The New Red Mage Spells

[arkaine23]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

Phalanx II
(1 merit) 14-15 damage reduction, duration 2 minutes
(2 merits) 17-18 damage reduction, duration 2.5 minutes
(3 meris) 20-21 damage reduction, duration 3 minutes

It does vary slightly with Enhancing Magic, but is most certainly not based on the same forumla as Phalanx I. The test I saw was vs cactuars 1000 needles. The low-end number was derived from a 256 enhancing skill and the high number from a 296 enhancing magic skill. We can get 300 enhancing with gear, so I wouldn't rule out the possibility of be able to pump one more point of damage redcution into it..... >.>


Also saw a slow/slow II ballista test on Utsusemi: Ni recast time. This was 1 merit into Slow II.

15% slow vs 22% slow II without pumping MND for the cast.
27% slow vs 33% slow II adding +48 MND to the cast.

[WishMaster3K]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

Wow, So unless you plan on taking it to at least lvl 3, it doesn't seem to be worth it overall.

So I can check off Blind II and Phalanx II from my list and add those to Slow and Paralyze....

Double Post Edited:
Just saw your edit, and WOW, lol. That's nice to know, thanks.

[Raydeus]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

I hate getting gifts in a really nice box only to find out there was just a cheap cookie inside...


Edit> And did I mention I gotta pay for the cookie like it was a really expensive meal?

[WishMaster3K]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

I'm gonna merit Paralyze II, Dia II, and Slow II.

Phalanx II is worthless to me Solo.
21 Damage sounds nice, but overall won't help PLDs in HNM.
When NINs get hit, 21 damage in HNM won't help, unless you're Rukenshin and you only take 20 damage from Fafnir in the first place.
In exp, mob won't live long enough for it to matter.

Blind II I would have went for, but Ninjas actively cast this. And the jury is still out on it's effectiveness. But if by comparing it to other Enfeebles is a sign, it looks like a decent and marginal improvement.

Bio III, I realized that RDM Dark skill sucks.
I also realized that I can now overwrite BLMs that get Bio II happy, lol

That's my decision. Merits go 3 4 5, so it looks like I'm 210,000 points away.

[Apple Pie]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

I heard that Slow II was able to overwrite Haste (Haste is immune to Slow I as we know) but has anyone already tested it?

Because tier II enfeebles have much higher MP cost, I think it is almost impossible for us to cast all of them every single battle at merit PTs. Therefore, I will upgrade Dia III to LV2 first and spned another merits on Slow II LV2 then. Most of my friends told me that Slow was more reliable than Paralyze.

It must be fun to give all melees Phalanx II at uncapped ballista but I don't want to be a "Phalanx Whore."

[Icemage]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

Phalanx II is worthless to me Solo.

Agreed. Regular Phalanx has a stronger effect than Phalanx II for the caster.

21 Damage sounds nice, but overall won't help PLDs in HNM.

When NINs get hit, 21 damage in HNM won't help, unless you're Rukenshin and you only take 20 damage from Fafnir in the first place.

I don't think I agree with this. PLDs don't take that much damage per hit from most HNMs - and remember, it IS per hit. 21 damage per hit can mean the difference between a back to back WS/triple attack downing a paladin or him surviving long enough for the incoming Cure V to save him.

Fafnir doesn't really hit good tanks that hard until/unless you're foolish enough to let him go into Rage mode. I haven't seen a tank go down in my Fafnir/Nidhogg fights in a very long time.

Also, less damage taken = more enmity conserved. This is VERY important in HNM activities.

In exp, mob won't live long enough for it to matter.

This, however, is quite true.

Blind II I would have went for, but Ninjas actively cast this. And the jury is still out on it's effectiveness. But if by comparing it to other Enfeebles is a sign, it looks like a decent and marginal improvement.

I agree with Blind II being mostly a waste in HNM. Only time I could see it being very useful is when you are duo with a THF/NIN, who can't cast Kurayami: Ni but would benefit from it.

Bio III, I realized that RDM Dark skill sucks.
I also realized that I can now overwrite BLMs that get Bio II happy, lol

I don't agree with this. The point of casting Bio III is to severely lower an enemy's Attack. I haven't seen anyone who's merited this yet, and I'm puzzled about why, since it very much cripples players when cast on us. I can see this spell being very powerful in Dynamis against Monk-type enemies when they activate Hundred Fists. As far as Dark Skill... the damage isn't really an issue, it's the status down effect that you really want.

---

Whenever I get around to hitting RDM75 (too busy to play much lately, stuck at 74), I think I'll be picking up Phalanx II, Slow II, Paralyze II, Dia III, and Bio III. I think all are useful in various situations. Blind II is meh unless you solo a lot I think.


Icemage

[WishMaster3K]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

You raise good points about Phalanx on HNMs and Bio.

Unfortunately, I DO feel the same way, but as all RDMs are experiencing, we have to weigh in with our personal opinions and tastes. Because of work, I haven't been to HL events lately, and as soon as summer ends, school starts, and etc etc. So I won't see much usage out of Phalanx II.

And I HATE when Bio III get's cast on me. I'll reserve at least one merit for it, because it would be interesting to have a DEF/VIT build, sub WAR and totally pwn my MNK friend simply by going AFK.

I guess getting 4 and lvl 2ing Slow and Paralyze would work. Dia III and Bio III are as situational as their younger siblings, so I'll save those merits till last.

But ty IM, you raised good points.

Oh, and I know there is some RDM in my LS that already whored themselves out and is getting Phalanx II fully merited.

[Jaxom]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

I've read everything I can find on these spells on here, and on other forums, and I think I agree with several of you when I say Blind II is definately off the list.

