The Guide of How to Get to the Summon Primes

[tomc1988t]

i wish i could be a "leecher" and have gotten them done i would like to play summoner but i dont want to sit in jueno for like 10hrs asking because i dont have any friends that high level >_<. ill probably just get it done the good ol' fashioned way even tho there is nothing wrong with what you did deedlit :-) maybe in some peoples eyes there is but congratulations from me! ^^

[Moo]

Originally posted by Kirara
i am sorry, i don't care if you are a mod or not(others might). (this means your line means nothing to me)

1, sarcasm is defined by reader
2, leeching a "friend" still makesyou "leecher" in my book
3, i don't like leechers
4, there are many ways of living a life too (including leeching)
5, leeching make you suck imo
6, you got a problem with my opinion?
7, am i getting banned now?

[Regulat0r]

Well Tom you dont sit in Jeuno for hours. What you do is buy silent oils, prism powders, etc.. So that you can run to the cloister where the summons reside, then just wait and chill until a nice group of people come and dont mind you joining. =)

Its really simple, patience is just needed.

[imac2much]

All flaming aside, Regulat0r's method may actually work. My friends recently were doing some avatar quests for the first time (levels 63-67 or something?) and one of the members ended up leaving cuz the PLD was being a total ass (I can't stand this guy either, but I'll keep him nameless so I'm not an ass myself... suffice to say, most NA players on Midgard only know of one super-selfish and annoying lvl 66ish PLD...)

They ended up doing 2 avatars with just 5 after the one member left in exasperation. I'd assume that if some low level was sitting next to the cloister with the tuning fork, they wouldn't have minded letting them join... heck they were going to do it with 5 anyway. I eventually replaced the selfish PLD and the 6th member came back, so maybe it isn't *too* common for random 4-5 member PT's going to kill avatars. But if you want to spend the money on the silent oil and the risk of wasting several hours sitting in the middle of nowhere, it's your call, cuz if the random 5-person PT does come, I'm sure they wouldn't mind letting you tag along.

As for the whole leeching thing... well, I don't really want to add fuel to the flames. My *personal* feeling is that leeching itself isn't bad if it is offered to you . What I do despise are level 30 characters spamming shouts in Jeuno for help with avatars... basically asking random people to go out of their way just for them. I love helping my friends, so I guess they would be "leechers", but hey I offered it to them. Also I can see why some people would get angry at low levels getting avatars, since they had to go through so much trouble for them... but I also agree that SMN shouldn't have to be some super-elite class that only lvl 60's can play. With the addition of Fenrir (which will be much harder to leech and learn), the difference between the "leech" SMNs and the ones who "earned" them will stand out... maybe this will appease the higher level WHM/BLM/etc's who accomplished something in the avatar battles. In many ways I agree with both Kirara and Deedlit.

One thing to watch out for Deedlit, you have a very arrogant attitude. You probably don't care what I think of you (although I am trying to speak very objectively here), but I don't see any reason why you should be arrogant when you did indeed leech. I'm not saying it's bad that you did so, but why bother bragging about it (and it really did sound like bragging in some posts) when honestly you did not accomplish anything? Yes, Kirara is arrogant as well, but she is elitist for a reason... she has a ton more experience than you or I. No, that doesn't purely justify it either, but I can see her side easier than yours. Also, watch out for the hypocritical factor... you accuse Kirara of being racist, then you go on to brag how JP players say you are a good SMN. Also in another thread you mock others who have leveled high to get their avatars and say they play too much, then you turn around and brag to Moo that you will be level 75 soon.

Deedlit, you have some good points, but it's hard to take you seriously when you can be quite arrogant and hypocritical. I'm sure you're a nice person who helps people, but that doesn't automatically mean you have a nice, lovable personality, so maybe you should look at that. Maybe you won't care what I have to say, but hey I spoke my mind, and didn't use any flames

[Aurege]

Kirara's a guy.....

anyway, Regulat0r, your sarcasm is pretty....hmmm...annoying.
youre not ruining my gameplay or messn up any of my plans, i just prefer to wait til 55+ and earn my summons. if square had intended for lv30 jobs to get them, then you wouldnt need a lv75 to do it for you would you? i know that i really want the avatars....but id prefer to wait til i complete my whm af and earn them.

but i guess if you do the quests and get the fame, do what you want with it...

[Deedlit]

imac, try dealing with constant prods about how "you suck, you're just a leech" posts and you'd be pretty snippy yourself.

First of all, I didn't ask for help, it was offered.

