutes for a WHM to get on location, and then wait several more minues to be unweakened just so they could save 1 fight worth of exp.

In the time wasted, they could have gained atleast 5x the amount of exp that they recieved back from the Raise.

[Miriamel]

I know where you are coming from. I was helping LS members get their Kazham keys in Palborough two days ago.

We were on the third floor killing Quadavs when I get a raise request. First I decline telling them the reason, but then eventually they start bugging the rest of my PT members who start encouraging me to do it.

So I thought "Oh what the heck" and head to the location where the dead person was supposed to be. Turns out he's on the second floor, not on the third. I tell them just to release to homepoint (which was Bastok), but they continue shouting for a raise. *sigh* We're talking about level 20 people here.



One other time I was farming in La Theine Plateau (in that 'secret' location with the hovering flowers) when I get a raise request from the Ronfaure entrance to La Theine.

Some 30-ish red mage keeps bugging me to raise this level 10 with homepoint San d'Oria. I tell him it would be much more of an effort to go there and raise the lv10 + weakness than for them to release to HP and get their ~50 EXP they would have saved by a raise back.

However, he kept saying how he would -always- raise someone once he hits 38, just because they ask.

I wish him fun.

[Issaac]

Im raising always. If i have business to do im anonymous. If i feel i have time im not anoymous and im willing to go there and raise. Why? If they ask me to raise they do it because they are kind of despairing. If this makes sense or not does not count. They feel they need me and so im willing to help.

Only thing i hate if i run through the zone and when i arive there is nobody to raise I had only one time that a lvl 10 asked me to raise in Latien Platoue. He came from Windhurst on his way to San Dorian and unreasonable he didnt set home point on his way.


Butto be honest, i dont understand them either. Espezialy in Qufim and Valkum Dunes. If Qufim is under beastman control it can be nasty to get back. But ifyou are able to bind at tower its just silly to waste your time, waiting for a raise.

[Straith]

God yes this bugs me. Leveling my blm sub for whm in valkrum the other day (usually make a point of avoiding this zone, dunno why I took the invite), and our party wasnt the best, but we were still managing to take down 200xp mobs here and there. People would die occasionally, aggro control was bad, and the non-blinking ninja with provoke took hits like paper... and the group would sit there and wait 10-15 mins for them to beg for a raise and for their raise effects to wear off.

At one point the entire group wiped... I clicked back to my home point, got back to our camp, buffed, ate a pie and medded to full.. and they were still waiting on the whm to come raise them to get a whopping 75exp or so back and wait another 5 mins for effects. (not to mention the raiser's med time to get enough mana for 5 raises) Never mind the fact that if all had clicked to HP, we could have made 500+ exp by the time they were ready again. To top it all off, when the whm showed to raise, they acted like -I- was the ignorant one for not waiting for raise.

[amphibius13]

Sometimes, I figure that these people ask surviving party members to look for a raise for them out of spite (make the party leader sweat a bit or something like that). Most probably, these people blame the rest of the party for their death.

I've experienced one such person at Qufim. I was with a pretty good party doing gobs inside the tower near the entrance. Unfortunately, we ended up with linked gobs and me (whm/blm) and our blm got killed. I respawned immediately and shurged the death off (we were getting really good exp then) but the blm DEMANDED that our leader look for a raise for him. While waiting, he wouldn't stop berating our thf for not leaving the linked gobs alone for the blm to put to sleep Suffice to say, I got to join the party at the tower way before the blm's weakness went away...

Amphibius

[Morin]

About losing xp when you die...I'm kind of confused here. When I die I usually HP back if the HP is pretty close. However, how much xp do you usually lose? My character usually loses around 500-700 xp when I die. Yesterday while playing my lvl 30 character, I was aggrod twice and lost a combined 1100 xp.

[Akari]

I usually raise people if I pass by or am going that way. I agree ive been near the top of delkfault tower and get raise requests from people in Quifm. Also the shouting in valk is getting annoying I dont know whats worse the fact that lots of these people dont reset their hp or the ones that do and still shout to save their exp. I agree raise is really on good for saving someone a walk back other then that its a waste of time.

[Issaac]

Originally posted by Morin
About losing xp when you die...I'm kind of confused here. When I die I usually HP back if the HP is pretty close. However, how much xp do you usually lose? My character usually loses around 500-700 xp when I die. Yesterday while playing my lvl 30 character, I was aggrod twice and lost a combined 1100 xp.

You loose 10% of the lvl always. So i need 7700 exp for lvl 50 (unsure if it was 7500 or 7600), i loose 770 exp. Raise gives back 25% of the exp so i get back 192 exp points. Thats one mob in a good group. Even at lvl 50 it is not worth it to wait for a raise if your homepoint is nearer then the rezzer. But mostly as a lvl 50 you are far away from any homepoint.

[Morin]

Thanks for the INFO Isaac! I never knew, but now I'm a little all the wiser.

[specular]

Hmm, I look at this a little different:

- I'm not that stressed for optimal XP per hour { but there are limits :spin: }
- Call me crazy, but it's nice when you have a great party where unfortunately someone dies and you get this person a raise. Something like team spirit.

A lot of times the person that dies will send a /p like this : "Well thanks for the pt guys, guess I got a quick warp home. See ya!" End of party: search for a pickup, or quit.


Something else: I remember reading that dying (zero HP & respawning) is really bad for your Nations influence. When you are dead (unconscious ) and you get raised, this effect will be less negative.

[Koyasha]

It's not 10%.. The chart at http://www.shadow-dragons.com/jobs.htm is pretty much accurate. It seems like similar to 10%, but it's clearly not quite a 10% penalty, sometimes it's a bit more than 10%, sometimes a bit less. That chart also indicates Raise II exp regain, I often check it when deteriming whether or not it's worth waiting for a raise, and also just after I level (to determine exactly how much 'safety exp' I need in order to not lose my level on death).

I hadn't thought of the national influence thing. I wonder if raise mitigates that, or if the death itself is what counts. I heard it was just dying, regardless of what happens after, that makes your nation lose influence a bit.

And I'm glad to see that many of ye agree. I just wish people would be a lot more logical in the way they think about things. This isn't EQ with 96% exp regain on resurrection, after all. =p

[thiophene]

All the information on the shadow dragons site says you lose 10% exp tnl exactly (starting at level 4)

...Until level 25 where it changes.