Starting SAM

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

I was recently inspired to start SAM after seeing an LS SAM play SAM/RNG. More or less, as a 75 RNG, I'm starting out as SAM to see how the reverse pans out and based off off what I've read, it should pan out rather well even if RNG doesn't really get the full benefit of Hasso and only two Store TP traits.

Other reason was I quit my original main character, thus freeing up time to focus on anything I want to do with my mithra. Hardest part was giving up the BST, but in reviewing a lot of the melee equipment SAM used, I found BST and SAM shared a lot of armor, rings and earrings and I love it when gear overlaps between jobs. So in doing SAM I'd have a lot of BST melee gear prepared. Not worried about relevelling BST anyway, i always have friends levelling subs. I can get back to where I was.

Right now, i'm just taking this up as a subjob, I've got some other subjob work ahead of me and I want to get a lot of meritting in on COR and RNG first. So I guess my questions are these:

Polearms - I rarely see them used these days by SAMs, but pre-ToA it wasn't an uncommon sight. My skill here has already fallen behind, but I could see myself working on DRG a bit to catch it up, is it fairly worthwhile to keep a polearm on hand?

Other weapons - Sword aside, any other weapons to consider?

Ranged WS - Only level 12 at the moment, but I've kept a bow and arrows on hand for pulling, added TP gain and soloing worms when invites are slow. I remember ranged weapons having a slower curve as far as gaining WS go, but not this slow. At 39 Archery, still no ranged WS. Am I missing something or do I need /RNG to have access to these?

Subjobs - WAR, NIN and RNG are ready for subs as they're needed, all at or past 37. THF is one I have to work out still, but will likely do in my subjob push after SAM and WHM are at sub level. Are there any other subjobs I should be considering?

Tanking as SAM - I'd like to hear any experiences with this. A little while before I hit 75 on RNG, I had on PT on JP hours and our main tank on Colibri was a SAM. He went /WAR and used Seigan primarily. He anticipated attacks fairly well and took very little in the way of damage. I did have to hold back on my damage a little, but it seems SAM can be a rather capable tank, so I guess I'm curious how SAM can perform a tanking role better.

Rice Balls - Er... what do these do?

Merits to cross over - looking to put a handful of archery merits into RNG, doing critical hit rate and STR merits was well. As far as misc. merits go, what also should I consider toward SAM while I merit RNG and COR?

[Aeolus]

Re: Starting SAM

Only jobs that allow range ws are Rng or Cor so you need one of them subbed to get ws. Isnt your bow already lved from your 75rng neway? o.O

As far as tanking on sam goes we absolutely can do it np for alot of a fight (upto 50 neway at least). I have done so in all of my PTs before, even with a thf I end up tanking a while before SaTa goes off and with seigan and third eye I hardly ever get hit. Once in a blue moon it wears on first anticipated attack but usually get 3-4 at least and sometimes a few counters as well.

Rice balls, never see anyone eating them and I just use sushi mostly, I think they give +50atk with AF hands, I'll check.

Edit: Rice Balls - HP+10 Vit+2 Dex-1 Hp recovered while healing +1. With Sam AF hands and Roshi Jinpachi you get Def+50. Wearing both gives Def+100.

Good for solo kinda I guess.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Starting SAM

Only jobs that allow range ws are Rng or Cor so you need one of them subbed to get ws. Isnt your bow already lved from your 75rng neway? o.O

Yeah, I'm covered on Archery, totally capped out @75. Subbing WAR for the dunes because I figured I'd end up being a pinch-tank when no others were found, I was just curious why I didn't have my bow weaponskills yet, now I know. Thanks

[Celeal]

Re: Starting SAM

For exp. parties:

For Polearms, I would leave it to the lowest priority. Since both Polearms and Archery both are piercing weapon, if you are going for sam/rng, Archery can do the job for you against bats, flies, birds, etc. At early levels, WS placement on Skillchain Chart for both Polearms and Archery are overlapped too.

Great Katana itself is a very well-round weapon, in terms of DPS, skillchain options (SC opener or nice damage WS). Other weapons are optional.

When you SAM/WAR or SAM/THF, no Archery WS is available. SAM/RNG is the way to get Archery WS.

