War- War/nin, Pld/war, Drg/war?

[Fandyien]

As a level ten Mithran Warrior, I am having trouble deciding which advanced class to take. I was originally going to take PLD, so I have my sword skill maxed, but PLD seems like it might be a bit like re-playing Warrior, and what I really want is a fun class. Which of these combinations would be most fun/effective for me as a Mithran Warrior?

DRK/WAR
DRG/WAR
SAM/WAR
NIN/WAR
RNG/NIN
PLD/WAR

As I said before, it seems kind of like PLD might not be the most fun job, and NIN seems quite interesting, as does DRK and DRG.

One other thing, on the side.

Would DRK/NIN, DRK/DRG, DRK/PLD, or PLD/DRK work?

[stabby]

I have to put in a word for taking WAR all the way -- just because the advanced classes exist does not mean that they're more fun or better than the basic ones, they just get more attention. Of course, if you don't think WAR is a 'fun' class, then any melee is probably going to bore you a bit. If your main objection is to tanking, however, I fully sympathize.

As to your list of choices:
DRK/WAR: An excellent combo until the mid-60s, when the availibility of fuidama from THF sub for hate control becomes more important than the extra damage provided by Berserk and Double Attack. See the sticky sub thread in the DRK forum for more details.

DRG/WAR: DRGs are, unfortunately, a bit out of favor these days. Personally, I find that their real utility only shines through when they're grouped with a THF for easy Distortion renkeis. DRG is rather expensive to make worthwhile -- the gear that they need to perform up to par with WARs and DRKs is a fair bit more expensive (Scorpion Harness vs. Hauberk, pretty much).

SAM/WAR: Again, somewhat out of favor, works well with a THF in the party. Also fairly expensive, but most of the cost is expensive Great Katanas and Ochiudo's Kote. Fairly fun to play if you dig skillchains, though.

NIN/WAR: If you're not interested in tanking (and your misgivings about PLD seem to imply that), you probably won't like NIN. Counting Utsusemi shadows for recast and praying that you can hold onto hate is pretty much the meat of this class. Like WAR tanking, works best if you have a THF in the group to staple aggro to you.

RNG/NIN: Big damage, big costs. This is probably the most expensive class combo in the game, as both your defensive and offensive capabilities are determined by how much gil you're willing to plow into it. May get boring after a while -- a friend of mine played it to 40 and went back to Red Mage, because "there's only so many times you can hit ranged attack and giggle over your huge damage".

PLD/WAR: As a mithra, your low vitality puts you at the lower end of desirability for PLDs, but that can be made up for with gear, easily (my set party's PLD is mithra, and we've not had problems). Again, if you don't like tanking, you're probably not going to enjoy PLD.

The 'odd' combos:
DRK/NIN: After 74, /NIN is the defacto utility sub for HNM fights, not for dual-wielding, but for Utsusemi: Ichi and Utsusemi: Ni. Outside of that situation, it's a bit of a waste compared to /WAR or /THF.

DRK/DRG: This combo doesn't really get you anything at all. /DRG may be the worst sub in the game. I highly discourage its use, unless you're doing Ballista (even then, it's just to be silly) or just screwing around with your friends.

DRK/PLD: /PLD gives you nothing that you want as a DRK. You shouldn't be getting hit, so the added defense is unimportant, and the paltry array of cure spells you gain access to won't really get you anything but hate that you don't want. Take a sub that helps you damage or control hate instead.

PLD/DRK: PLDs without provoke are complete gimps. End of story.

Note that all of my comments are directed at party play -- if you want to solo your way to 75 with whatever whackass job combo you want, feel free to try. It is, however, courteous to be as effective as you can when you're playing with other people, which means checking your gimp sub at the door.

[Fandyien]

I have a few more questions, and you seem quite intelligent and willing to answer them.

Which of those class combinations will have the easiest time finding parties? I spent all day today in Valkurm dunes, either standing around hoping to get grouped up, or being dead. Anyway, it seems to me that there are far to many WARs and other tanks and not nearly enough WHMs to handle the load.

Also, should I use a variety of different weapons? Right now the only weapon I have used since day one is a sword/shield combination, and, while it ups my defense, it seems as if I wont have any flexibility class-wise later on. Should I switch around weapons? Perhaps between a sword/shield combination and scythe/dagger/G. sword.

I had been giving a good deal of thought to going MNK, or at least subbing MNK at level 18 for the HP/ATTCK bonuses, as well as boost. However, it seems that my ideal, most effective combination as a Mithra would be DRK/THF. That comment aside, I would really like to know what the most viable subjob for levels 18-30 would be for a WAR going PLD. My general plan goes as follows, but its up for revision.

Levels 1-18
WAR, keep armor up to date and wield only a sword/shield for PLD later on.

Levels 18-30
Switch to MNK/WAR, and level MNK up to 15. Switch back to WAR, and be WAR/MNK to level thirty, with Sword/shield equipped perpetually.

Levels 30-60
At level thirty, get PLD quest. Level PLD/WAR up to level 60 with as many skills maxed as possible, keep armor updated.

Levels 60-75
Level up PLD/WAR to 75, try out other classes on the side. Try out NIN, RNG, and DRG.

My problem with having the MNK class so intricately involved in my game is experience is the MNK weapons. It seems that having MNK as my sub may give me a few bonuses, but as far as weapon levels it would only help me with Hand/Hand combat. However, with THF, I would easily be able to level up Dagger, perhaps for later use with NIN.

Essentially, I want to keep flexibility with my weapons as well as my classes in mind, but stick to either tanking or DMG dealing.

