Meditate...how do you use it?

[Kurgan]

Originally posted by davidmmmm9


how about 3 level 3 renkeis? ; P

Kind of hard to me to do being pre-lv65.

[ricesteam]

how about 3 level 3 renkeis? ; P

How often? Per battle? Every other? One in two moons?

[protoroc]

well ok first of all samurai supposed to know skillchain (no chart >< bad me but i got a pretty good memory), first you gotta have some reneki partner that know what they doing. meditate gain 20 tp/sec for 5 secs. easiest way i maximize it, is make sure i go first, if you go second you gotta make sure your renkei partner knows how to count your meditate (dont always blame it on the sam, they are not the only job responisble for renkei). but im still quite entertained with selfrenkei, so this comes easy for me, best way to use meditate is to split it in half (or 3-4 if your penta master) one thing that upsets me tho pld that rest after 41...after 41 pld is renkei partner also, so rdm refresh the paladin he doesnt have things like clear mind (most whm sub blm)

oh also i find that it help if i get to the zone first and begin meditation before the rest of the party arrives

[Geo]

I just set-up 2-4 Renkeis under certain conditions.
But Im a good SAM ;p

[DrSerpico]

Meditate and it's uses.

The way I use meditate, the way it should be used I think, is not fire when it becomes available and do damage as fast as possible. We are damage enablers, not damage dealers.

Sure, we do some dmg, but 2*bliss2 burst distortion is better than one blizzII distortion, no?

example: pld, drk, sam. (backbone is brd, blm, whm)
pld is at 60%, drk at 89, sam has 100%+
(kinda normal scenario.) Skillchains are vorpal scythe > Tachi: Jinpu and Tachi: Enpi > Seraph Blade (assume higher 50s and crabs, so ice is nice ^^

Drk gets 100% tp and fires vorpal, I link jinpu. Now, most sam fire meditate right after. I however do not. I build tp again, getting to 60 often, then pld flashes 100%tp. I medi, get 2 ticks of tp, then shoot Enpi his way.

End result here is that I end up with 74%tp (60medi+14ws), whereas the sam who shoots medi right after renkei will be back to 14%.

Now this is a bit situational tho. If mob is low after drk skillchain, and you judge pld won't be able to renkei, fire medi. The extra tp is some extra dmg, and pull time will enable medi ti refresh. This becomes less viable with better parties, as time between pulls aren't long enough to refresh meditate. Hence you'll be letting a renkei partner wait... Something I HATE to do.

Only time any team has had to wait for me was with 3 other melee, all renkei'ing with me. Then they had to wait for me from 60% or so here and there.

Mastering the timed meditate and using parts of medi for ws and then getting part from charge will in time earn you the rumour of "That crazy sam that ALWAYS has tp, even with 2 ppl to renkei with." That's what we sams are about. That, and our two last ws are just SUPERB eyecandy ^^

Good luck!

[azik]

I'm only lvl34, but the last party I was in I think the skill chains went off pretty well.

Was NIN, THF, and SAM (me).

I was doing skill chains with both the NIN and THF, most battles their TP was far enough apart that I could usually catch up or even get ahead of whoever for the next skill chains.

Every couple of battles though I would have somewhere over 100%, one of them would have over or very close to 100% and the other would have somewhere in the 80-90% range, meaning they would be able to renkei that battle. I would do skill chain with one, hit Meditate, then do skill chain with the other.

The THF who had a higher lvl SAM explained it all to me, and the Rank10 JP NIN seemed happy as well

[Ashtyr]

NA SAMs suck? Well, I guess every SAM posting here about their leetness either suck or are JP players huh? And since I'm an NA SAM I must REALLY suck then huh? Give me a fucking break.

Anyway, with that said, in different instances I use meditate in different ways. Say, the party is a bit beaten up and everyone's resting. Well, no point in wasting time, so I meditate myself. Maybe to boost myself over the 100 mark or just to get some extra damage with my WS, whatever. By the time the party's ready to go, meditate's recharged and ready for another whirl.