For subjobs, pre-level 60 /WAR is the most practical (SATA partner, sub-tank). For other subjobs, try SAM/THF in a few parties pre-level 60 to get a feel of the speed of TP gain and SA timer + Meditate timer. If you wait until level 60 and try SAM/THF 1st time ever in the party, you may not be prepared to switch over to /thf playstyle.

For SAM/WAR tanking at late levels, I am not certain (it is rare). However, for Seigan I would macro with a few eva+/agi+ gear, to make Third Eye last as long as possible. Before Seigan is introduced, I use to bring a few tank gear to swap in for setting up SATA, or got hate.

Rice Ball, the special effect activates when certain armor is equipped (like SAM AF hand). Its usage is really limited imho.

[KalemLyco]

Re: Starting SAM

I've too recently started SAM so far close to lvl 16 and from my experience so far for tanking we can do it as long as there's a decent back-up or WHM there with you almost got my ass handed to me by lizzies in the dunes. Other than that I've been with a NIN or PLD so I've been on back-up I've subbed WAR so far and it's the best I have for it at the moment.

For weapons I've stuck with the Great Katana and my bow from RNG. I've got the Great Katana that drops from Carano in South Gustaburg (forgot it's name) I've been told it's the best weapon you can have intill 25.

and that's my 2 pence from my limited experience so far.

[Aeolus]

Re: Starting SAM

I should mention I ment we can tank ok upto 50 after aquiring Seigan at 35 so its really Lv35-50 I was talking about.

[Lmnop]

Re: Starting SAM

And before 35, SAM can take damage very well, so they can technically tank A ok. However, not enough hate gain.

If you're subbing RNG, you're doing it more for Sharpshot and acc bonus I than you are for ranged WS. I do not see the point in Piercing Arrow when you can pop off solid Enpis time and again.

As I said in another thread recently, I feel sam/war with strong R.acc equip swaps and good bow/arrow is the way to go. The bow is there to add to your damage and make you versatile, not make you a RNG. The fact that you have Merits to bring up your C rank will certainly help in this department.

Polearm is pretty much useless.

[Icemage]

Re: Starting SAM

The only time where I ever saw SAM using Polearms was before the TP nerf back in 2004, when anyone and everyone who could use it was spamming Penta Thrust because of it's 5x TP return.

Since then I've not seeing a single SAM use any Polearm of any type at any level.


Icemage

[Caspian]

Re: Starting SAM

As has been discussed, your sub pre-30 probably doesn't matter all that much, unless you want to sub /WAR for provoke. The accuracy bonus from /RNG is nice at lvl 20 and would give you the ability to use Flaming arrow and Piercing arrow, but lets face it, those ws's suck. /RNG really starts coming into its own at 57 for Sidewinder and 60 for barrage. Before that I'm sure its nice and all, but I can't imagine it being more effective than /WAR from 30-56.

[Emurei]

Re: Starting SAM

Polearms - I rarely see them used these days by SAMs, but pre-ToA it wasn't an uncommon sight. My skill here has already fallen behind, but I could see myself working on DRG a bit to catch it up, is it fairly worthwhile to keep a polearm on hand?

Pre TP nerf than Penta Spam, afterwards only if you're bored or tanking for LS mates for coffer keys just to skill it up. Other than that should be at the bottom of your list of things to do

Other weapons - Sword aside, any other weapons to consider?

Sword only if you decide to do some HNMs with Sam, other than that second to the bottom of the list of things to do as a Sam though /War and Vorpal Blade spaming is pretty tight =)

Ranged WS - Only level 12 at the moment, but I've kept a bow and arrows on hand for pulling, added TP gain and soloing worms when invites are slow. I remember ranged weapons having a slower curve as far as gaining WS go, but not this slow. At 39 Archery, still no ranged WS. Am I missing something or do I need /RNG to have access to these?

yup /rng or /cor ory ^^ as others have mentioned.

Subjobs - WAR, NIN and RNG are ready for subs as they're needed, all at or past 37. THF is one I have to work out still, but will likely do in my subjob push after SAM and WHM are at sub level. Are there any other subjobs I should be considering?

