SAM's Role At Higher Levels?

[Lyonesse]

At higher levels, SAMs aren't primary damage dealers (although they do great damage at 30 below. They're primary function is to assist heavier attackers and boost the total damage through skillchains in my opinion.

For example, in a level 41 with two MNKs that have Raging Fists the SAM can toss two separate Tachi: Kageros so that each Monk can chain a Raging Fists to produce a Fusion. I've seen that chain produce upwards of 350 damage on the fusion alone on weaker enemies and 150-250 on VT-ITs. That's the true strength of the SAM IMO.

Of course, that's if Tachi: Kagero can be followed by Raging Fists =P.

[AlthornCS]

My experience as a WHM has also been that they make better secondary tanks than dragoons and dark knights. They don't take hits as well as a paladin or a warrior, but most dragoons and dark knights seem to just melt away under a monster's attention, while the samurai seem to do a better job of staying alive.

[Takedashingen]

From my experience, Samurai is just a tool for black mages to unleash more magic bursts. My set lvling group is pld, 2 sams, 2 blms and 1 whm. With this pt configuration we do at least two skillchains and 4 magic bursts each mob, resulting in pretty quick kills. I think as you get to higher lvls individual dmg is really not as important as overal group damage and killing speed because that figures into exp/hour ratio more. This is where samurai really shines I think, samurais are true team players, we don't have high dmg with our physical attacks but we contribute better than anyone else towards skillchains and magic bursts which are essentially the bulk of a good exp pt's dmg. I've never really had to put my pt flag up post lvl30 cuz I lvled with ls so I really can't comment on the sexiness of samurais, but I do understand that is it tough to get a group but it's the same for all other melees. All this talk about sam being useless after lvl60 cuz that's when ppl can sub lvl30 sam with med hasn't come to fruition yet as far as I know. Whenever I do a search of higher lvl melees on my server everyone has either war or thf as sub, depending on the main, mnks and drks have thf sub while dragoons have war sub. Sam sub only gives you 60 tp but we get 140 tp at lvl60 with af helmet, so it's still an advantage for us. Also I heard from a fellow ls samurai that Squarenix is planning to tweak samurai so that it isn't just a job ppl play to sub eventually, I hope this is true. On that note does anyone have information about this or is Knell hallucinating from shrooms again?

[Wanderer]

Yups

Very very true. SAMs aren't known for individual damage. However when it comes to skillchains, most SAMs become the center of attention. Many many times I've been used as a bridge between Renkei. Either Starting and finishing or linking 2 different Renkei. I really don't see how anyone can degrade or talk negative about any job really. At first people were talking bad about RDMs. Now passed level 41 everyone WANTS one in their party. I personally think all classes are awesome in their own respect. MNKs are awesome when it comes to constant damage. DRGs do some amazing WS. DRKs individual damage is pretty mean. PLDs are the saving grace of a party. WHMs...will always be WHMs and tend to get very hard to find hahaha. BLMs are the ultimate nukers. RDMs are awesome and eventually become the other mages "best" friend. RNGs do great damage on their own. BSTs do some amazing stuffs with pets. SMNs are just amazing. BRDs are sought after like RDMs; their songs are awesome support. NIN are pretty wicked with their ninjitsu. And I'm sorry if I missed your job type but I've over done this post heehee. I'm pretty sure someone's going to post right after me and flame or rant or try to make me look bad. But that's how some people are. I've always tried to be positive to help people. Hey hey OutofRhythm131 I posted a lil bit about how I use my SAM job in a party:

http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/sho...threadid=33295

Ignore the negative posts on there. The post wasn't a "Feel Good" post. It was more of a positive message for people not to give up on SAM just cause other people put us down. Have fun in whatever you do man! Take care.

-Wanderer-

[Hamster]

wanderer said it best. Just have fun. you are a great skillchain linker with your katana, jinpu owns, and they are adding more demons to the game, which will get sam's a LOT more attention ^^

if you enjoy sam and like the AF, just go with it and have fun

[swordchucks]

well the japanese seem to like sams

Over the past week ive been researching SAM trying to figure out if i wanted to be one there was alot of positive and alot of negative talk but i decided it was the job for me and heres what i learned
1. on my server atleast high level sams rarely sit seeking for very long unless theres to few people in their range around(on the other hand /sea drg 55-75 was a line of seek icons) so apparently the japanese like to have samurais atleast.
2. the people who think samurai suck are generally the people who just see they dont hurt as much as say a drk its the same thing that happened to monk.If people understood their purpose they wouldnt have a bad name us renkei,monks weaker yet consitent damage
3. Therefore only smart people would want a SAM around after 30,which kinda worries me because a majority of the NA players definately arent rocket scientists if you get my drift,no offense to anyone here but ive met a scary amount of people on this game so stupid it made lose my faith in humanity
4. And lastly SAM sucks as a sub you sacrifice alot from a thf or warrior sub for 60 tp every 3 minutes not worth it in my book. We're a much better main to me atleast,im not sure why drg/sam got such i good reputation....drg/warrior has so much more to offer berserk and double attack alone are more worth it

[Wanderer]

heehee

Nice observation Swordchuck. Now if only the rest of the world can see it that way too.