And of course, Meditate's primary use is the Renkai/Magic Burst. With a set of 3 Melee, tank, 2 mages, I can do something like this:

Tank or melee > me > Tank or Melee > me > Tank or melee > Mage(Magic Burst)

That spells out O-U-C-H for the monster. Of course, this is considering the tank has enough TP and we have a refresher. And for those who are nimble of hand, it's best to use meditate, then use the WS (like I do) to minimise the time spent on the ticks (so that say, if I use Meditate then Enpi, right after Enpi I have 34 TP. That coupled with another attack or two due to double attack triggering means more weapon skills). In fact, with this method I have been able to achieve self renkeis (Self Renkei through Tachi Enpis and Meditate = Party's jaw dropping). And yes, I do have all my melee members/tanks report their TP consistently so I can know when to meditate and when not to. And what the Paladin up there says holds true too. Two people that can Renkei with me and not each other? Not to worry! Chain once! Meditate! Chain again!

There are NAs who know how to play SAM efficiently (like me). Don't think that just cause a player is JP that he or she is a God or something. I can kick just as much ass as a JP Samurai my level, possibly more.

BTW Cali, your example of using Meditate BEFORE Meikyo Shisui is quite inefficient. It's much easier to just use a weapon skill, meikyo shisui, weaponskill, THEN meditate. Better to have a sure thing rather than accidentally mess up your own renkei. Also, it takes an INCREDIBLE amount of LUCK to pull of a self renkei with Meditate. Normally Meditate cannot allow for self renkeis. BUT, if something like Double Attack triggers, only then is it possible. Sorry, it seems you know less about SAM than those who really play it.

[TMPikachu]

This post was made before the TP fix, so self renkeis weren't luck dependant then.

Pretty much, JP have played longer, so JP will play better (usually)

Being Japanese does not make you a better player inherently though.


On how I use meditate. In Yhoater, I just fire off one free enpi when I can, the parties I had been in weren't that great with SC's, so I figured make the best of it. We would still get off one SC, so that was a start.
One party I was in though had another Samurai in addition to myself. It's very fun to get two+ MB's off every battle! Enpi-Enpi then whatever the BLM casts for the nice explosion, good times.

[e22]

I find the first post extremely racist and insulting. I am NA and I play SAM the way the poster says is a "JP SAM". I am not JP. I am glad for the post, because I see a LOT of SAMs not using Meditate properly. Perhaps the thread starter could have said "most" NA SAMs, or something to that effect. Ashtyr also gives a good example of other instances to use Meditate. Usually when I enter a zone, I Meditate immediately. If we get aggro somewhere along the line, I have a WS I can use to end that fight faster. If not, when we get to camp, I have 100% TP.

Otherwise, I always have 2 SC partners. Sometimes, with my Acc+ gear, I don't even need meditate to pull off my [ B ] chain, because by the time my [ B ] partner has TP, I'm ready. If not, I Meditate for whatever I need, immediately launch the SC at 100, and have TP coming leftover afterwards.

I have had a PT with 2 SAMs, a WAR and a RNG. If you had been there you would have seen how well 2 NA SAMs (we were BOTH NA, gee, what a shock) can manage TP enough to chain alternately between themselves, the WAR and the RNG, AND switch out partners depending on who has TP and who has Meditate. I had SC call macros for [ A ], [ B ] and [ C ].

People (who apparently are also NA SAMs) mentioned being the SC starter, and this is very much the ideal for any SAM doing his job holding up two SCs. 99% of the time you want to be the SC starter so you can control TP. However, once in a while, as in my example above, the best SC is one with you at the end. This takes a little more effort to manage, and takes a few fights to really manage efficiently. With the RNG we had to set up a Sidewinder > Tachi: Jinpu SC... I would call at 100, it would take him a few seconds to setup Sharp Shot, and let loose his macros, I'd be at 150-160% before actually using my SC. Solution? I call ready at 60-80%. I still end up wasting at maybe 120%, but it allows a little room for error in case I end up whiffing a few hits.

As I said, I am glad in general that this post brings up the subject of TP management, which IMO is the most important thing a SAM needs to learn along with the Renkei chart, but I wish you had left race out of it. {Thank You.}
{Goodbye!}