Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

[Mila]

-_- ok I'm REALLY lost on this magic accuracy thing... I've heard so many different opinions and honestly I don't know what to think anymore.

I'm pretty certian that skill effects accuracy, but by how much?

I ended up buying a chasuble to test things out; trying to decide of m.acc +5 is better or worse than enf. magic +15... So far it's been really hard to tell. Been using primarily my chasuble for enfeebs and resist rates don't seem any different. In the event I get several resists in a row, I switch to the tabard and every single time I've done this, I'm still resisted while I'm wearing the tabard, so I have no clue which is better.

There has got to be some tests already done on this... can anyone help me figure this thing out? ;;

[Rones]

Re: Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

Large resists discussion in blm forums here. Specific numbers are very hard to come by. Back when Applepie was active here, he could give you lots of parser results, but that source is gone. Your best bet is get a good parser and try 30 mins of exping with each setup. Sometimes the difference is so small you don't need to worry about it.

[Icemage]

Re: Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

I've not seen any comprehensive tests on this, mostly because as we all know, enfeebling magic is incredibly fickle. Sometimes you land 10 spells in a row on IT, sometimes you fail 5 in a row against a Tough. Still, I can tell you the following anecdotal information:

- On my WHM75, after switching to Gramary Cape (MAcc+1), I notice a marked improvement in my stick rate for Slow and Paralyze against enemies above my level.

- On my RDM54, that same cape seems to provide a better result on stick/duration than Red Cape +1's +3 INT/MND.

- +4 Merit Levels (+8 skill) of Enfeebling Magic have drastically decreased the number of resists I get against even IT++ enemies.

With respect to the direct correlation between Magic Accuracy vs. skill, I couldn't even hazard a guess as to how much of one value would be roughly equivalent to the other, though I will say that MAcc+ definitely applies to nuke damage as well. When you're Magic Bursting, the Chausuble will serve you better than the Tabard will for sure. For Enfeebling Magic, no one I've spoken to can tell much if any difference between the two, since regular XP enemies don't resist you much, if at all, at level 75, and HNMs resist you pretty much any time they feel like it on spells where there's any doubt.


Icemage

[Balodoth]

Re: Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

I think Icemage has the key there. Enfeeble is good for Enfeeble, MAcc is good for everything.

[sdillon]

Re: Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

/seconds what icey said

another thing to keep in mind: what are you fighting and what level are they compared to you. Some things are less or more resistant to certain types of enfeeble than others.

On rdm (mentioning this since you posted on RDM forum), I've never had any problems sticking enfeebles, with 'so-so' gear (definition: so-so to me means just easy to get gear that any RDM can have, nothing particularly 'ubar'). I never miss on anything regular IT and below. Anything that's IT++ etc. of course I'll miss.

I personally think that enfeebling gear helps whm a lot more, even though we have a semi-ok enfeebling skill. At 74 whm, with maxed enfeeble... and pretty ok gear, I still miss when I try to debuff things like stupid kuftal tigers - -;; so depressing nyoo ; ;

I prefer going magic acc and magic attk+ if possible for rdm. And mostly magic attk+ for my blm.

[TheGrandMom]

Re: Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

I personally think that enfeebling gear helps whm a lot more, even though we have a semi-ok enfeebling skill. At 74 whm, with maxed enfeeble... and pretty ok gear, I still miss when I try to debuff things like stupid kuftal tigers - -;; so depressing nyoo ; ;

On my 75 whm when we fight in Kuftal, I can enfeeble nearly every time including Ladons. I swap in a Spider Torque and my enfeebling is maxed also. It really improved after I started using the Spider Torque but I would love to get my hands on that new cape.

[Jonnyram]

Re: Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

I would say that RDM natural enfeebling skill is good enough for nearly every situation and go with the magic acc. if I had to make the choice. Accuracy is a much rarer stat on items, which suggests that it's much more useful.

[Icemage]

Re: Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

On my 75 whm when we fight in Kuftal, I can enfeeble nearly every time including Ladons. I swap in a Spider Torque and my enfeebling is maxed also. It really improved after I started using the Spider Torque but I would love to get my hands on that new cape.

