Gear for TA+DE

[Wise Donkey]

I have a ways to go before I get there, but once I hit 60, and attain Dancing Edge and the Assassin trait, what should be the focus for my TA+DE gear set? Every AGI = +1 weapon DMG, but DE is 30% DEX, according to wiki. Is it a matter of balancing DEX and AGI, or is there greater effect from maxing one or the other out?

Note: I know that I will be putting +Acc in most slots, this is for those slots that I don't have +Acc in.

[Armando]

Re: Gear for TA+DE

At Lv.60, it takes roughly 4 DEX to raise your DMG in DE by 1. On the other hand, it takes 1 AGI to raise the DMG in DE by 1. Because the first hit is a crit, then the extra point of DMG on the first hit is worth roughly twice as much. The DMG from AGI only applies to the first hit, the DMG from DEX applies to the first hit and any further hits that land. So, so far...

1 AGI = 2 "damage"
4 DEX = 2 "damage" + 1 "damage" for every other hit you land.

AGI is adding "damage" on a 1:2 ratio. Those 4 DEX would have to land at least 8 "damage" to match AGI's efficiency. For that to happen, you'd need to land 6 hits other than the first. Not gonna happen, not on average anyways. Even if you average 5 hits (counting the first) on Dancing Edge, those 4 DEX points would only be adding about 6 "damage." In that case, you'd have a 1:1.5 ratio.

What does that mean? 3 AGI = 4 DEX would be a pretty safe estimate.

Note that it's not really a question of balance, it's a question of "what adds more." They're not related in any way, they're completely independent from each other. Just that one adds more point-for-point than the other.

[711rocks]

Re: Gear for TA+DE

I wish we had more gobbie bags availible-would allow for a much better TA set

[Lunaryn]

Re: Gear for TA+DE

I do need to get a better sense of the tradeoffs involved. I'm wondering a little if my overall attack is too low...

I tried experimenting back when my system couldn't quite handle the lag from visible equipment swaps and became unresponsive at critical moments, to see how much I would gain from such swaps. The main thing I managed to verify was the difference between Republic Subligar (Attack +5) and Rogue's Culotte (AGI+4). Despite my expectation, my TA+DEs consistently did less damage using Rogue's Culotte; the AGI+4 didn't seem to be worth the loss in base attack.

I believe I was eating Squid Sushi at the time.

My normal gear for SA/TA:
Chicken Knife
Bone Knife +1
Empress Hairpin
Spike Necklace
Spike Earrings x2
Jaridah Peti
Rogue's Armlets
Sun Ring/Deft Ring
Amemet Mantle (can't remember if I have NQ or HQ...)
Royal Knight's Belt +1
Republic Subligar
Bounding Boots

(I'll probably get myself at least one AGI+3 or AGI+4 ring once my finances are in order, just haven't gotten that worked out yet.)

On what basis should I be evaluating Attack magnitude as compares to ja/ws modifiers? Is this basically the same magnitude numerically (e.g. AGI+4 fails because it was 1-2 dmg short of Atk+5 on each hit) or is there a point of diminishing returns I need to be trying to hit on Attack before AGI becomes the better boost? (I seem to recall something about Attack being capped based on STR, but I don't know where this happens, haven't yet had much luck wrapping my head around the damage formulas. Though I should try again if I can find them.)

[Callisto]

Re: Gear for TA+DE

The ratio between your Attack and the target's Defense is what can become capped, at 2.0 unless they changed it to 2.05 recently(I'm still trying to figure this part out). The likelihood of you having this ratio capped against an XP level mob as THF/NIN is really not that high, so you won't really be getting diminishing returns from stacking more Attack yet.

However, stacking more Attack will only raise the high and low ends of the range of damage values you can output, while AGI will directly turn into higher damage. It seems strange to me that the Atk+5 pants would do more damage than the AGI+4, that really seems off to me, but I haven't leveled THF in ages, and I didn't get it high enough to have Assassin. On paper the AGI+4 would seem like a better piece.

[Lunaryn]

Re: Gear for TA+DE

Yeah, I never could quite figure out what the point where I'd cap is, but do note that I'm a Tarutaru so I have a fairly low STR normally; I've heard that they need to invest in STR more and earlier than other races, but never heard any specifics on when or how much.

[Callisto]

Re: Gear for TA+DE

Ehh I was off point with this post, misread the reply and my brain is broken from a long day of work. Mods, please delete this post if you get a chance.