Second, I didn't sit in the back by the protocrystal and wait around for 5 jp players to earn my summons - I healed the solo 74 RDM who helped me, kept her buffed with bar-spells cause she was busy keeping up phalanx/blink/stoneskin and her own buffs, and learned a bit about dodging astral flow in the meantime. Now, how is this ANY different than doing this as a level 60 WHM? Heck, I could have spam cured her with Cure 3 - but I would have gotten agro that way, so I had to keep it down to cure 2. With the exception of lacking Protect IV (which she had) I was able to keep her as well healed (using drinks and food) as I would have as a level 60. However, people still get all pissy and like to call names, when they don't realise that every time they ask for strategies on NM battles, or advice from higher level players, they're "leeching" as well - leeching hard-earned information.

These people seem to like dishing out the insults when they don't see that they're guilty of the same essential "sin " they claimed I've commited - which was accepting help from someone kind enough to offer it who I met through a forum. I bet you none of you out there would refuse 1 million gil from a higher level person who thought you deserved it - though it is "leeching" according to their definition.

Also

Also, watch out for the hypocritical factor... you accuse Kirara of being racist, then you go on to brag how JP players say you are a good SMN.

What does one have to do with the other? Kirara is almost to banning point because of racist remarks - I've never said anything racist to anyone on this forum. I say that I've been complimented by JP players because, according to many people on this board, JP respect is hard-earned. Personally, I've seen awesome and sucky players from all over the world in this game, so whatever - still don't see how you get hypocrite from that. A good SMN can still be racist, as is evident from many people here.

[Gryff]

I and a lot of others feel summons are a reward for earning a high level, if the game had been released at same time in jap and us you would never had got any summons already.

You are taking advantage of others kindness to get something long before you have any right to it.

Summoner also isnt an easy class to play well, every NA summoner i've played with has played badly. ( and most of the japs as well I have to say in fairness )

You should get to a high level with another job to learn how to play properly before approaching summoner.

You have just leeched, and regardless of intentions you are almost certainly a poor summoner.

[Valerathon]

Lovely. Another preachy poster - who doesn't pay my monthly POL fees - joining the lecture circuit on the forums because he feels he and his opinions are divinely inspired.

I pay my fees. Not you. I decide - not you - how I play this game. Read Tomoh's post on this matter: there are many ways to play this game. Your artificial rules are meaningless. And look at how puerile and self-important you come off, judging how good anyone else is at their job, without ever having met them. Don't you see how your prudish morals add nothing to the atmosphere of helping and respect that should be seen on this forum?

I ask that the Mods please decide a policy on this matter, and make it known. SMNs shouldn't have to put up with these insults. This kind of behavior should carry with it the same reponse as making disparaging remarks against NA players (which Gryff comes awefully close to doing in this post) - the poster should recieve a warning. Enough of this bitter fighting - these people have no business souring the atmosphere on these boards. It's not right.

On another note, if the mods don't decide on a policy to shut these divisive people down, then the rest of us can just incorporate these foul, arrogant attitudes into the storyline of the game. Summoning is a banned magic, and summoners are pariahs in Vana'diel society. For those of us who role play (tho I'm not one of em) we can weave this discrimination into our characters' stories.

Every cloud has a silver lining...

and this cloud isn't even real...

EDIT: Before any more of you (who do not pay my POL fees) continue this attempt to tell me how to play MY game, go to page three of this thread, and read Tomoh's post at the very end of that page. If that's not a clear warning (from a respected moderator) to tone down your sanctimony (I'm using that word far too often lately, and that's a bad sign), then I don't know what is. :mad:

[Deedlit]

ROFL @ Gryff - according to you (who has never met or PTed with me) I am a poor summoner (along with everyone else apparently) - but according to me, you're a poor reader, seeing as you apparently didn't read a word I said.

Thankfully for my sake, I could care less, but you really should consider other people's valuable time when you post such BS.

So, what was that again? High level jp's who got summoner the "right way" can't play summoner well, and neither can NA's who "leeched?" So, with logic, you can say that being a high level has no bearing on your ability to play the class well - which I would have to agree on! Summoner is no more complicated to play than any other job - just harder to get, and most people who play it poorly are the ones who insist on meleeing their avatars.

Okie, done feeding this troll.

[Kirara]

Originally posted by Valerathon
Lovely. Another preachy poster - who doesn't pay my monthly POL fees - joining the lecture circuit on the forums because he feels he and his opinions are divinely inspired.

I pay my fees. Not you. I decide - not you - how I play this game. Read Tomoh's post on this matter: there are many ways to play this game. Your artificial rules are meaningless. And look at how puerile and self-important you come off, judging how good anyone else is at their job, without ever having met them. Don't you see how your prudish morals add nothing to the atmosphere of helping and respect that should be seen on this forum?

I ask that the Mods please decide a policy on this matter, and make it known. SMNs shouldn't have to put up with these insults. This kind of behavior should carry with it the same reponse as making disparaging remarks against NA players (which Gryff comes awefully close to doing in this post) - the poster should recieve a warning. Enough of this bitter fighting - these people have no business souring the atmosphere on these boards. It's not right.

