Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

[hongman]

So, my Group 2 Merits stand as capped Slow II and Phalanx II at the moment. I did have capped Paralyze II but the Tanks in my LS were screaming for Phalanx, and seeming as Para II really let me down....

Anyways, now, I want to cap Bio III for solo purposes - that extra dmg/tick makes the fight go much faster (which in itself is safety).

So which do I drop? ><

So Phalanx II - I dont use it all that often, since I merited it, we down mobs to fast to even make it worthwhile (grown in numbers). Great for things like Jormy, but we dont really do those often. Plus, some other RDMs have it now too (although I'm not sure what kind of effort they out into it for optimal gear swaps >.>)

Slow II - EVERY RDM in my LS has this pretty much. Again, not sure if capped or not etc etc. There is certainly no shortage of it, but I have always loved this spell. I use it a lot on low man stuff or what have you.

I cant decide

[Sabaron]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

It's not really a question in my mind any more. Phalanx II isn't strong enough to beat Scholar's Phalanxga. If you really need that kind of protection, Scholar has it covered. I'm sure little old Phalanx II still has some power to it being as it can be made continuous indefinitely, but for most applications, you can get by with either Diabolos' Noctoshield or Scholar's Phalanxga.

Slow II on the other hand is a very nice debuff. If both of your merits are well-stocked by others, why not go back to Paralyze II? The other option is to have them diversify a bit--seeing as you're reworking a level 3 merit for Bio III anyway instead of reworking two, make a party of it (if they have multiple meripo jobs) and have a couple others diversify the LS portfolio. It'd be nice to have a good even mix. Dia III can be useful as well.

[hongman]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

Yeah, both capped.

We dont have any SCH yet but will do pretty soon I think...

[Icemage]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

I'd drop Slow II to level 1. It's nice, but there's not much point in capping it, IMO. It's accurate enough without extra levels and while the extra levels increase potency (somewhat), the differences aren't "that" dramatic.

It's still handy for mobs that like to buff themselves with Haste effects, though, so don't lose it entirely.

Personally, I think any tank that's screaming for Phalanx II is a whiny little punk, but that's just me. It doesn't stop all that much damage per hit. If you're really interested in reducing the damage they take, Bio III is a better option for many circumstances.


Icemage

[hongman]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

Hmm - anyone know the actual % difference between Slow II at level 1 and 3 (presuming no resists and same mnd difference)

I am really torn, and I am actually thinking of making the comprimise of Phalanx II -2 Slow II - 1, Bio III - 3.

I keep all the spells, albeit reducing potency of the others...all about comprimise right? :x

[Sabaron]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

Hmm - anyone know the actual % difference between Slow II at level 1 and 3 (presuming no resists and same mnd difference)

I am really torn, and I am actually thinking of making the comprimise of Phalanx II -2 Slow II - 1, Bio III - 3.

I keep all the spells, albeit reducing potency of the others...all about comprimise right? :x

You can look here:
http://www.theorderls.com/phpBB2/vie...r=asc&start=45

According to wiki the tier 3 top end is 37%, tier 2 is 35.56%. Tier 1 is 33%, but I believe the low end stays fixed at 22% regardless. You'll lose about 4% dropping to tier 1 and it's potency will drop below that of Hojo: Ni which will then overwrite it.

Here's the thread I was looking for:

http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/red...ing-magic.html

[Callisto]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

I really, really, really don't think you should drop either of these in favor of full Bio III merits. Bio III just isn't that much better than Bio II, while Slow II is much better than Slow, and Phalanx II is much better than no Phalanx II. The most you're going to get out of Bio III without /SCH is about 8/tick iirc, and that's w/ some pretty heavy Dark Magic+ gear.

Bio II does 6/tick and lasts four times as long than a level 1 Bio III, and you'd need full Bio III merits to match the DoT damage of Bio II, and even then you're just getting stronger initial damage, for about 50% the MP cost. I know what you're soloing, and Slow II is indespensible if you get caught with an Ice Break on Zip, and Phalanx II saves a ton of MP worth of cures in larger LS events.

I definitely recommend sticking w/ Bio II, but that's just my opinion.

Personally, I think any tank that's screaming for Phalanx II is a whiny little punk, but that's just me. It doesn't stop all that much damage per hit. If you're really interested in reducing the damage they take, Bio III is a better option for many circumstances.

Icemage

That really only works for fighting one single mob, in something like Dynamis or Limbus Phalanx II is much more useful, unless you want to spend 50+ MP casting Bio III on every mob. My Phalanx takes off 18/hit, not a huge chunk but it adds up.

[hongman]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

Callisto, I hear ya. But I really dont use Phalanx much. And I mean, REALLY rarely use it.

Even in Dynamis-Xarc now the NMs dont last longer than 30s and that is pretty much the only common place I can see it being used in our LS Events. We dont do Wyrms often or anything like that. Anyways, I AM still trying to decide >.<

Thanks for the figures Sab, my elvaan ass is so lazy :D

How much difference is there between the landing damage of Bio II and Bio III anyone? My Bio II damage lands for single to low end double digits normally on these kinda mobs.

Or SE could just let me merit all 3 fully :/

[Callisto]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

Bio II will do 6/tick for 120 seconds, maxed Bio III with 225+ skill does 8/tick for 90 seconds(I forgot what the 9/tick tier is, if there is one reachable by /NIN). Both of these add up to 240 damage, the only damage increase maxed Bio III is giving you is in the initial damage, if it's something hard like Sky NMs, Bio II will fetch you about 7-10, III will get you 35~ in my experiences.

[hongman]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

But over a typical fight, thats a lot of 30s differences :x

[Callisto]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

Yes, but you're Elvaan like me, so you also need to consider that Bio II costs 180 MP over 10 minutes, while Bio III costs more than 350 if you have maxed merits. I'm not sure what your exact setup is, but with 2 MP merits and Glace I only get 700~ MP as /NIN in my base set, 800~ in my Convert set. Spamming away that much MP doesn't leave alot of room for emergency Cures. If your initial damage #'s were similar to mine that extra 170+ MP would net you 180 extra damage, in which case you may as well just throw out a Blizz 3 once every 10 minutes and take the chance at getting 2+x that.

[Celeal]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

I am wondering if RDM/SCH's Phalanxga vs. Phalanx II (rdm/sch, NOT sch)? Is that compatible?

[Callisto]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

/SCH can't do the AoE buff thing, that's 40SCH afaik.

[Celeal]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

Oh ic, thx for the info

[Icemage]

Re: Which to drop - Slow II or Phalanx II

I wasn't suggesting that he max Bio III. I think level 3 Bio III is just as much a waste of points as level 3 Slow II, to be honest.

But Hongman does a lot of small-group activities as well as endgame stuff, and toward that end, Bio III at level 1 is a worthwhile investment. It's a decent (if slightly expensive) short-term DoT that lets you run past enemies that you've cast Bind or Gravity on with a higher safety margin. It's also a handy counter to Hundred Fists, Mighty Strikes, and Blood Weapon in Dynamis.


Icemage