Mmm... I dunno, TheGrandMom. I was in a Kuftal party at level 75 for about 1.5 hours a few weeks ago, NIN RNG RNG BRD WHM BLM run-and-gun setup. I had at the time:

Maxed Enfeebling: 225
Enfeebling Torque: +7
Master Caster's Bracelets: +0 (wrong conquest conditions :/ would have been +7 otherwise)
Healer's Briault(swapped in for enfeebles only): +10
Elite Beret: +4
2 levels of Enfeebling Magic merits: +4

Total Enfeebling: 250

Slow was sticking ok with Earth Staff, probably 70% or so. Paralyze was very unreliable with Ice Staff, probably 50% or so stick rate.

Really want WHM AF2 gloves, maxed enfeebling merits and that crazy new mantle with +7 Enfeebling which would put me at 280 Enfeebling Magic on WHM.


Icemage

[TheGrandMom]

Re: Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

Mmm... I dunno, TheGrandMom. I was in a Kuftal party at level 75 for about 1.5 hours a few weeks ago, NIN RNG RNG BRD WHM BLM run-and-gun setup. I had at the time:

Maxed Enfeebling: 225
Enfeebling Torque: +7
Master Caster's Bracelets: +0 (wrong conquest conditions :/ would have been +7 otherwise)
Healer's Briault(swapped in for enfeebles only): +10
Elite Beret: +4
2 levels of Enfeebling Magic merits: +4

Total Enfeebling: 250

Slow was sticking ok with Earth Staff, probably 70% or so. Paralyze was very unreliable with Ice Staff, probably 50% or so stick rate.

Really want WHM AF2 gloves, maxed enfeebling merits and that crazy new mantle with +7 Enfeebling which would put me at 280 Enfeebling Magic on WHM.


Icemage

Well I don't know what to tell you. I was just there yesterday and did fine. We had a whm (me), blm, nin, thf, sam, and rng. Nearly every single mob I hit with para and slow it stuck, including Ladons. None of my gear is anything to write home about either but I do use all the elemental staves. I pop in an Ice staff and Spider Torque for Para and Earth staff and Spider Torque for Slow. My enfeebling is capped from my rdm so thats not an issue either. I don't even use my af body to swap in for enfeebles and have not used any of my merits in enfeebling. (Yes yes fc I'll use my merits one day!! ^^)

[sdillon]

Re: Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

GrandMom and Icey, was type of debuffs was the blm using if any?

I know that having a blm around (usually when I exp whm I rarely have blms, all meelee party at that level mostly) helps a bit more with enfeebling for my whm when they cast mage debuffs like shock etc. Not sure if this could have effected the outcome for u guys or not.

I'm gonna try swapping in elemental staves for enfeebling on whm, havent really bothered due to inventory issues when exping whm ^^

[TheGrandMom]

Re: Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

Hmm...I know the blm was doing Burn but I don't know if he was doing anything else. Sorry ; ;

[WishMaster3K]

Re: Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

Next time my WHM wants to do Dia, I wont yell at her, but instead tell her that her Enfeebling helps out my MP. Um, am I mistaken in seeing you say that at 75, your enfeebling capped at 225???? And 250 with gear probably just hurts. . .

I think Accuracy is in the instances where you can land enfeebles ok, and you just want the duration longer. Similar to how nukes can be resisted at different percentages, I think that Magic Accuracy would help us get "100%" Paralyze more of the time- assuming that they can land in the first place. Similar to how we avidly discussed the usage of Wans post-50.

I cant wait to experiement with different gear to actually see and feel the difference, so I am trying my best to level ^^

[Vinen]

Re: Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

I would say that RDM natural enfeebling skill is good enough for nearly every situation and go with the magic acc. if I had to make the choice. Accuracy is a much rarer stat on items, which suggests that it's much more useful.

I'd personally say it just pays homage to the fact that Magic Acc. was only added 2 or 3 version updates ago. I don't think this suggests that its more useful.

[Icemage]

Re: Magic accuracy... (T_T come save us applepie)

Re: Aquelia

BLM in my PT didn't have time to do anything but cast maybe 1 nuke per fight and maybe catch a tick of rest. We were speedchaining (best effort : XP chain #23) so there really wasn't a whole lot of time to do more than fling one Paralyze and maybe a Slow at each monster before it was dead and we moved on to the next.

Re: Wishmaster

Yep. WHM enfeebling base skillcap is 225 at level 75 (C-). I've got 4 levels of Enfeebling Magic merits now, which puts me at 233 (sadly, my RDM55 is swiftly catching up to my WHM in effectiveness...).


Icemage