new warrior traits and sub job discussion

[Throgar]

crit attack bonus at lvl 78
shield def bonus lvl 80
fencer -> more crits when only using mainhand lvl 45

so warrior is getting a crit machine now? maybe it would be better to get a lot of dex now instead of str only.


now to sub jobs:

sam:
sekanoki from lvl 60 to lvl 40 -> warrior skillchain madness? :D

dnc:
reverse flourish gets available, so we get tp back for using steps.
dual wield is also available, maybe dual wield warrios have a comeback?
and fencer + shield def bonus might make tanking even more viable?

nin:
only the elemental wheel gets available.


i realy like the changes to war, dancer and sam. those are my also my most loved subs for war.
what do you think?

[Armando]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

maybe it would be better to get a lot of dex now instead of str only.

Probably not.

Also keep in mind that Restraint takes away crits for a while.

[Ziero]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

Because of War's crappy shield skill (C rank), this new trait won't suddenly make "sword and board" tanking all that viable compared to other jobs. Plds also get the same trait as well as a buttload of more spells/traits/abilities, Mnks and Sams also get new defensive boosts letting them tank better as well. Maybe War/Dnc with axe/shield will be better off for soloing, but just boosting the damage reduction from shield blocks won't help them tank any better then they already can now.

The fact that War's Fencer trait is also at a subbable level means other jobs will get the same boosts too in time.

As for /sam sub, when do you have more then 100tp to begin with? Sekkanokai will be nice and all, but it's not game changing.

Also, the new JA literally overwrites the two new traits. You end up having to choose between getting stronger crits and normal WS, or stronger WS and no crits at all. Which imo, is fairly fail.

I mean yea, it's some nice stuff, better then Retaliate and the G2 Merit JAs, but there's nothing really majorly game changing or boosting here.

Having said all that, if there does end up being a viable way to have War be a successful and efficient main tank to the point where it would be able to stand up with the 'big three' again, I'd gladly level whatever sub was needed to do so. I just hope that sub doesn't end up being Dnc....

[LeonstrifeLEV]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

Raging Rush skillchains with itself.

[Ziero]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

That's nice and all, but is the L2 SC really worth withholding TP until you're at 200? I mean, I love me some Frag and all, but that's a long time to hold back.

[Takelli]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

Sam:
sekanoki from lvl 60 to lvl 40 -> warrior skillchain madness? :D

BOOO! HISSSSS!!!!!

Fuck this! SE just took away a sam only ability that made SAM what it should be!

[Armando]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

I guess you're only a SAM once every 5 minutes.

[LeonstrifeLEV]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

That's nice and all, but is the L2 SC really worth withholding TP until you're at 200? I mean, I love me some Frag and all, but that's a long time to hold back.

It's the same speed but - a hit because you didnt use the first 100 tp to weapon skill to get at the next 100tp. so yes.

Edit: /highfives Armando.

[Truece]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

That's nice and all, but is the L2 SC really worth withholding TP until you're at 200? I mean, I love me some Frag and all, but that's a long time to hold back.

Seems worth it to me. Which does more damage, doing 2 weaponskills @ 100% TP, or, doing 2 weaponskills back-to-back @100% TP with some added skillchain damage?

The argument to holding TP before was simply that damage from a 200 TP weaponskill did not keep up with the damage from 2 100 TP weaponskills. Now, that extra 100 TP isn't going to waste.

I'm looking forward to trying this out, for sure!

[Armando]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

The argument to holding TP before was simply that damage from a 200 TP weaponskill did not keep up with the damage from 2 100 TP weaponskills. Now, that extra 100 TP isn't going to waste.

This.

Frag will do 60% of the WS's damage. So it's 2.6 100 TP WS under optimal conditions vs 2. Sure, you can get 1/2 resisted or 1/4 resisted, but it's still better.

You can also use Sekkanoki to do a 3 WS SC with only 2 people for even more power, if the mob has a lot of HP.

[Takelli]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

I guess you're only a SAM once every 5 minutes.

No. Its that Sam and Dnc should be the ONLY jobs that can self SC.

[Armando]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

SAM was never about self-SC. It didn't get Sekkanoki 'til later. It USED to be about having a TP gain fast enough to SC with two partners and have two SCs/MBs going on in the party instead of just one, and having a SC compatibility so high you can work with practically any other DD. You know, back when BLMs got party invites and DD'ing was about teamwork and knowing your Skillchains instead of mashing WS macros at 100 TP over and over.

Self-SC is mostly a newfangled display of e-peen; people use it more for novelty factor than anything else, since most people don't really grasp SC mechanics. They just want to feel special for having the exclusive ability to make pretty graphics pop up solo.

You also forgot BLU, which will also occasionally self-SC in occasions where closing someone else's SC with a TP'd up spell would be better.

[Ziero]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

BOOO! HISSSSS!!!!!

Fuck this! SE just took away a sam only ability that made SAM what it should be!

Guess how many Job Specific abilities war will have left after the cap hits 99.

P.S. It's two. Neither of them being all that special.

Welcome to our world.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

Self-SC is mostly a newfangled display of e-peen; people use it more for novelty factor than anything else, since most people don't really grasp SC mechanics. They just want to feel special for having the exclusive ability to make pretty graphics pop up solo.

Not exactly.

As a Hagun user, Sekkanoki WS means I lose quite a bit of oomph on WS, making it more suitable as a SC opener than closer. As a non-Windower player, I don't see other DDs' TP--and in fast paced fights, keep asking for TP reports is a pain.

As I can self-SC Darkness and close with my highest damage WS (Gekko), it makes a lot of sense to do that. It's like doubling my Gekko damage with a bonus of Rana on top.

I've worked with a friend on his SAM to cooperatively creating three step Light with each other, and that's definitely a better use of the ability (especially when combined with Shikikoyo). However, it's just difficult to achieve that kind of coordination with random people.

In a large Dynamis LS, where many DDs may WS at any moment, intentional SC with other people becomes impractical. Actually, my self-SC gets interrupted enough that I often forgo Rana and just use Gekko with Sekkanoki, hoping someone would see it and close with Kasha if they are going to WS before my own Kasha.

(Yukikaze > Gekko would probably net better damage, but if I'm going to WS twice in rapid succession as SC requires, I'd like to have a chance of paralyzing the monster.)

[LeonstrifeLEV]

Re: new warrior traits and sub job discussion

Oh man, Restraint> Steel Cyclone. Sounds QQ worthy indeed.