Summoner/White mage GAH!

[Celeal]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

IfritnoItazura

Nope, the main reason why I'm subing NIN for Dual-Wield, Utsusemi is just an extra bonus.

SMN gets access to very nice +evasion gears

Bastokan Dagger +2 acc/+2evasion
Republic Dagger +2 acc/+3evasion
Compound Eye Circlet +5
Scentless Armlets +5
Martial Slacks +3
Air Solea +4
Mythril Earring +1x2 +6
Jack-o'-Lantern +10 acc/+10evasion

My other equipment that are "odd" on a mage job

Spike Neclace +3 str/+3dex
Courage Ring x2 +4 str
I'll switch to Hume Male RSE (+3 str/+3 dex) gloves depending on how much the mob is hitting me. Same goes for the Mythril Earrings +1, I'll switch to Beetle Earrings +1 if the mob isn't hitting me much.

Reason why I don't use Astrals is that I rather have th HP and +4 str.

with /nin I don't need powder, Tonko does the job just fine and I can use it at level 18 SMN, compared to level 50 with Invis. You can use Uts at level 24, Blink at level 38.
You'll have to be level 66 to use Reraise, only 60 for reraise hairpin.

I've read all the guides for SMN, and I chuck them out the window. I'm making this up as I go because playing an unpopular job combination means that there aren't any guides I can follow.

You can't make a /NIN or any other combination and follow the path/gear of a /WHM, it just won't work.

My tactics:

Uts goes up
Summons Garuda
/Assult
/pet "Claw" <bt>
I join with daggers, yes daggers, swinging
If I lose 2 shadows, recast Uts
The mob is normally dead before it gets pass my second set of Shadows.

If the mob isn't dead when I have 100 tp and BP is up, I can SC with Garuda using Gust Slash.

As a new player, I soloed Rank 2-3 Dragon fight as a Great Sword War/Thf when others told me that it was "impossible". To most of you its just Rank 2-3 dragon fight, yawn. Do the fight solo and tell me how it feels.

Trail Blazing your own path is much more rewarding than simply following some one else path.

(Excitment) (Yes, please)

Solo Rank 2-3 Dragon as Great Sword WAR/THF has nothing to do with the topic of this thread...

As for solo, SMN/WHM at your level can use the same gear, same food, same pet as your SMN/NIN is using. The only difference is instead of using Utsusemi: Ichi, /WHM use cures to migrate damage. SMN/WHM can solo just fine at this level.

[Freedan]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Solo Rank 2-3 Dragon as Great Sword WAR/THF has nothing to do with the topic of this thread...

As for solo, SMN/WHM at your level can use the same gear, same food, same pet as your SMN/NIN is using. The only difference is instead of using Utsusemi: Ichi, /WHM use cures to migrate damage. SMN/WHM can solo just fine at this level.

Curing is a way to "migrate" damage at the cost of your MP, don't forget, your MP is also being eaten away. The gear I use doesn't have +MP, I depend more on Evasion to get me through the fight. If you went with +MP gear, you'll have more MP, but you'll get hit more because you won't have as high Evasion.

But how does any of you know what another subjob can do if you, yourself, has never tried it and only listen to others?

The Rank 2-3 Dragon fight was just an example of how you can accomplish things that others has deemed "impossible", not because they have tried it, but because of what "others" had told them.

[Celeal]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Curing is a way to "migrate" damage at the cost of your MP, don't forget, your MP is also being eaten away. The gear I use doesn't have +MP, I depend more on Evasion to get me through the fight. If you went with +MP gear, you'll have more MP, but you'll get hit more because you won't have as high Evasion.

But how does any of you know what another subjob can do if you, yourself, has never tried it and only listen to others?

The Rank 2-3 Dragon fight was just an example of how you can accomplish things that others has deemed "impossible", not because they have tried it, but because of what "others" had told them.

You make a lot of assumptions, do you?

1st, I never say solo Rank 2-3 Dragon as Great Axe WAR/THF is impossible. Tools selection from Bloody Bolts ... to medicines like Icarus Wing and all kinds of Portions, I don't see any reason why it is impossible. Btw, instead of Great Sword, I prefer Great Axe... Might Strike + Sturmwind would end the fight sooner...

2nd, I never mention any +MP gear. For jobs that consumes MP, MP recovery is the way to go in long run, not maximum MP. Swap in gear for MP regeneration while healing, use food like cookies, or make juice in battlefield is common practice.

3rd, I never say /NIN is not working. As for using tools offer by NIN, a lot of posters on this thread had NIN leveled. I am not sure how much experience you have with NIN and /NIN, as a NIN approaching lvl 70 I well aware of the restriction of Evasion and Uts: ichi alone. There are mobs in that are designed to tear shadows apart... both /whm and /nin has their uses, it is situational.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Let's just leave him alone; he seems happy Dual Wielding an E rated weapon and patting himself on the back with how he manages to enhance his E rated evasion. Guess he doesn't exp off of exploding mobs like other SMN's.

He's not doing anyone else any harm anyway, since he only solo's on his SMN/NIN.

[Omniblast]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Hypothermal Combustion (Yes, please!) yay 500 exp.



You know... I can't even get that much exp anymore on bombs. *sigh* I miss those days of soloing bombs.

[Shirai]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Hypothermal Combustion (Yes, please!) yay 500 exp.



You know... I can't even get that much exp anymore on bombs. *sigh* I miss those days of soloing bombs.

I do miss those days, however even if the exp rate on them has dropped a lot these are still pretty good to solo if you want to make the trip all the way up to that camp.
(I only do when I plan to stay up there for a couple of days.)
Otherwise I go to sea to solo Hpemde or Ghrah or when Caedarva mire is quiet the Imps also give pretty good exp.