Even solo I don't see it helping that much as our evasion isn't so hot anyway. Phalanx II, well it's pretty good with full merits, and that combined with a PLD shield block (which is rumored to be much more common now) would be quite a damage reduction. However, spending 3 of the 6 points we are allowed here on that one spell to make it useful is too much. Also, although I have little experience with endgame, I've been told that the trend for PLD is to start going /nin as opposed to /war, which makes Phalanx II that much less useful. Could be wrong about that /nin part, only what I've heard recently.

I think I'm with Wish and will go with 2 levels each in Paralyze II and Slow II, and 1 each in Dia III and Bio III. I may drop one of those off though and level 2 the one I keep, depending on how testing goes. From what I've seen, with a good setup 750 DoT (counting initial dmg) for Bio III (that's with full merits though, so 1:30 duration) and a 20% reduction in atk is might nice. Haven't seen enough testing on Dia III yet, so the jury is still out on that one.

On another note, I'm extremely happy about the change to both Raise and to the damage output of daggers and Evisceration.

[BurningPanther]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

Haha, we get the spells what we were looking for, but not enough merits to use them all?
I was about to praise S-E, but I think I take that back.

[tdh]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

I see Icemages point with Bio III, but does it out weight Paralyze , Slow, and Phalanx II Merits? With Lv.1 Paralyze II & Slow II Vs. those Wyverns they changed the name of outside of Mamool Ja Staging point, I was noticing a HUGE difference. At one point I know I saved the WAR/NIN quasi-tanking several Shadows with 2 or 3 straight Paralyzes, and Slow II really shining.

So, pointing that out, I'm not doing any End-Game activities outside of Meriting my little Elvaan arse off. (Can't find a LS that's doing things I can even attend due to my work schedule.) So I have absolutely no experience with the new toys Vs. anything outside of T~IT EXP mobs.

Right now I have 2 MP and I just got that second one last night before I logged off. So after tonight I'll have 3~5 MP if I can get a decent party in time. So what do I get next? Phalanx II seems to be a good idea, but is that going to be worth it in TP Burns? I would think that Bio III would be useful for TP Burns, but wouldn't Dia III be just as useful? So I'm torn on what to "buy" next.

On a side note, has anybody gone and done Excavation Assault with Bio III yet? I bet that drops those wells a little faster.

[Hamlet]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

I used paralyzeII at the beginning of the party tonight, and it seemed to do good, but it drained the hell out of my mp. You're going to have to be pretty well-off mp-wise to make use of any of these in xping type situations.

If the difference was large, it might be worth it. But once I switched to para1, it seemed to almost proc as much, and definately seemed to last longer than tier 1 paraII. Fully meritted this spell could work in xp, but for now I'm sticking with paraI.

I'm kind of regretting paraII at this point. I was hoping for something that would be useful for pts and solo, and the mp drain is too harsh for me to use in pts currently and solo reports have shown it procing LESS than ice spikes.

MEH!

So, at this point I'm thinking Slow2 fully meritted and probably bio3 full.

[Icemage]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

I like Slow II, but Ninjas have Hojo: Ni that they like to cast, and I don't think it produces as much enmity if it fails to take effect due to failing to overwrite an existing effect. As such, using Slow II might actually hurt you unless you coordinate very closely with any NIN tanks against HNM.

The way I see it, Paralyze II is at least a clear cut choice since no one else has an equivalent effect (ditto for Phalanx II, Dia III, and Bio III).


Icemage

[WishMaster3K]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

Bio III makes us dangerous in Bal- Ok, we already were.

We were already annoying in Ballista. We were more like.... Giant Walls.

Subbing WAR made us the Armored Cars.

Subbing WAR and having Bio III will make us the Armored Cars with Nukes.

I can't wait....

[Aeni]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

On Bio's effectivness...

Dark skill doesn't mean shit on Bio. I'm sorry, but playing both DRK main and RDM main partied together (Dual boxing ftw) I've gotten a ton of opportunities to fool around with Bio II.

Akemie casts Bio II. 64 damage.
Aliza casts Bio II. 50 damage.

These are hard caps and I've never gotten more than this ever on both of these characters. Aliza is a 72 DRK with capped dark magic. Akemie is 64 RDM and dark magic flagging behind at 160sh.

Also, Akemie's Bio II seems to curb out the damage taken quite a bit versus Aliza's Bio II casting. Easiest to test this was on Robber Crabs in Kuftal (I fought over 300 of these babies 2-boxing for my trial on Great Sword) I was averaging around 5-7 less damage taken per hit with Akemie's casting but not so with Aliza's casting.

In other words, Bio III ought to be merited if you're in end game. PERIOD. No questions should be asked. DO IT. Not doing so is gimping your LS so hard you're asking to get kicked out of it.

[rheya]

Re: The New Red Mage Spells

On Bio's effectivness...

Dark skill doesn't mean shit on Bio.

Incorrect.

Dark magic skill, as you pointed out, will not effect the initial damage Bio I or II (and I'm assuming III) does. However, there are tiers of dark magic skill that will change the DoT (as reported on Alla and KI):

Bio II:
200-210 dark skill > 5dmg/tic
211-268 dark skill > 6dmg/tic
269-290 dark skill > 7dmg/tic
291-??? dark skill > 8dmg/tic

These can be tested in PvP.

Since RDMs can never break the 269 tier, even a naked 75 BLM (269 skill) can break this tier. Thus a 75 BLMs Bio II will always outdamage a RDM's. As far as I know, the tiers have not been discovered for Bio III.

So running around and screaming that RDMs who don't merit Bio III should be tossed from their LS is shortsighted, premature, and flat out ridiculous. The best part about our new meritable spells is that they all look great at their full (lvl 3) potential, allowing us to finally customize and specialize. Don't force people into a mold with these spells already, if ever.