Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

[Sierramoon]

Well, after much waiting and soloing, I joined my static party for the first time. I love solo'ing as a RDM, but during the static, I felt so useless. My enfeebles didn't stick and my fighting didn't cause nearly as much damage as the other damage dealer. Needless to say, at the end I felt pretty bad about my contributions. Am I doing something wrong?

The first thing I'd do is cast spells like Blind, Paralyze, Slow etc. Then I'd go in and start fighting with my sword. Please tell me that RDM gets better.

[Murphie]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

Well, your melee damage isn't going to compare to an actual DD job. Ever. So you'll have to take an L on that one.

Red Mage isn't really a front line job. It can be somewhat of one, especially later on in the game when they really become excellent soloers, but for the majority of your Red Mage career you'll find yourself standing back with the other mages.

Your responsibilities are enfeebling the mob (Which you're doing, and it might just be your level or lack of enfeebling skill that is causing that problem. A lack of MND or INT might be an issue too. You can fix that with gear.), minor nuking with elemental spells, and later on dispelling mob buffs, refreshing yourself and other MP users, and hasting melee. So with all that on your plate, you won't have time to melee the mob anyway. At least not while in a party.

What level were your friends? What jobs? Do some of them have subjobs yet while you don't? That might make a real difference.

You'll find your footing eventually. But I'll tell you right now that if you're expecting your Red Mage career to be that of a Fighter/Mage type, you're going to be disappointed. It's really more of a back line mage that fights every now and then.

[neighbortaru]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

if you've waited until 16 to PT, then your enfeebling skill musta been way under cap.

You'll find your footing eventually. But I'll tell you right now that if you're expecting your Red Mage career to be that of a Fighter/Mage type, you're going to be disappointed. It's really more of a back line mage that fights every now and then.

The man speaks truth (though personally i'm iffy on that last statement).

[Dragonsword]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

Since I dont know your race so I have the following general advice:

(1) as Jei once remarked here, at your lvl, you are generally invited for your cure. Do serve that function well, i.e. be the secondary healer;
(2) enfeebling being our prime job, despite ppl may not be able to realize this at your lvl, your first function is to enfeeble : Dia, slow, blind (the latter two should usually stick at your lvl) and paralyze. If your paralyze is resisted quite alot, use food to supplement your mind. Choose equipments that give you mnd or int (i.e. wand and so ...) while you cast these enfeebles.
(3) have food (apple or melon pie (for mp and +int) or goblin mushpot (for +10 mnd, available Jeuno goblin shop))
(4) food and juice stack, so if you can syn pineapple juice, ur mp will recover fast and less down time
(5) adopt macro to change equipment while casting. I swung my sword XD (elvaan), never mind the skillchain, but u should pay attention to possible magic burst though.

Good luck and dont be discouraged. Rdms are very important in every lvl of xp partying as well as in every endgame areas. ^^)b

*Edit: despite u just start to party till now, ur enfeebling will catch up in two or three xp sessions, just choose the suitable weapon and armor, as well as serve ur function in the static, rdm is flexible in its role, u will find your place very soon =D .

[Oogami]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

A Red Mage can melee if the situation calls for it. (E.g. in a 4-mage, 2-melee party, or a party with 2 Red Mages). But that opportunity will diminish as you level up. Especially after you get refresh (41) and haste (48).

As for your problems with white magic enfeebling (Slow, Paralyze), that is most likely because of the lack of +MND and low enfeebling skill. Get a wand, they give +INT and +MND. Also get 2 of the level 14 rings that give +1 MND. If you can afford them, get the ones that give +2 instead (these are going to be good till level 30+). The skill should go up as you use those spells on higher level targets, so that's not an issue.

The main reason is as Murphie had said, Red Mage is more of a Back Line Job, and their primary duty is weakening the target (enfeebles, dispel), and enhancing the party (refresh, haste). Secondary duties include backup healing, and doing Magic Bursts on a Skillchain. At higher levels, you might be called on to do main healing too.

As a mage, your MP takes precendence over your TP. Since you lose TP gradually when you /heal, you are not going to be as effective as a pure melee in dealing damage. Also, a one handed sword is not going to cut it in terms of melee damage output.

Of course, if you can fully keep up with your primary duty and secondary duties while meleeing, I don't see why you should not, except when fighting targets with Area Attack (like goblin bombs). Just remember to keep the En-spells on when you melee :D

[Murphie]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

The man speaks truth (though personally i'm iffy on that last statement).

It was kind of on the fly. If I'd taken my time I would have worded it better.

Then again, no matter that RDM is going all the way to 75 for me, it's only currently 27, so I'm not the best person to advise.

