Summoner/White mage GAH!

[Freedan]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Wow Omniblast, you sound a little upset.

What does it matter to you how others chose to play? You found a comfortable, safe path that has been proven/beloved. Good for you. Now let others play how they want. If you don't like their choices, don't party with them.

As for telling a new player to go get 2 Astral Rings, or any equipment for that matter, before playing a certain job . . . . . . . . Wow, just wow

[Freedan]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

In party play, yes it does ... a party needs people to pull their weight, or the person who isn't is leeching off the ones that are to a lesser or greater extent.

If everyone in the party has to pull their own weight, then can you tell me why there are level 50+ parties with Power Levelers?

[Feenicks]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

This thread needs to die, I think. I can make a summation that:

1) /WHM is generally considered, by the community, the best sub for SMN up to endgame
2) you can sub whatever you like under SMN but you shouldn't complain when people ask you to change, because they have just as much right to try to form a party which they consider most efficient as you do to experimentation
3) analogies can often be taken completely out of control and/or context.

Sub what you like but if it's not what people want then you have to make allowances for a lack of invites or requests to change. Either that or solo for your EXP. Whether or not people are rude about it is an entirely different matter - that's up to their personality.

On top of all that, if you still don't agree with Freedan and Vildar, then don't invite them. They have made it clear that they are sticking to their beliefs which should be fine frankly. Everyone's presented good arguments but in the end, it's their decision as to what they want to do.

[Kirsteena]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

As for telling a new player to go get 2 Astral Rings, or any equipment for that matter, before playing a certain job . . . . . . . . Wow, just wow

Way NOT to read what Omni put... he never suggested that at all.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Wow Omniblast, you sound a little upset.

What does it matter to you how others chose to play?

Um... Most of the upset people are angry (or disgusted) with you because you're not listening, and willfully ignoring sound argument of why /WHM is good by countering with such unimpressive idea as substituting 20MP Blink with a 95MP Aerial Armor, and packing inventory full of stuff you wouldn't need as much simply by using /WHM.

Yes, you're clever enough to come up with all sorts of qusi-workaround for most shortcomings of other support jobs. No, that doesn't mean you're smart to pick something other than /WHM--the SMART thing to do is to choose the support job with most benefits and the fewest pitfalls, THEN equip yourself to address the shortcomings.

The anger will die down fast if you can just admit this: "Well, with the game as it's designed, /WHM is better for party and most solo'ing--but if I solo on something else it's OK and won't hurt anyone else." Heck, if you do that, I'll /clap.

You found a comfortable, safe path that has been proven/beloved. Good for you. Now let others play how they want. If you don't like their choices, don't party with them.

Go back and read how many people say some variation of "fine, go solo that if that's what you want to sub". You're the one who keep picking fights with the forum.

Just don't mess up the newbies with your bizarre advocacy.

As for telling a new player to go get 2 Astral Rings, or any equipment for that matter, before playing a certain job . . . . . . . . Wow, just wow

See above about "you're not listening", and re-read Omniblast's post again--he said no such thing, and didn't even come close to implying it.

* * *

What I truly don't get is this: what's to hate about /WHM? Status removal -na spells, Sneak, Invisible, Cure, Blink, Stoneskin, Regen, Auto-Regen, and teleport all for you to use, for a little MP. If S-E didn't offer WHM for this game, I'd club them over the head to add it.

Don't like main healing? Fine, don't party. The BRD in my PLD's static party leveled his WHM to Lv.36 mostly solo with NPC Fellow. You don't have to be a cure bot to play SMN/WHM, or even WHM.

[Freedan]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Way NOT to read what Omni put... he never suggested that at all.

Oh another suggestion Vildar, maybe you should level a more "galka type job" first, afford some astral rings, and wear them while leveling SMN. You never mentioned your equipment so I'll just make an ass-u-me and think that you don't have any astrals.

If that doesn't mean go play a more "efficient" galka type job, get Astrals before you play SMN, then I guess I don't understand English.

This thread needs to die, I think. I can make a summation that:

1) /WHM is generally considered, by the community, the best sub for SMN up to endgame
2) you can sub whatever you like under SMN but you shouldn't complain when people ask you to change, because they have just as much right to try to form a party which they consider most efficient as you do to experimentation
3) analogies can often be taken completely out of control and/or context.

Sub what you like but if it's not what people want then you have to make allowances for a lack of invites or requests to change. Either that or solo for your EXP. Whether or not people are rude about it is an entirely different matter - that's up to their personality.