With no disrespect to Freedan, If your character info under your name is correct.
At your current level nin sub might work out you, however you're now reaching levels where mobs get a lot more HP, attack faster, hit harder and you'll notice their accuracy has increased considerably.
You'll also start to notice the mobs you fight will have an increased rate of evasion of which your dagger skill won't be sufficient to get a good DoT on them.
Hate controll is also something you will learn pretty fast about when you keep soloing as it will become harder for your avatar to grab hate away from you as you melee alongside it casting utsusemi doing weapon skills.

Later on you'll also have to sacrifice a lot of that melee gear to maintain avatar upkeep as your avatars will become more expensive in perpetuation cost every few levels you get making meleeing alongside your avatar on anything higher then low decent challenge monsters less viable.

If it keeps working for you though I'd love to read some details on how you do it.

[LyonheartLakshmi]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

I just think it's hilarious how adamant some people are in trying to get people to conform to what is "acceptable" and "un-acceptable". Perhaps a reflection of society?

It is a game, after all...

If anything, the people who consider themselves non-conformists are the ones who are most adamant about their position. They defend their position with a religious zeal, as if any criticism to their position is a threat to their very existence.

We "conformists" could simply post "yeah, just do what you want", rather than posting useful information on the pros and cons of the topic at hand. But what's the point in that? That adds nothing of value to a discussion.

[Karinya]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Wow Omniblast, you sound a little upset.
What does it matter to you how others chose to play?

It matters when one of those beautiful and unique snowflakes shows up in one of his parties, or hurts the reputation of his job in the eyes of other players by their behavior in *their* parties. (How few bad DRGs did it take to create the impression that it was a weak job?)

You found a comfortable, safe path that has been proven/beloved. Good for you. Now let others play how they want. If you don't like their choices, don't party with them.

Sure, if they're going to be courteous enough to inform other players that their choice is going to be what is fun for them individually and not what is effective for the group, that's fine. I think Omni is reacting to the people who *don't* warn their group members of this, but then play however they want regardless of how it affects the other 5 people in their group. Such people do deserve condemnation, regardless of whether or not you personally are one of them.


If there really are parties that still tell SMNs not to summon at all, then they're... well, this board has anti-flaming rules so I won't give my full opinion of their intelligence and manners. And I have no quarrel with SMN who don't want to main heal (they should probably put it in their search comment to prevent misunderstandings, though).

But there are very few circumstances where *some* use of /WHM (in addition to whatever you're doing with your summons) isn't more beneficial *to the party* than what you can do with any other subjob, in a party situation. And if you're not going to play in a way that benefits the party, you have an obligation to warn them of that in advance, because the standard for party play is for everyone to contribute as much as they reasonably can to maximize the total effectiveness and success of the party.

As for telling a new player to go get 2 Astral Rings, or any equipment for that matter, before playing a certain job . . . . . . . . Wow, just wow

Well, as far as Astral Rings I agree, but... "any equipment"? You really don't mind if people show up naked, or with equipment that's totally unsuited to their job, much lower level than their actual level, etc.? I'm pretty generous in what I consider acceptable exp party equipment (I think), but to have no expectations at all is going a bit far, I think, even for mages.

Basically, I think that when you put on that LFP flag, you're saying that you're ready and willing to contribute to the success of a party. Therefore, other players have a right to be pissed if you're *not* ready and willing to contribute to the success of their party, and just intend to freeload and place your own fun ahead of the rest of the party's benefit.

[Tekumel]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

It matters when one of those beautiful and unique snowflakes shows up in one of his parties

LOL Anna the WHM/THF. Nice reference.

[Kirsteena]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

LOL Anna the WHM/THF. Nice reference.

Oh god, I read about her and nearly died laughing...

[Icemage]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

SMN/NIN isn't really a bad solo option at lower levels. Utsusemi : Ichi is more reliable than Blink and is acquired much earlier, while costing no MP. I don't think boosting Evasion is the way to go, under that circumstance, especially at the cost of wielding such pathetically weak weapons as Bastokan Daggers with an E skill rank. If you absolutely must be in the middle of a fight when solo on Summoner, you should skip the whole dual wield and go with a decent staff, which at least gives you a reasonable chance to hit and build TP for a skillchain.

Later on, to emphasize what's already been posted, yes, you do get access to some reasonably good Evasion gear on Summoner even at higher levels. However, nothing can fix your E ranked Evasion skill (similar to WHM), and if you think loading up on Evasion + Utsusemi: Ichi will make you less squishy as a solo Summoner, I think cold hard reality is going to throw you a very strong right hook to the jaw.

Things change a bit at level 74+, as you get access to Utsusemi: Ni, which again gives you some new defensive options, depending on the enemy.

Even so, as long as you're solo, no harm, no foul, do whatever you like (but you might want to stay /anon to avoid trashing your own reputation when you actually do go seeking for parties). As pointed out above, though, the best way to solo isn't up front and in your face for Summoners at many levels; you're much better off taking on things that are high XP and blow themselves to bits.


Icemage

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

LOL Anna the WHM/THF. Nice reference.

Who's that? And, what is her reason for a WHM/THF? (Using the word "reason" loosely...)

[Murphie]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Just some idiot from the Alla boards who became semi-legendary for her rabid defense of WHM/THF as an all around useful combo because she pays her money to play the game damn it, etc.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Just some idiot from the Alla boards who became semi-legendary for her rabid defense of WHM/THF as an all around useful combo because she pays her money to play the game damn it, etc.

Because it so awesome when its the only subjob you have.

[Murphie]

Re: Summoner/White mage GAH!

Something like that, yeah.