[nanatsu]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

If your enfeebling skill is low try casting Dia several times during the fight to skill it up. Also, make sure you're watching for when enfeebles wear off adn reapply them. At your level, your enfeebling skill should be close to 51 when capped. If it's significantly lower than that you're going to have trouble on exp mobs. It's hard to cap your skils on mobs that you solo at low levels. But like I said, Dia always lands so cast it often and skill up your enfeebling until things start to stick better (Don't cast Dia and Bio because Bio overwrites Dia and Dia won't work properly if Bio is still on the mob.).

Don't neglect your other enfeebling spells though. If something doesn't stick, recast until it does, but while you're waiting for recast timers cast something else. I found it helpful to cast Dia, then Slow first since it has a longer recast timer. Then cast Paralyze and Blind. If Slow didn't stick, I went back to Slow. If paralyze or Blind did not stick, I try those again until something sticks. If something wears off I cast it again. You also have the option of trying to poison the mob for more DoT. Light nuking and healing until something wears off should be something to focus on if you have enough mp. If the mob is almost dead and the melees are having a tough time killing it, that's a good time to nuke. At low levels you can swing your sword with good effect, but I was a backline Red Mage and I'd honestly recommend that.

[Sierramoon]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

Thanks everyone for your responses. My race is human btw. The party was sort of a mini party with a Ranger, Black mage, white mage and myself so I felt like I had to get in there and fight.

I have a fancy wand sitting in my mog house waiting for my static party and I forgot it! Mistake number 1.

I'm not sure what my enfeebling levels are but I will check next time I log on. I think it's in the 30s. When I solo, the first thing I cast is dia and then an elemental (aero is my current fave). I might toss in blind or something, but it's not my first priority. I'll change that to get my level up.

Thanks again for your suggestions and encouragement. I'll work on my enfeebling level and getting better gear/food from now on.

[Oogami]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

Ah, so it is a smaller party, and you were right to melee in that setup. You also do not have a tank (warrior/paladin/ninja) in your current static party, so it is going to be tough.

As for food, you need not necessarily get a "better" one. You just need a "suitable" one for your level, and function.

For example, if you are going to be a melee (for now), food that increases your attack, like Grilled Hare is good for your level. If you feel that you need more maximum MP, and want to improve your magic attack damage, eat pies. Apple pie should be the most affordable. If you just want to regenerate your MP faster during /heal, get Ginger Cookies.

You can learn more about food from those links I have put in there. Basically, certain food are "optimum" at a certain level range because they give % bonus with CAP (like Grilled Hare), and some food give fixed bonus (like pies), so the more expensive ones do give more benefit regardless of level.

(The next is more of an example for melee food, but you might need it in future)

Taking Grilled Hare and Meat Mithkabobs for example.
Let say you only have 50 attack.
Eating a Grilled Hare would give you 50 + (30%x50) [CAP 15] = 75 attack.
Eating a Meat MithKabob would give you 50 + (22%x50) [CAP 60] = 61 attack.

When your attack is 100,
Eating a Grilled Hare gives 100 + (30%x100) [CAP 15] = 115 attack.
Eating Meat Mithkabob gives 100 + (22%x100) [CAP 60] = 122 attack.
But! eating Dhalmel Steak, gives 100 + (25%x100) [CAP 45] = 125 attack.

As you can see, Meat Mithkabob is the "better" food. It can give a maximum of +60 attack as compared to Grilled Hare (+15 max) and Dhalmel Steak (+45 max). But it is not necessarily the best food for your level range.

[Jei]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

your enfeeble spells won't be totally reliable yet until you get elemental staffs. So don't worry about that part, it's just normal.

level 14+ imo Rdm's most helpful spell is cure 2... 14-21 there's only 2 jobs that can use this spell, and it's a very vital spells for the PT (normal PT... you know, without PLer.)

Then 32 dispel will give you a whole new reason to be invited to the group.

and 40-42 you'll get your zomg-invite-Rdm-NOW spell and ability.

[Icemage]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

From 1-13, RDM is a solo machine. Offense, defense, magic, the works. You have a bit of everything, and you don't lag behind even specialist jobs by much in any category.

Level 14-31, RDM is mostly identical to WHM but with slightly weaker magic and slightly better offensive output.

Level 32-39 is more of the same, but you get Dispel to add to your repertoire (and is the first spell that really starts setting you apart from the competition).

RDM takes a complete about face at level 40-41 with Convert and Refresh landing like atomic bombs. Your available MP literally doubles between those two levels, making normally MP-intensive spells become much more viable for use, and they end up defining much of your role in parties from that point on.


Icemage

[Sabaron]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

With respect to food, I've found the most valuable foods for the red mage are not pies. Having a bigger mana pool is useless if it's not totally full. It's nice for us to have a big mana pool when we get Convert at 40, but otherwise, you'll find your pool less than full 90% of the time. What you eat depends largely on what you are doing.

