summoner update ideal.

[Bolla]

Re: summoner update ideal.

I like the idea of HP being sacrificed. I mean hell, what do you think they're called blood pacts.

Yes thats correct they should drain their hp bar and not use our mp, but the 2 hour should stay the same.

[Bryn]

Re: summoner update ideal.

I've seen suggested, and like, the idea of additional BP commands similiar to Ward and Rage. For instance:

Blood Pact: Soothe
Healing Ruby
Healing Ruby II
Whispering Wind
Spring Water

Blood Pact: Cripple
Sleepga
Slowga
Lunar Cry
Lunar Roar
Nightmare
Ultimate Terror

Or alternatively, Blood Pact: Tetra. This would control the Lv II and IV spells. So you could do a physical BP, and MB a spell as well, with the TP you've built up.

With 4 Blood Pact commands, a Summoner could do 4 things a minute: Buff, Debuff, heal and deal damage. They'd spend most of their time summoning and controlling their avatar, and only do a little backup healing in between BPs.

Other things which would fix SMN:
Auto Refresh II - Addresses the perp cost issue and mana consumption issues
Enspell - The primes have them. Let them do enspell damage of the appropriate type, that's equal in damage to their normal melee hit. Addresses the issue of avatar melee damage not being worth it, to remove the "Summon, BP, dismiss" issue. Could build TP now, and in conjunction with BP: Tetra, have free room to MB.

[Pteryx]

Re: summoner update ideal.

There really aren't enough heals to justify your Blood Pact: Soothe suggestion, IMO. The idea of further subdividing Rage into the physical and magical pacts, though, would certainly have impressive enough results to make people take the idea of summoner DD seriously below 70, and make the merit pacts worth getting above 70. (No need to limit it to just the wussy black-magic-alikes, after all...) -- Pteryx

[Bryn]

Re: summoner update ideal.

Yeah, I realize that. The thing was, I just wanted a Summoner to have more than 2 things to do every minute, and to have those healing BPs available if needed, regardless of what Ward was used.

And perhaps Cripple might not be as useful. I had hoped it would mean we'd have something available, like Fenrir's dispel, when we needed it. Not be screwed for a minute because we just used a Ward.

If we could split Rage and Wards again, somehow, into 4 commands, that would be enough. Taking the magic BP's out and into Blood Pact: Tetra, would accomplish this. LVII and LvIV spells, as well as the Lv75 merited ones.

[Eiyoko]

Re: summoner update ideal.

Having more Blood Pacts to do every minute is both good and bad. Good because we can do more than just two things at a time, and bad because it'll probably eat our MP alive.

[Bryn]

Re: summoner update ideal.

That's the whole point; to open up more options. You don't have to do more than 1 thing a minute if you don't want to. But right now, there are a lot of BPs that go unused because you can't spare a BP command, since the same few BPs are good.

But what if you could use predator claws to both damage and build TP, then start an SC with Claw, and finish it off with an aero IV MB? MP issues can always be addressed with consumables.

[Pteryx]

Re: summoner update ideal.

MP issues can always be addressed with consumables.

Not in XP parties, they can't. People just don't have enough inventory or gil. If consumables were enough to solve the MP problem, they never would have needed to give RDM Refresh in the first place, and refreshers wouldn't be absolutely required for high-level parties in order for them to spend more time fighting than sitting. That's not even getting into the meleeburn paradigm...

Of course, if you're on some bizzaro server where there's a ninjutsu that restores MP without inflicting Medicated status so you can go /NIN and pop toolbags of 99 Ether-alikes that cost the same as Shihei, by all means, tell me what server it is. -- Pteryx

[Bryn]

Re: summoner update ideal.

I'm referring to the fact that, if there comes a situation where you need to spam BPs (assuming 4 BP commands), you can back it up with meds. Assume Dynamis-like events, HNMs, missions, etc. Although I have partied with people who bring mats for pots or drinks, and make them in the xp party. They'll keep a drink on themselves, and take the occaisonal ether or something to keep chains going.

Hell, RNGs and NINs spend a ton to xp/merit. So it's not like it isn't precedented.

[Eiyoko]

Re: summoner update ideal.

Hell, RNGs and NINs spend a ton to xp/merit. So it's not like it isn't precedented.

That's because to actually do what their job specializes in they actually need that kind of thing. Ammo, ninja tools...kinda required for the job to do what it does best.

As summoner, I've learned to use what I have to the best of my ability. Also, the more MP you spend, the longer it takes to heal it back up once it's all gone.