does this job combo sounds unique?

[Jei]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

What's wrong with using SATA if it's useful? You sounds so clueless.

First, if you have no clue how to do good damage without SATA, I agree quit now.

Second, to not SUCK in this game means you have to know how to play as a team. The group needs to have players filling all the roles, tanking, damaging, healing, hate controlling.

Third, SATA serves not only for damage but for hate controller. SA gives damage, TA puts hate onto another person. So if done right, it allows both the attacker to give up all the defense to do maximum damage, and the tank to hold better hate and easier.

Lastly, Samurai are normally the skillchain starter with other jobs as the closer. Just FYI it's more important for the closer to have the highest damage possible since the extra damage depends on the closing WS damage too. This means, most SAM out their don't use /thf in PTs. Does that make all SAM suck? Answer that yourself.

[Niwaar]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

Getting back to the original post's question. I'd be interested to know who your ls leader is. A good friend of mine (also on Ramuh) went through a very painful process over a good long year to get his Sam/Drg to 75. He finally went to Sam/Thf somewhere in his late 60's, although reluctantly. His reasoning was pure tp build. Jump/HighJump can quickly "finish" that 100tp gain when med isn't ready. There are several /drg Haste pieces of equipment that do help a good deal. A few people mentioned that the /drg passive AccUp ability was also a consideration here as well. While yes you lose Berserk at lower levels, you gain a whole lot of accuracy from what I saw while I xped with him. Does the /drg create issues in a normal party with a THF? Yes it does. Does it mean its less than stellar? Not neccessarily. Sam/Drg used with any semblance of skill and knowledge can do quite well. Is Sam better matched with /war and /thf (post 60)? Hell yes. But, in the end, its all about you having fun. If you try the combo and enjoy playing it (Jump can be oddly addicting when used with a GK), then go for it. Just be ready for what my friend had to deal with. i.e. long waits for parties and inconsiderate morons calling you out for not subbing something more normal.

[kuu]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

Geez, Sepukku be nice......even if it's direct quotes >.>

As far as SAM/DRG I don't know of much benefits that DRG would present for SAM. At lv. 20 SAM the DRG would give an Attack Boost which at lv. 20 the Attack Boost will be about on par with Berserk but loose that advantage as you level. Then you also get the Accuracy Boost, but with DRG you only get 1 Accuracy Boost were RNG at least you'll have 2.

Other then that DRGs will provide a slightly faster TP gain with the jumps over other jobs but a SAM/RNG using Barrage can top their TP out a lot faster, hitting 100% with little effort just a good chunk of arrows used or gil throwing >.>

So at the moment DRG doesn't have a lot of benefits when it's sub, different story when it's the other way around.

Err... acc boost is lvl 30 drg isn't it? But I also remember wrong, it seems jump is 1.5min..even better.

And I think you need to edit a bit on the post...kinda unclear... you mean lvl 20sam or lvl 40sam/20 drg? at 20sam, you don't get berserk(15 war)....you get that at lvl 30 sam...

So.. at lvl 20 sam you can either get provoke, or jump(lvl 10 drg)....Jump seems more useful, unless you need a backup tank. Also attack up at 10 too I believe...

Berserk vs Jump at 30 though...hard to say if it's 1.5 min.... extra hit means TP, but berserk = damage... and you get an attack bonus from drg too... It may seem /drg is better...

Though /thf with SA if good also if you have a paladin with cover ready.

And Sam/rng usually isn't very good in xp, Sams are C+ on bow, Though if for some reason no one is SCing... archers +rings + med+ Store TP = lots of flaming arrows

So drg isn't that bad..at least on earily levels(Pre 50)...

[neighbortaru]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

berzerk, don't bitch about something you have no idea about. that just makes you look stupid.

i think the DRG Acc up trait is a really poor excuse now that we have sushi.

there are exactly 2 pieces of /drg latent haste gear a SAM can use. One is an earing (+5%) and the other is a targe. Well, the targe is obviously a no brainer. while the earing is nice, i pity the WHM or RDM who doesn't haste the melees already.

jump and high jump does sound like a nice way to build TP, however, i wonder if it is actually any faster than with DA.

i agree with kuu, /drg is a nice complement to any melee 30 and under.

[Nodachi]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

Sorry I'm going to bypass all of the posts and just say the honest truth. Is the job combination unique? Yes. Should it be used? Only for ballista in 60 or 50 cap. Otherwise you should really be doing yourself a favor and use WAR, THF or RNG for your sub-job choice.

[Macht]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

Kuu,

Sorry for the confusion. When I stated the Attack Bonus I ment 20Sam/10DRG since DRG gets the attack bonus at 10. Also I forgot that Berserk was 15 for some reason I was thinking it was 10.

For the Jump though depends on the kind of damage you get out of it at lv. 30 vs Berserk. If Jump gets you an extra say 100+ damage every 1.5 min. then you'll come close to matching. You'll get about 3 Jumps per 1 Berserk.

Berserk just adds on a percent to Attack which in turn just boosts the damage you would do an extra like 10 damage a hit or so. On a weapon like GK you'll probably hit what 10-12 times a min.? So in 3 min. they'll pull off about an extra 360 damage. Get all 3 jumps to land and that's 300+.