For parties, I use the following:

Big Monster Battle or special mission: Mushroom Stew or Brain Stew

Meleeing in XP Party or Soloing: Rice Dumpling

Primary Enfeeble (No Ninjutsu): Roast Mushroom

Light Enfeeble (Ninja Enfeebling) and All-around Good RDM Food: Sweet Rice Cake

Primary Nuke (No BLM): Melon Pie +1


The two stews at the top are awesome Red Mage foods, but on Asura, they cost 30k apiece. They last 3 hours, so it's 5000 per 1/2 hour or generally slightly more expensive than sushi, but as a 3 hour food if you die or your party breaks early, you can potentially waste a large volume of it. For XP parties, I tend to shy away from 3-hour food for this reason. I have used both of these stews and they are very nice. The Mushroom Stew's -Enmity will give you a lot of legroom for curing and nuking and the double punch bonus on the Brain Stew is as good as a Solid Wand and you can use it at any level and the +3 MPh, while not as good as a cookie is a welcome addition. You will be hard pressed to find this stuff, though, as it contains a King Truffle, and is therefore not as common as the other foods on the list. In general, I recommend you always carry a stack of Sweet Rice Cakes around with you--they're good (not great) for all cases. I did include a pie, but note that it is not an ordinary pie, but specifically Melon Pie +1. You use this pie for the +INT and the +MPh, not necessarily the +Mana, although it is quite nice to have a bigger pool as a nuker. I, personally, carry 3 (usually partially eaten) stacks of food: Roast Mushrooms, Sweet Rice Cakes, and Rice Dumplings. I usually have a bowl of Mushroom stew congealing in my Mog House Fridge as well... Though I've said it many times, any mage who doesn't have Refresh or some permutation thereof should drink Juice if they can afford it. If you don't need any of these

Juice + cookies = Happy XP PT

I don't often eat cookies (Wizard or Ginger) as a Red Mage because I find that IT Mobs are quite resistant to enfeebles (especially certain types as you will find). Therefore, boosting stats and skills (and keeping Enfeebling Capped) is extremely important for the Red Mage. Keeping Elemental at or near cap and Healing at or near cap is also good. Healing can be supplemented with your high MND, so there isn't much need to worry about it unless you're playing a low-MND race.

[Aeni]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

I won't reiterate what others have already said (Since they more or less covered everything about the job that you can tell a beginner)

The reason why your enfeebling didn't stick was, as someone put it, it's way behind. And how?

You can only skill up in anything in this game by fighting monsters that are (at minimum, although also optimally)evenly matched to you (Or to your skill level)

Use this handy chart to determine where you will cap at the levels you're looking at.

http://www.ausystem.org/~aushacho/gbox/ff/skill-e.html

So, generally, if you soloed to 16, more than likely you're behind about 3-4 levels in enfeebling. Since you generally don't want to "spam" enfeebling while you're soloing, due to need for mp conservation for healing and nuking and the fact you have so little of mana at that level, your chances to gain a skill is being further reduced.

When grouping up, you generally fight monsters that are roughly 3-10 levels above you (Depending on the strength of group, the level you're at and the number of people in that group) This means that if you're fighting, for example, a monster 4 levels above your level, you're in fact trying to stick an enfeebling spell that would be equivalent to you trying to land it on a monster 7 levels above you if you're capped. This is further exaggerated if you're fighting monsters even higher level (THD ~ 4-5 levels higher, VT ~ 5-7 levels higher, IT ~ 6-8+ levels higher)

This is why I recommend mages and melee players to start grouping as early as level 10, to get the best possible chances of keeping skill capped at the appropriate levels and thereby reducing the amount of frustrations down the road when your healing/enfeebling/accuracy/potentcy of spells and melee are just not up to par.

[Vaigrant]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

I really dont have much to add, but its 2am, Im insomniatic and bored so Im gonna post anyways =P. But Rdm Before 32(I say 32 instead of 41 because of Dispel, which I say is the BEST part of being a Rdm to me) its really looked at highly.

At that lvl rather than seeing it as it can do a mish mash of everything, people(Or at least in my low level experiance) see it as something that cant do it as well as others.

Enfeebling is the top priority for Rdm IMHO, I had suffered from gimp stats too, due to a large regiment of Soloing, but once your Enfeebles start to stick onto the Mobs(Who Doesnt love Paralyze for one) you'll notice that you arent useless at all.

Now breaking topic for a second cause I like to do so on occasion, I cant remember but I know origionally Dia and Bio cancelled eachother out but I heard a patch made it both can be active at once. . . was just wondering if that was actually true.

[Murphie]

Re: Lvl 16 RDM and I feel so...useless! Please advice...

It's not true. Bio still overwrites Dia. And Dia 2 overwrites Bio, and Bio 2 overwrites all of it.