Emp Pin

[Sweet Tooth]

yes, yes, i relize it is rare/ex but it is also always camped by several people it seems to me. Should i stop all other activites or could i just camp for it when im lfp or extermly bored?

[Caspian]

Re: Emp Pin

I'm not qute sure what you're asking. The way I see it, you can do whatever you please. Its by no means required or expected in xp parties. I leveled thf to 30 w/o ever having it. Only reason I have one now is b/c I got RNG to 50 and bought the regular one when it was going for cheap. If you want it really bad then camp it. Otherwise hold off and do it later. (What lvl is your thf btw?)

[Sweet Tooth]

Re: Emp Pin

im 47 atm .. just kinda wanted to know if it was a "must have" Item

Double Post Edited:
DOH! i just relized there was another thred posted similar to this. sorry ><;;

[Myaku]

Re: Emp Pin

While it is not required, I highly recommend getting one. It really is a great piece of gear. There is still some competition for VE, but it is not nearly as hard as it used to be. It is worth the effort, IMHO.

[EntreriSeraph]

Re: Emp Pin

most will tell you that leaping boots/emperor hairpin are NOT must have items, but i disagree.

the empress/emperor pin will be one of your top items, even as you close in on endgame. For solo, it will last you untill optical hat at 70, and for weaponskill it is the best "non-god" item you're able to get.

Ditto on the leaping boots. together, adding a whopping DEX+6 AGI+6 to your weaponskill macro, they honestly make the difference between the uber thieves and the "zomg my viperbite sux" thieves. choose which you want to be, then decide if you want to put in the effort for the items

[Armando]

Re: Emp Pin

Emp. Hairpin and Leaping Boots are not must-have items. They are the best items for the head/feet slot for THF for the majority of the game. That may seem like a contradiction, but the fact of the matter is that the boots and pin are only the best because there's so very little that's of use in those two slots. Most headgears and boots don't really have DD'ing stats at all in the first place.

1 DEX/AGI will, at the absolute most, give you 3 more damage per SATA, and this is with capped Attack. Realistically speaking, roughly 2 more damage (on average) per SATA on EXP mobs. SATA Viper Bite doubles your Attack, so by not having 6 DEX + AGI from the boots and pin, you're missing out on somewhere between 24 and 38 damage per Viper Bite. Given that SATA Viper Bite will usually do around 300 damage, and will have around an 80-100 damage variance, the difference that the boots and pin make are hardly perceivable by mere "eyeballing."

Are they good items? Yes. Will they make a difference? Yes. Will you notice it? Probably not. Worth it? That depends on you. In the end, while it'll probably take you more than one try, it's not terribly hard to get if you're patient. Once you get the pin, you'll probably give it a lot of use. I'd recommend trying to get it if you're serious about THF, but I wouldn't halt my levelling or turn down invites for it.

[EntreriSeraph]

Re: Emp Pin

Though armando, you may have considerable experience as a THF using SATA..

I believe you are underestimating the value of these two pieces. Don't look at it as "only 3 dex and 3 agi" per piece, think of how much these pieces affect your gearset as a whole.

First, keep in mind the added bonus of 10 evasion on the pin. During solo, this boosts a stacked evasion set by a considerable amount, equal to the amount gained from the mighty scorpion harness. Combined with this harness, and the 6 AGI, you're really giving your eva/parry a boost, not to mention your r.acc.

Then think of dex and agi as a whole. you commented that the damage output from the two items is negligible. This is untrue. +25 dex/agi is not nearly as effective as +31 to each. Your critical hits are more frequent, your viperbites are higher, and you evasion and ranged are heightened. I would suggest you go out and try some tests with and without the items, however, if your sig is true, and you are a 22THF...then you will not even be able to equip the pin let alone comment on how good/bad it is. I personally believe these two items are a must have for any thief who wishes to be taken seriously.

I won't kick a thief out for not having them, but they better be damn good at their job to make up for the lack of effort

[Armando]

Re: Emp Pin

Don't have to use it to know the difference it'll make; it's basically a matter of game mechanics. Yes, the 10 Evasion is extremely useful - it's the main reason I bothered to camp it. But for EXP parties, it won't see much use. It is also a fact that for SATA Viper Bite, the most damage you can get out of 1 DEX or AGI is 3 points of damage. Thus, the difference between +25 DEX/AGI and +31 DEX/AGI is somewhere between 12 and 18 points of damage. This is all in accordance with Studio Gobli's formulas, which are very accurate. DEX also has a minimal influence on critical hit rate. Tests on Allakhazam suggest it takes a bit over 10 DEX to see a 1% increase in critical. Hell, Lmnop recently tested Pahluwan Jawshan's "Enhances Critical Hit rate" effect, and without the Jawshan on he had a mere 5% crit rate on Too Weak mobs. 3 DEX isn't going to suddenly make your crit rate increase by 1%.

If there's anything nice about owning both is that you get an extra 3 Accuracy out of that DEX. But even so, the difference between no-pin and hairpin is hardly visible just by eyeballing. It's not that it's not there, but it's like pretending you can see the effects of 5 Attack on your hits. You'd have to actually pay attention and make mental notes of multiple damage numbers with the hairpin and without it to actually see a difference. Perfect example - I was testing out shields some months ago. Size 1 shields reduce damage by 25%. The majority of the damages from shielded hits coincide with the damages from normal hits, and as far as I could tell there was no difference. I had to stop and pay close attention to my min/max damage on both shielded hits and normal hits to see the difference.

[Ziero]

Re: Emp Pin

Voyager Sallet is better head gear IMO, stats that are just as good without the need to swap it out for a better DD piece during TP gain. And for solo I use mountain gaiters(from my nin and war mainly) as the 3 eva and -5 spell interrupt down help more then 3 agi/dex.

Having said that, Emp pin/Leapers are great items to have. Certainly not must haves, but a lvl 30+ thf should have no trouble getting either. A thf/rng is possibly the best camper of these mobs sort of a 50+ Bst/thf. Get them if you can as you WILL get use out of them.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Emp Pin

Voyager Sallet: Lv.41, Rare/Ex off an NM with 21-24 hrs spawn time, need access to Riverne - Site #A01, need an Alliance to take care of all 10 of them.

Empress Hairpin: Lv.24, Rare/Ex off an NM with ~1hr spawn time, only needs access to Valkurm Dunes, and can probably be taken down by a THF30/RNG with Bloody Bolts and Sleep Bolts, a stack selbina milk, and a stack of antidotes.

If Empress Hairpin is considered "optional", I think Voyager Sallet should be barely worth consideration. >_> The hurdle for getting Voyager Sallet is so much higher.

As for Mountain Gaiters... How much is that? I can't see paying millions for Eva+3 and SIR-5% over a free pair of Bounding Boots just for solo'ing as a good idea.