On another note, if the mods don't decide on a policy to shut these divisive people down, then the rest of us can just incorporate these foul, arrogant attitudes into the storyline of the game. Summoning is a banned magic, and summoners are pariahs in Vana'diel society. For those of us who role play (tho I'm not one of em) we can weave this discrimination into our characters' stories.

Every cloud has a silver lining...

and this cloud isn't even real...

EDIT: Before any more of you (who do not pay my POL fees) continue this attempt to tell me how to play MY game, go to page three of this thread, and read Tomoh's post at the very end of that page. If that's not a clear warning (from a respected moderator) to tone down your sanctimony (I'm using that word far too often lately, and that's a bad sign), then I don't know what is. :mad:

do you pay my fee to decide how i CAN"T think?
i dont' recall anywhere in my post that i said you CAN"T leech
i called you a leech, that's all
and all tomoh said is that there are many ways to play this game
leeching is one way, he never said it wasn't has he?

[Tomoh]

I really don't want to close this thread since it is a good topic. However, it is becoming a flame fest. I will keep my eye on it and if it doesn't improve, I will close it.

Like I said before, there are many ways to play this game. Please just have little more respect for others.

I am really getting tired and discouraged by all the attacking posts ranging from leeching, gimped subs, noobs, NAs and what not

BTW, I do not enjoy being baited to give out warning points. Please don't tempt me.

[Regulat0r]

Rgr that Tomoh ^^

In reply to Imacs post yes it can take awhile to get help, but thats what you have to sacrifice to get the summons is time. Its worth it though, you wont believe how happy I was to summon Leviathan for the first time it was great =)

[Regulat0r]

Ack trying to get to Ifrits cloister right now, using tonko and silent oil and was doing fine until I dropped down to the second lvl and got to a ??? on a bridge across lava. Didnt know what to do and my invis dropped and I died doh.

Am I suppose to use a key item here or am I suppose to keep running?

[imac2much]

Deedlit, I know you were offered help. That's precisely why I brought up that point I personally don't think what you did was dishonorable, but yes, you have a smug factor. If you don't care, nothing anyone can do about it, but just thought you should know if you were oblivious to it. About the hypocrisy, I'm just saying you blame others for being racist (which might be well deserved, I don't really care), then you single out JP people as if they're any different from us... they're not. I've played with good and bad players regardless of nationality, and it's not hard to get "JP respect" at all, just know how to play your job. If you don't find the irony of accusing someone of being racist then singling out a race yourself, I don't know what to say.

And Valerathon, your arguments are inherently flawed. It's people like who that try to get by with loopholes in the law.. basically, for you if there's no actual rule against something, you find nothing wrong with it. Like, you pay your money to get in a theater, then you find nothing wrong with video taping the movie (I know there is a law against that now, but there didn't use to be). You pay your fees, I guess that means you can go around shout spamming vulgarities in Jeuno right? Wrong. You *can*, but that doesn't make it any less rude, annoying, or plain stupid. If you ever play other MMORPGs, I'm sure you're the kind of person who goes around kill stealing, leeching, looting, killing noobs, etc... just because you "paid" your fees and you feel like you're God's gift to the game. You really need to rethink your arguments, because they hold absolutely no validity, unless you think anything you can get away with are inherently good and wholesome things.

On topic: I can't seem to see those maps anymore, maybe it's a problem with my browser? Some friends asked me to fight Shiva today, so that map may help (hopefully someone will know how to get there...) Is it true I need to use poison food to fight her due to her Sleepga spam?

[Valerathon]

Originally posted by imac2much

And Valerathon, your arguments are inherently flawed. It's people like who that try to get by with loopholes in the law.. basically, for you if there's no actual rule against something, you find nothing wrong with it. Like, you pay your money to get in a theater, then you find nothing wrong with video taping the movie (I know there is a law against that now, but there didn't use to be). You pay your fees, I guess that means you can go around shout spamming vulgarities in Jeuno right? Wrong. You *can*, but that doesn't make it any less rude, annoying, or plain stupid. If you ever play other MMORPGs, I'm sure you're the kind of person who goes around kill stealing, leeching, looting, killing noobs, etc... just because you "paid" your fees and you feel like you're God's gift to the game. You really need to rethink your arguments, because they hold absolutely no validity, unless you think anything you can get away with are inherently good and wholesome things.

This is uncalled for. I follow the rules, and am a law abiding individual to the N'th degree. Implying that I am a law breaking griefer is wrong.

My intention in posting at all was to encourage people to show respect, and to stop the insults and arrogance.

This post has been reported. In slandering me, you crossed the line.

EDIT: You wanna talk about fallacies in argument, but you don't actually point out any flaws in my logic. That's called "Argumentum ad Hominem" from the Latin "Argument against the man." The logical fallacy of personal attack.

http://www.fallacyfiles.org/adhomine.html