RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

[Hyrist]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

if you make the search comment that you're not going to main heal, that's one thing

Last line of all my /seacoms searching as a RDM:

{Main} {Heal!} {No Thanks!}

You're preaching to the chior again BBQ. I go through great extents not to give playes the wrong ideas. If I feel up to being main-healing for a day, I wont put it up. Or if I dont have enough room in my /seacom, I discuss it first thing with the inviter, BEFORE I accept invite.

Most of the time I am building a party anyways, as players seem to be reluctant to take the initiative in making parties to begin with.

When it comes to bending arms to help 'get my way'. I'm not doing it to ruin the fun of anyone in the game. In fact, when I barter, I try to keep it well within the line of reason so that at the very least the majority of the players will enjoy themselves while playing. I've learned from experience, that party members who are enjoying themselves, stay longer if they can.

If I'm stressing out trying to keep a poor tank or DD healed due to bad circumstances, I'm going to wear out quickly. If there is some way I can change what the party is doing so things run smoother for myself and everyone, then I'm going to enjoy myself more, and tire out less.

Worst case cenerio I put up my flag, and think I can do some main healing, and I get stuck with a bunch of assholes who turn a party into a total stress-fest, via pushing the mages and support around and being all around assholes, then I'm inclined to drop party.

Feed your greed elsewhere, I'm a casual player and always will be.

That doesn't mean I wont support a burn, but it does mean if the burns push to hard as to not make the party enjoyable at all, then they can find some other poor sap to stress out.

And if someone resents me for my play choices, that's their progrative, not mine. I'm tired of the clishe accusations melee jobs try to put on support classes like "Prima Dona RDM BRD, etc." and other such Bull.

If melee's wouldn't be so hard on their support classes, they would be more of them willing to assist them.

[Yellow Mage]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

Signet update ftw! ^_^b

[Shinhiryu_Kage]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

Wow.... looks like Signet update just blew RDM MEREE NO THANKS arguments out the window....

.... talk about a reprieve... lolz

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

Wow.... looks like Signet update just blew RDM MEREE NO THANKS arguments out the window....

.... talk about a reprieve... lolz

RoZ/CoP have just become a little more viable for solo/duo and the odd EXP PT, but that's it. The community will still prefer ToA zones and the TP penalty for resting still applies there.

Sanction buffs do not cross over to the other zones, so Signet isn't going to cross over to ToA zones.

[Hyrist]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

Still, further encouragement for solo-trios isn't hurting the hybrid angle any. On anything EM and below, it barely takes anything for a RDM to hit that 80-85% Accuracy ratio.

I think this helps the whole Hybrid style more actually, as it provides a window of entry. Duos and Trios see how well a Hybrid rdm preforms in the small time, might be more inclined to give it a shot in other situations.

We'll see how it plays out.

As far as food options go. You're not going to get much of a choice for rounded out items. Only about 3 or 4 food selections are really balanced in stats for what we are looking for, and those are about 20k a pop for a 3 hour food item.

Other than that you got your choice of classic foods to see what suits you best. And again it really ends up depending on the situation you are in.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

Wow.... looks like Signet update just blew RDM MEREE NO THANKS arguments out the window....

.... talk about a reprieve... lolz

I fail to see how signet change would have a drastic effect on a good RDM who's melee'ing at high levels--RDM really don't get to rest much between Refresh, Haste, enfeebling, main/backup healing to begin with.

[Hyrist]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

Consider that now pretty much any job can rest for a quick Hp tick without costing their TP, and how much that would save over time, and it contributes to our MP preservation tactics.

Esepecially in the case of DRGs and PLD's they'll be able to rest a bit of their MP pool back as well, which assists in keeping the chain going without ruining TP now.

All this makes a Hybird RDM easier to manage his MP pool, and be able to do something like melee without harming the party any.

And this issue encouraging the 2-5 person party is nice too, because in no way can any player really tell a RDM to back line against an EM.

[hongman]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

Why is everyone picking apart the smallest little details? We all have differnet opinions, and whilst is is great to get a discussion going this thread has demoralized into more arguing than discussion. Any discussion that does get posted is immediately ripped apart and a 3 page arguement ensuing.

Whilst I am really interested in this topic (as you can tell by my numerous posts on soloing and meleeing over the course of my career) - I am now just starting to skim this thread, looking in hopes for the useful bits.

EDIT: now watch my post get ripped apart

[Hyrist]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

Nah, you're right. We shoulden't be wasting time arguing and sould start working on the details of how's and when's. I've posted some bits of info here and there that I will compile when I get back home.

Till then ,bear with me and try to pick out some tidbits. Right now I'm trying to keep the idea of defining the roll as a focus. What ways to help and what techniques would be worth testing out. I've got a few ideas in leu but have yet the time to collect them on papper (or post.)