On top of all that, if you still don't agree with Freedan and Vildar, then don't invite them. They have made it clear that they are sticking to their beliefs which should be fine frankly. Everyone's presented good arguments but in the end, it's their decision as to what they want to do.

Pretty much sums it up.

[Freedan]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

The anger will die down fast if you can just admit this: "Well, with the game as it's designed, /WHM is better for party and most solo'ing--but if I solo on something else it's OK and won't hurt anyone else." Heck, if you do that, I'll /clap.

Changing One's play style just because of the Many, is nothing short of a cop-out.
Could this be the root of all the hostility? SMNs that have reached "End Game" as a healer, I ask you, when you first read about SMN adv jobs, what did you think SMN was?

After you did get SMN and was told to heal, did it made you bitter? Could this hidden bitterness translate into, "How dare these upstart SMN have the audacity to play any other way than that of a healer!?"

If the SMN was defined as /WHM only, why not go play WHM main? Wouldn't that make more sense!?



And IfritnoItazura, I turn down every pt offer I get on my SMN/NIN. If you are on Hades, I'll show you what an Insane SMN/NIN can do. Trust me, I wish my DRK can do 1/4th what my SMN/NIN can do and survive.

[Vildar]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Some SMN/WHM's i have met have said that they dont sub whm because they want to, they do it because they have to. Also i told a party i did not want to be a main healer, even though they had a perfectly good white mage in the party. I just got kicked straight out even thoug i had whm as my sub.

BTW, my eqpuipment is just basic level 11-12 stuff with a Gelong staff.

[Feenicks]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Actually before I hang up my hat I just wanted to add something:

Since when did subbing WHM automatically deny you of 'being a Summoner'? I've levelled SMN to 44 so far with WHM sub and it still didn't stop me from using my Bloodpacts whenever they were available. It's not like having an avatar out or ordering a BP stops you from Curing or anything. I never understood this argument that subbing WHM stops you from being a SMN.

[Vildar]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

The party has actualy said that if i summon, i will be kicked. They wanted me to be a healer even though they had a perfectly capable white mage.

[Kirsteena]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Some SMN/WHM's i have met have said that they dont sub whm because they want to, they do it because they have to. Also i told a party i did not want to be a main healer, even though they had a perfectly good white mage in the party. I just got kicked straight out even thoug i had whm as my sub.
BTW, my eqpuipment is just basic level 11-12 stuff with a Gelong staff.

Gelong staff won't do anything for you, you would be better trying to get a staff with mp, or a pilgrims wand.

I have the feeling that you are not telling all about what happened in your party where you were told "if you summoned, you are kicked". Noone would say that without some kind of provocation.

[Vildar]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Thats it, if i summoned i would have been kicked. They wanted me to use all of my mp for healing, even though the whm could handle it easy.

[Satori]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

This thread needs sending to the depths of ..... erm.... somewhere
Seriously why are the arguments flying like mad here?
We ALL know how the game is designed and that the most common /subs are the ones that have been tested to great length not to mention the lvl 75 summoners that have said /Whm is the best way to go.
seeing as the op is a summoner, they had to go through at least 30 lvls of exping, plus gather the weather conditions. so some degree of knowledge "SHOULD" have been aquired.
The op should have noticed the lack of smn/blm and wondered why.

to the op, to be fair everything but whm is too handicapped to be usefull, be thankfull you can sub whm and you cant resist cures lol. /blm post 30 for certain your spells will practically suck donkey dick,

to th Op, yes its your fees blah blah blah but the people you play with also pay their hard earned money too.

please just accept what is the norm, and hope you find some people that are willing to experiment with the game mechanics.

and most of all good luck to you!

AND PLEASE somebody with the power lock this silly tread down before we have another psa

lol

[Taskmage]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

As someone said earlier, "you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink." I think all that can be said regarding this has already been said in widely varying tones of voice. I resolve not to post anymore on this thread. I'm not going to lock it, but I leave it to the other users posting on it to exert their self control and let the thread die.

[dspeed]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

I really feel sorry for those that are trying to tell op and all those that say "they can play whatever sub they want because they have the right to choose their play style" instead of what is accepted by most.

Reason why people are in a party is because they want to level up faster. In order to do so you need certain job with certain sub to do so. If I were in a party I wouldn't want to 1K/hr when I can get like 5K/hr. If I wanted 1K/hr I'll so and keep all the drops to myself. When you're in a party everyone needs to work together to make the party go smooth