Something I figured I would add at the end- Is Red Mage a class that gets an acceptable amount of invites and is also fun?

Plus, from a purely aescetic stance, Mithra look damn good in the Red Mage AF armor.

[Fandyien]

Also, as long as I am here, would continuing with WHM have a good, enjoyable future as well as guranteed parties? I just dont like the lack of equipment and the instant death in one to two hits.

[stabby]

But the other children picked me last for kickball...
As a generic melee (DRK/WAR, WAR/anything, MNK/WAR, SAM/WAR, DRG/WAR, RNG/NIN), you will likely spend anywhere from 0 minutes to 6 hours sitting on your ass in Jeuno, waiting for an invite. Sometimes people want you, sometimes people don't.

Tank varieties (PLD/WAR, NIN/WAR, WAR/[MNK|NIN], in general order of percieved desirability) will have a better chance at getting groups, but may still end up having issues, depending on your server dynamics and whether there's a tank shortage in your level range.

What should I hit things with?
It is my firm belief that if you're not using Greataxe or Axe as a Warrior, you're unfairly gimping yourself. I can understand wanting to keep leveling Shield up if you plan to go PLD, as it's one of the slower skills in the game, along with Guarding and Parrying. If that's the case, I recommend skilling up Axe to a point where you can use it in XP parties reasonably (at your level, you should be able to get it to 30ish with little problem, just go back and kill the stuff you used to kill until they don't raise your skill anymore, then move on to slightly harder stuff, and so on).

Weapons are easy to skill up, if you start a class at level 1. You don't need to worry about capping things beforehand, especially when it hurts your performance as a warrior. This goes especially for things like dagger, scythe, and greatsword -- sure, you could use them, but the weaponskills suck compared to Greataxe/Axe (Shield Break works wonders at low levels, and Sturmwind is the most damaging WS in the game up until 41 when MNKs get Raging Fists), and you'll be doing less damage with them than you could be.

Secondary education
18-30, I highly recommend subbing MNK. THF gets you precisely *nothing* until it reaches level 15, and it's a pain in the rear to level, too. Having THF subbed would not increase your ability to level up dagger, and I'm not sure why you would want to -- the only class that really makes use of it is THF (starting around 25, when you can get Federation Knives), and you can skill that up on your own while playing THF (for reference, NIN uses katanas, which are an entirely different weapon class, which only they can use).

Basically, don't sub a class for the +STR/VIT/DEX/AGI it provides -- until the 60s, the difference between melee subs is all but meaningless (1-2 points, total) -- and don't sub it for the weapons it gives you: as a WAR, you can easily skill up whatever you feel like, but in XP parties, you'll probably want to use either your best two-handed weapon (Greataxe), or a shield and your best one-handed weapon (Axe) if you want to be the most effective WAR you can be. Instead, sub a class for the abilities that it will give you -- MNK gets you Boost at WAR10, and Counter at WAR20, which are both great for tanking (the former for generating aggro every 15 seconds, the latter for reducing the damage you take and hurting the monster simultaneously). THF sub gets you Steal and Gilfinder at WAR10, and those don't really do anything to help your job besides give you the opportunity to annoy your party members with a 'selfish' sub.

Basically, don't worry about weapons. You'll have 'flexibility', but it'll be because you can level any weapon you desire while leveling whatever class it is you intend to use it for.

Regarding your comment about DRK/THF being your ideal combo -- for non-WAR classes below level 60, WAR, in general, beats out THF sub easily. Berserk + Double Attack for constant high damage far outweighs the value of one occasional big hit. After 60, the hate control ability provided by THF30's Trick Attack makes it very much worth pursuing.

As for Red Mage and White Mage, depending on your server's population in your level range, you may have too many invites, or not enough.

[Fandyien]

Well, thank you for all the help.

Today im going to head back to Windurst and buy an Axe, and keep persevering until I can take Paladin as my job.

My last and most worthless question is this- Will a Mithra be gimped as a Paladin? When tanking I die a lot, and it gets quite frustrating, but it often seems as if the Galkan level up much fast and die much less often.

Once again, thanks for all the help. You are a real asset to FFXIonline.com

^^

[stabby]

The dying a lot goes away as you get higher in levels, your healers get more MP, get better at their jobs, and your defensive abilities get better.

At least, in general. I can't make any guarnatees against deaths caused by parties that are put together poorly (hint: if you don't see 2 or 3 mages, you should probably leave).

[modnar]

Just to comment:

"At least, in general. I can't make any guarnatees against deaths caused by parties that are put together poorly (hint: if you don't see 2 or 3 mages, you should probably leave)."

Don't say that!

Its not a rule or a hint or anything that is true "most of the time". Its misleading. There are many party combinations that are realy good depending on mob, lvl, and skill of the players.

I hate it when ppl leave the party because they think that the combination "sucks" and I would KNOW from experience that it is a feasable and decent party combination.

Just because a party does not have 2-3 mages does not mean you will die and you should leave.

[aimeekitty]

THis is a great thread! I just started and currently am off and on playing a Elvaan and a Mithra (both WAR) as a TANK with my white mage friend.

Am I going to have a really tough time in later areas with my Mithra as a WAR TANK? (am I better off just staying with the Elvaan since he does more damage than the Mithra? or does Mithra's fastness and dodging etc kinda make up for their lower damage...?)

Since I've heard kinda bad things about WAR/SAM and DRG in general I was kindof thinking about being a WAR/NIN. Would Mithra make a fun WAR/NIN TANK? (or again, should I be an Elvaan WAR/NIN?)