[BurningPanther]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

In the interest of keeping the thread technical(which is only what it ever should have been about), I'm interested mostly in procuring a good gearset that walks the line between physical and magical stats, since there's no denying that in any fight, a RDM's greatest companion to his sword is his spells.
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I'm where I want to be(currently) for weapons, sticking with the Joyeuse/Hornetneedle/Gilt Buckler.

I'd much rather an Astral Aspis(accidentally dropped it ;_; ) or Genbu's shield, but those aren't soon in coming, and my Gilt buckler dosen't often see use anyhow, since, I'm usually /NIN and Dual Wielding.

Eventual Sea access will grant me a Justice sword/Virtue stone, which would make a nice replacement for the Hornetneedle(in some situations). Other options for Ranged/Ammo slot include Lamian Kaman and Phantom Tathlum.

For head gear, I'm rather obvious. Many will tout the Walahra turban, but while I play on my RDM, the Warlock's chapeau simply does not come off my head. The only way that it will come off is for the Duelist's chapeau, whenever I get it.

The current body pieces I have been going with are Scorpion harness/Chasuble, mostly for lack of anything better. I was considering the Blue cotehardie, but the but the negative stats simply weight too much on my mind.
My current great ambition is the Pahluwan khazagand, but it's like pulling teeth getting a team to do Ilrusi Atoll Assault. The hHP, Acc, and Crit Rate on it are dreamy, though.

Hand pieces alternate between the Duelist's gloves and Wise gloves, mostly for the +INT/MND on them respectively, though the Enhancing, M. Def, and Acc on them(respectively) are decent too.

Leg pieces stay on the Duelist's tights. If anyone has better ideas, let me know. One day, I too will have Crimson cuisses...

For the feet, it's Duelist's boots.

Neckwear various through the various magical torques as needed, but the I macro it usually to put a Parrying torque back in place after the spell in question has been cast.

Ear pieces vary, though due to limited macro space, the Right ear piece stays on Moldavite earring until I get an improvement(thinking on a Loquacious, Hollow, or Brutal earring). Mostly, Left ear pieces vary among the level 30 "+3 Skill" earrings. I've taken to focusing more on skill, but may find a place for Phantom earring +1 in the future. For now, though, it sees little use.

Rings vary same as above, with the right finger holding in reserve for the Jelly ring(I Damage reduction). Genius and Serenity rings macro in and out as needed, with a Ruby ring for Savage blade macros. I'm thinking of snatching up a Spinel ring to better modify Evisceration.

Back gear usually stays on Umbra cape(again, I Damage reduction), mostly because I've usually run out of macro space by this point, so my Prism cape has nowhere to go.

Waist gear usually stays on Penitent's rope, until I get a Swift/Speed/Duelist's belt. I was thinking on grabbing the Life belt off my mule, which I think I'd rather need, but I feel I'll miss +5 INT/MND.




...And there you have it. My setup is mostly magic based, with the barest DEX/Acc interspersed, and even less focused to Atk or STR.

[Shinhiryu_Kage]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

RoZ/CoP have just become a little more viable for solo/duo and the odd EXP PT, but that's it. The community will still prefer ToA zones and the TP penalty for resting still applies there.
Sanction buffs do not cross over to the other zones, so Signet isn't going to cross over to ToA zones.

Your statement is terribly illogical. It's not in your power or authority to purport the intentions of any other individual rather than yourself. Speculate, sure, but those were not your words. You don't know what kinds of things people may figure out that will work w/the new bonues. If you did, then you certainly wouldn't have said what you said.

I fail to see how signet change would have a drastic effect on a good RDM who's melee'ing at high levels--RDM really don't get to rest much between Refresh, Haste, enfeebling, main/backup healing to begin with.

I know it was said that under ideal circumstances, a RDM won't have to rest in high end xp parties.

But the problem with that statement, is that, not all xp parties are ideal and for numerous reasons that should be obvious. However, there are times when I have to rest between chains. It probably doesn't help matters that I am a Galka, but, yet again, when did race have to do with anything? Isn't that what the choir preaches? I mean, that's fine, if as a Galka, my race is inferior to being a vast MP pool and required to rest, versus, someone else that plays another race and has average to great MP and doesn't. The idea does not negate the fact that the Signet bonus of being able to rest and not lose tp can be purposefully effective.

For all intents and purposes, being able to rest to gain MP and not lose TP is quite beneficial. I'm starting to see, and wanting to advocate, that RDM melee isn't such the bad thing that we all have socially and by experience, purported RDM melee to be. And this is for all levels of play. The game is changing. New ideas and situations are opening up. I, being a creature of habit, change with the times.

More to come...

[Sevv]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

Ya there was no way i was gonna read 10 pages of ppl bitching lol. Right before i got suspended i joined a pt in nyzule island. The rdm insited he needed to sub nin for when colbiri reflected on him. I started to argue seeing i was going nin and his spells were just gonna hurt me not him, the ldr /t me to just let it go there was no brds thats why we had the rdm (not ment as a flame). Pt started he only used enspells and the whm had to beg fro refresh, in this case rdm melee didnt keep up just my last exp with a rdm trying to melee @75.