The difference really is berserk spreads out the damage per hit and Jump concentrates it in 1 strike. If you have ungodly good accuracy then Jump probably could beat berserk, but otherwise berserk turns out better and a saying covers it's reason why easily "Don't put all your eggs in one basket."

[berzerk]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

Sorry I'm going to bypass all of the posts and just say the honest truth. Is the job combination unique? Yes. Should it be used? Only for ballista in 60 or 50 cap. Otherwise you should really be doing yourself a favor and use WAR, THF or RNG for your sub-job choice.

thank you for a clear answer

Jei, don't be so sarcastic

Oh yeh Niwaar, my LS leader is Scudmissile.

Double Post Edited:

Kuu,

Sorry for the confusion. When I stated the Attack Bonus I ment 20Sam/10DRG since DRG gets the attack bonus at 10. Also I forgot that Berserk was 15 for some reason I was thinking it was 10.

For the Jump though depends on the kind of damage you get out of it at lv. 30 vs Berserk. If Jump gets you an extra say 100+ damage every 1.5 min. then you'll come close to matching. You'll get about 3 Jumps per 1 Berserk.

Berserk just adds on a percent to Attack which in turn just boosts the damage you would do an extra like 10 damage a hit or so. On a weapon like GK you'll probably hit what 10-12 times a min.? So in 3 min. they'll pull off about an extra 360 damage. Get all 3 jumps to land and that's 300+.

The difference really is berserk spreads out the damage per hit and Jump concentrates it in 1 strike. If you have ungodly good accuracy then Jump probably could beat berserk, but otherwise berserk turns out better and a saying covers it's reason why easily "Don't put all your eggs in one basket."

so..your saying SAM/WAR would make better? I mean it's that or /THF or /RNG for me. I mean as a taru i'm probably gonna want /WAR to deal more dmg.

[Macht]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

Well that was in comparison to SAM/DRG. For Samurai their strongest point is that they can build TP fast, when they have the right AF gear meditate gives them 100%+ TP so they can SC no problem with that on themselves or to two other players.

SAMs are TP masters, having them do /THF kind of is a counter balance to their purpose. They are often SC starters unless they are SC'ing to themselves, as starters the more damage you do is ok as long as the closer can top that damage then you'll get a SC result that's usually very damaging unless the monster resists it.

Though SAM/THF does work since SATA is decent damage. An alternate to SATA for damage though would be Barrage with SAM/RNG, Barrage will basically accomplish everything it sounds like you are trying for. To be good at SC'ing, deal good damage, and be a great starter so the SC itself does good damage.

A good Barrage on VTs or IT+ will get you around 250-400 damage, fairly close to what SATA without a WS will do. Also unlike the SATA you get a good TP boost, the downfall though is using Barrage will draw hate on you.

[berzerk]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

how many skillchains can SAMS weapon skills make? I mean if SE made then TP masters, i wouldnt think there would be to many different ones..I'm probably wrong though

[neighbortaru]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

barrage will also miss without some RAcc+ gear. Just go /war, "it just works."

how many skillchains can SAMS weapon skills make? I mean if SE made then TP masters, i wouldnt think there would be to many different ones..I'm probably wrong though

err just look at the skillchain chart.

[Macht]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

For a quick sample of a Cycle a SAM can do if they really tried would be:

Tachi: Koki -> Tachi: Kagero -> Tachi: Jinpu -> Tachi: Gekko -> Tachi: Koki

As you notice this cycle circles, with meditation + icarus wing + barrage + 2HR a SAM could probably pull off about 6-7 SCs in succession.

Double Post Edited:
With 2 SAMs in a party really trying you have 12-14 SCs in succession. Just cycle that one I mentioned and you go around on it 3 whole times and maybe get 2 more done.

That isn't the only cycle GKs can do if you look at the Skillchart you'll find ones that can cycle between just 2 elements to going to all 6 (excluding Light and Dark).

[Caspian]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

thank you for a clear answer

Jei, don't be so sarcastic

Oh yeh Niwaar, my LS leader is Scudmissile.
so..your saying SAM/WAR would make better? I mean it's that or /THF or /RNG for me. I mean as a taru i'm probably gonna want /WAR to deal more dmg.

Two things:
1. How was anyone else not clear about their answer? A few points were presented on a few advantages of /drg and then compared to /war, /thf, and /rng. In most cases /drg was found to not be too great post 30.

2. I'm not sure how Jei was being sarcastic, you questioned the usefulness of SATA and he explained it to you.

I lied, 3 things:

3. Yes, SAM/WAR would in almost all cases be better than /drg, especially after 30.

[Macht]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

Actually looking at it there is a way to get all 8 elements, I obviously just wasn't looking good enough at it >.>

[lilguy]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

i think it's unique

[ibroyles]

Re: does this job combo sounds unique?

/war does "jsut work." However, higher level /RNG seems like a viable, if not a little "niche" sub for SAM. You have to know how to play it, to make it truly effective(which I find appealing). RNG sub actually also works really good at low levels with quite a few jobs, I've noticed, due to Sharpshot being a Lv1 ability. However, that crutch probably shouldn't be used past 10-12 where you'll want to sub WAR just to be able to voke off the mages if needed.