/Drg for fun =P acturally its pretty tight seeing a Sam use Jump

Tanking as SAM - I'd like to hear any experiences with this. A little while before I hit 75 on RNG, I had on PT on JP hours and our main tank on Colibri was a SAM. He went /WAR and used Seigan primarily. He anticipated attacks fairly well and took very little in the way of damage. I did have to hold back on my damage a little, but it seems SAM can be a rather capable tank, so I guess I'm curious how SAM can perform a tanking role better.

I always believe that Sam is a good tanking Job, with the new addition to our job, its going to make it easier for us to tank. Only draw back is we don't have that many hate tools, and it require a different set of equipment to get the job done. Since we don't have that many hate tools, as Pld or Nin. I would probably opt for as many Store TP gear as I can. Might as well spam WS to hold hate and its a good thing that our last 3 WS as status effect added to them as well so we can techincally Debuff mobs (Yuki = Blind, Gekko = Silence, Kasha = Paralize)

Rice Balls - Er... what do these do?

As other has posted. Also depends on which rice ball you use. If I use riceballs, I'll personally perfer to use Shogun riceballs, or the NQ version of it. Att+ Def+ and Double Attack Rate+

Merits to cross over - looking to put a handful of archery merits into RNG, doing critical hit rate and STR merits was well. As far as misc. merits go, what also should I consider toward SAM while I merit RNG and COR?

Can't go wrong with extra HP, other than that you got the basic covered =) GL and have fun!

[Lmnop]

Re: Starting SAM

Using a Tonosama Riceball gives you +50 attack. Around level 60, you can expect Meat Dishes to give ~55-60 attack, methinks. Granted, this means you also lose the potential of O Kote. Comparing to meat dishes, you're giving up close to 30 attack and 5-6 STR for 7 DEX and Double Attack+ some small amount.

It's not exactly bad, but it's not quite "ideal," unfortunately. Apparently, wearing Roshi Jinpachi thing in addition to AF hands doubles benefit. So 2 slots + food = Attack+100, Defense+60, and Double Attack + some doubled, yet still trivial, amount. That sounds nice but losing other food sucks. It'd be nice if the Riceballs at least added a decent amount of Store TP...

I'd like to see a sam/drk with Sword do some Meikyo Shisui Souleater Vorpal Blade action (with like 7 healers).

[Mog]

Re: Starting SAM

Here's a great SAM guide.

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/db/jobs.h...num=141;page=1

[Zempten]

Re: Starting SAM

Why not eat Rice Dumplings? they are pretty damn good

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Starting SAM

Here's a great SAM guide.

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/db/jobs.h...num=141;page=1

I'd look that it, but Alla likes to crash my browser.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Starting SAM

Polearms - I rarely see them used these days by SAMs, but pre-ToA it wasn't an uncommon sight. My skill here has already fallen behind, but I could see myself working on DRG a bit to catch it up, is it fairly worthwhile to keep a polearm on hand?

You're way past the stage, but I'll mention it for the benefit of others starting SAM; Polearm is a strong option for Lv.4-10 or so, provided that:

1. Your Polearm skill is capped for up to Lv.10.
2. Your Great Kanata skill is capped for up to Lv.10. (So it won't fall behind.)
3. You have Obelisk and Bronze Spear +1.

Basically, you'll have to be one of those weirdos who have leveled DRG and for some odd reason skilled up Great Katana on NIN. (Yes, I'm one.)

But, why not just stick with Great Katana? For minor reductions in accuracy and attack, you get Double Thrust--which is a stronger WS than Tachi: Enpi. Obelisk also beats out Mumeito for damage and has lower deley.

In short, it'll help you get past the 1-10 levels easier by killing stuff a little faster. (I used both Obelisk and Mumeito, and Obelisk + Double Thrust was noticibly stronger.)

At Lv.10, though, Katayama Ichimonji becames available, and Polearm no longer has a clear advantage.

* * *

All things considered, with the Empress Band, a few pieces of Grilled Rabbit, and a good stock of Selbina Milk, Lv.1-10 fly by rather fast anyway, so it's not really worth the trouble to use Polearm unless you already met the conditions.