There are plenty of rdms who can keep up with everything and melee, if you are one of those ppl take out your sword and smack the shit outa the mob. But if in order for you to melee your performance drops then take a seat in the back. When you have to get rid of gear that helps land spells, to maybe hit that mob 1 more time its not worth it.

Hell i tanked as Rdm/Nin to 40 lvled with a thf friend of mine all because someone said that i personally couldnt and neither could a rdm.

[Ryba]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

Hyrist, I have a perfect example for what you're asking for.

In TP burn PTs, RDM should not melee....period, without additional support in the back (which you generally don't have but a max of 1 healer and 1 debuffer/support, rest melee)

*****Warning of slight rant =/*****

When I was exp'ing 75SMN in TP Burn/Roam PT, I had to do double the workload of healing and status cures that the RDM could have been doing, causing us to have to break on chain #7-8 for MP for extended periods (only made it to 7-8 b/c I had a brief couple ticks to rest MP between fights as I was helping locate mobs to kill, so I'd drop a knee there as melee run to mob <_<), and being as RDM was more concerned with TP and hitting the current mob, not watching for adds/links, 2 ppl died <_< He was engaged to a mob with <t> macros for cures, so of course once my MP was gone, the melee were screwed. Worst RDM I've ever PT'd with in the last 4yrs.

****Anti-Flame segment****
Personally, I have no issues if you want to melee, but do it under proper conditions, not when SMN is main healer in a TP Burn/Roam PT, and especially if you can't keep track of adds/links and help with the healing/status cures to keep the chains going.
****End Anti-Flame segment****

Now for the exact opposite of above, and what a RDM "should" be doing in a TP Burn/Roam PT. PT I had before said-sh*tty-RDM above, we had RDM/WHM. He never melee'd, he basically followed me around XD (Is it Mithra in tight pants?...I dunno XD), I always had Refresh, hell, I never dropped below 700mp, b/c he was picking up half the status cures/half the healing. Which allowed us to burn through chain #21...back-to-back, on several occasions lol I basically didn't get a break for the next 3-4hrs lol, cause we never stopped killing, not even for MP, and RDM and I were fine on MP =D

My point is; RDM-melee/Hybrid/whatever, has it's time and place, in a TP Burn/Roam with only 1 healing/support job, is not it. So hope that serves as an example of why RDM should not melee in TP Burn.

And just to clarify, this is my 2nd 75, I've been playing since NA release, and I have not once seen a RDM melee in TP Burn, it's just more logical for exp/hr to support rather than try to melee in AoE range causing your healer to have to deal with one more body for healing and status cures, that he/she already doesn't have the necessary MP for =/

Sorry if this turned into a big rant >_<, just still kinda peeved about that RDM 2 days ago. lol It's a game, it's up to you how you want to play it, but if you're not even going to assess the situation (and ignore all advice from the entire PT, even after 2 deaths) before you decide to melee, then expect PTs to be pissed off b/c you're killing the exp/hr...especially in Meripo.

*****End pseudo-rant lol*****

And thank you for your time -- m(._.)m

Edit #1: Just like Sev said; to add more detail, the said-sh*tty-RDM was wearing SH + Snipers + Walahra Turban(instead of AF1 hat <_<..whatever), but he insisted he could do it b/c his Enfeebling Magic is capped and merit'd >_>, so I got told the same thing by my leader, that Sev did, and he landed maybe half of the debuffs that he should've been, and of course he couldn't sleep anything >_< (not talking about Imps, specifically referring to Flies >_>), and he didn't pay attention to anyone's HP, which I already insinuated above. =/

-SM

[Shinhiryu_Kage]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

If we, as a community are wanting to establish a general rule of thumb about RDM and their ability to melee, then it seems we all might concede to the following:

As a rule of thumb, do not melee as a RDM. Support your party with: main healing/back up healing, back up nuking, and buffing.

Otherwise, given certain conditions and situations, a RDM has the ability to melee in the following:

there is enough healing to support the front line
there is enough buffing to support the front & back line

As long as those two situations exist, then it should be ideal for a RDM to melee.

I mean, I guess we could dissect even longer. But that's how I generall see it.

[tdh]

Re: RDM Melee (Renarudo Style)

There's a group in my Ls that have been in a semi-static just about their entire career in FFXI. They leveled NIN, MNK, and SAM to Lv.75 together, another group of them leveled THF, MNK, WHM together, and now they're going RDM, PUP, and PUP.

They've been doing a lot of Trio work since not many parties will take the role on 1 lolPUP, but two lolPUPs. Last night they were doing very well with just the 3 of them in Signet areas and /heal'n allowed the RDM to melee along with them, and still do her job as main healer in the group.

Of course this isn't Lv.75 melee like we've been focusing on, but at Lv.41 it seems to be viable. Maybe I'll have to find a way to do some Trio work as RDM.