-Wanderer-

[Geo]

The world is a giant imbecile, and we are victims of it.

[Quezi]

Iv been playing mmorpgs for 5 years. I thought that all people where idiots to untill i started playing with people from other parts of the world. Various places in europe and asia and whatnot.. I hate to say but its true, id really rather not play with _most_ NA players. I usualy just duo with my friend whos been with me from the begining, or we get a third person and smack some sence into them. But its rare to find a large group of people who are able to acualy work togeather with some unity.

The thing most people are not able to realise is that you do not own your charicter, your party does. When you join a party you give yourself up to the collective, all actions you do and all your abilities are there to ensure the prosperity of the party. Individual damage numbers are not important. If you want that then you may aswell have a white mage, a paladin, maby a red mage or bard, and the rest black mages. Ofcorse this wouldnt work verry well, but thats my point. If the party succeeds yoy succeed , if they fail you fail.

Much the same way that some people are unable to comprehend that its better to kill something for half the exp than to spend three times aslong killing something else, people are just drawn to big numbers.

Takedashingen said "Samurai is just a tool for black mages to unleash more magic bursts". This is true. What many people dont realise is that everyone is a tool for something when they are in a party. If they are not usefull then they are not going to be there. The DRK hitting away on that mob is not an individual, he is an extention of the party. Those damage numbers are not his, they are the parties, with out the party he would not be able to do those numbers. He is simply a tool which is used by the party, by himself he is nothing. Such then as a tank is what lets the DRK be usefull, a nuker is what lets the SAM be usefull. A PLD does not have high damage numbers, do they suck? Everyone has a place. MB are verry usefull and damageing and SAM allow it to happen more often. If SAM did NO damage at all but could WS constantly forever, would they then be useless?

[Mikeb]

In general I'd rather play with Japanese players... Although I have been in a few (maybe 1 in 5) NA parties that are worthwhile. I don't have Samurai yet (I've leveled enough jobs for now - concentrating on 1 atm), but most Samurai I've partied with have been good. Do decent damage, easy to do skillchains with, etc... IMO Darkknights are the most overrated class (although they are good if played right - this means actually using magic and doing magic bursts off skillchains). But yeah, I would invite a Samurai for sure into my party (they make good secondary tanks as well).

[evilution]

I love a SAM in my partys We ever end up waiting on a melee to get TP because in a standard 3 melee 3 mage type party either the tank or the 2nd damage dealer will be at 100% TP and the SAM is >ALWAYS< ready for a WS chain if he is played well

Not to mention they are the perfect member to take a hit or 2 (thanks 3rd eye) while the THF sets up trick/sneak onto the PLD or NIN.

[imac2much]

There is an inherent problem with SAM at LV 65-70.

Hear me out, I am in no ways a SAM hater, I wanted to be a SAM or RDM before I chose PLD. You all know the basic idea of SAM from 1-65... they are there for BLM's mainly to magic burst from multiple skill chains a battle.

Here's the problem. After LV 65, you will always want to do lvl 3 skillchains with your LV 225 WS's, because the skillchain damage ALONE can do 1.5k+ damage.... and then the BLM can MB a tier 3 or 4 spell off of that for more MB damage than a lvl 1 or 2 skillchain (liquefaction is an example of lvl 1, fusion of lvl 2, but you probably know that).

Herein lies the problem. Great Katana's LV 225 WS Tachi: Gekko is Distortion element, so the only element it can chain with is Gravitation. There are only 2 weapons with Gravitation LV 225 WS's : Sword (Swift Blade) and Katana (Blade:Ten). How often do you see parties with BOTH Paladins and Ninjas? Also, Swift Blade is SP so only Paladins can use them, not RDM or anyone else who uses swords.

This greatly detracts fromt he appeal of SAM from LV 65-70. I'm not exactly sure how wanted they are 70+, but from what I know, people prefer MNK and DRK as melees for 70+ (MNK mainly because h2h is so good against bones, which you'll be fighting a lot of).

So basically after LV 65 SAM is stripped of their most important PT contribution : allowing for multiple skillchains, since they can only do 1 skillchain per battle still (unless you want to do something other than a lvl 3 skillchain, which is generally a waste unless it's something very powerful like Sidewinder -> Dancing Edge). SAM don't do more DPS than other melee (DRK, RNG, MNK, etc), so even though they are still good members, they aren't as useful as another melee played with equal skill.

[FeralisCallidus]

My con for WAR/SAM is that I'll never tank as well as a PLD or NIN and I'll never deal damage as well as a DRG, SAM, or DRK.

You'll do damage that is closer to DRG and SAM than it is to DRK, RNG or MNK. [Why does everyone leave out RNG and MNK?]

[Geo]

You basiclly get a couple more SCs during battle. In order to really do good damage bursting anceint magic with a SAM is easier and you can do it more times each fight. I was bursting Freeze @ Garlaiage Citadel for about 1200 Damage 2 times per fight. Thats 500 Extra damage O.o