What is a good sub for rdm?

[Magus401]

I'm RDM/DRK all the way (b'-')b

Soo, shut up and deal with it ^_^;;;;;


But, really. It isn't that bad. I get Drain and Aspir and Tractor! (I know BLM get all that but...I'm too lazy to level BLM...I don't like it that much ^_^;;; ) Well, I plan on goin RDM/DRK all the way....I don't care what you think! YOU CAN'T STOP ME!!

[Jinxie]

On subbing RDM with DRK:

You can point/counterpoint all day long over if it is good or not, but it really boils down to the basic mechanics of the game. If you have a DRK at level 60 then his fully levelled RDM sub is level 30. This means that you are a DRK60 and a RDM30. Your enhancing magic will be capped as a Level 30 RDM. Therefore, if you are level 60 and are using level 30 enspells, then it would be like a level 30 RDM trying to take on a level 60 mob. Which would make the Mob IT+^30. This isn't something that can be altered. It's a harsh reality of FFXI. You could get equipment to enhance your enspells, but you're still only enhancing level 30 spells.

This game isn't as Cookie Cutter as a lot of people seem to think. Some subs are just more viable than others in certain situations. If I'm farming alone I use THF. If I'm NM hunting alone, I use THF or DRK or even WAR if there's alot of campers. If I'm farming or hunting with my LS, I use whatever would be the most beneficial to the corresponding subs in the party. Possible subs for those situations could be THF, WAR, DRK, RNG, or whatever

[Apple Pie]

I don't think RDM/DRK is that bad around 20s to 30s although you may want to consider RDM/BLM above LV40 when you get MP Conserve from /BLM20.

Before you get Refresh, you have plenty of free time. I guess you're soon entering Crawler's Nest, Garlaige Citadel and other places but most creatures you meet there don't have nasty AoEs.

Keep your weapons up-to-date, bring as many accuracy/attack+ gears as possible (It's good time to learn gear swapping), and have juices with you (if you're able to create one while resting, that's perfect). As long as you're playing basic RDM's roles perfectly, noone can order you to stop melee. However, remember to rest after the battle because we're basically mages.

[Vinen]

However, remember to rest after the battle because we're basically mages.

Yup this is the biggest problem I see with people who think that they can sub RDM/Melee. They seem to belive that their TP is more important then their MP. I do remember what a RDM/WAR told my group once when we told him to rest to get back MP. I have 30%TP I need to save it for the next fight!

[Jinxie]

Originally posted by Vinen
Yup this is the biggest problem I see with people who think that they can sub RDM/Melee. They seem to belive that their TP is more important then their MP. I do remember what a RDM/WAR told my group once when we told him to rest to get back MP. I have 30%TP I need to save it for the next fight!

I haven't XP partied with RDM/DRK since about lvl 35. The only reason I haven't is that I stopped getting invites. If I could handle waiting hours for a party, I would still sub DRK for XP. It is one of the most enjoyable combinations I have played. With RDM/BLM though, I have to go /ANON if I want to get anything done other than leveling. As far as TP goes, I use this as a basis for when I rest or when I conserver TP:


1. If I have 60%TP at the end of the battle (which I usually do sometimes less, sometimes more)and my MP is good to go for the next set of refreshes and there is still enough MP to enfeeble and Maintain refresh, then I don't rest

2. If I have less that 60%TP I rest. Even after resting, I still have about 30-40%TP because you're not gonna rest for more than a couple of ticks if your party is pulling mobs like they should be.

3. The absolute most important thing to remember as RDM is that YOUR MP is what drives a good XP party.(don't comment BRDs because this is a RDM Forum) If you are putting TP above MP on your list, then you are wrong and will always suck at being a RDM no matter what your sub is.

[Icemage]

Originally posted by Macht
Still seems lacking, you are trying to provide a BST/RDM as being proof enough for a DRK/RDM combination? Where is the control in this kind of setting? Just because they both have /RDM they should be equal in their magic abilities with it?

Yes, that is precisely what I am saying.

BST native Enhancing Magic: 0
DRK native Enhancing Magic: 0
BST70/RDM35 Enhancing Magic = RDM35 level, 108
DRK70/RDM35 Enhancing Magic = RDM35 level, 108

Originally posted by Macht
Now just like you pointed out you have to use a set of equipment to get your WHM to use enfeeble well stating that the DRK/RDM is going to be equal your, WHM, ability with it. So what happened to WHM being able to cast better then?

Since you are using gear to give that boost what's to stop a DRK from making swapping gear to do the same? Again all just circumstancial with what I feel is lacking evidence of it.

Um. Duh? As a WHM, I can switch to that equipment at any time when needed using an equipment macro. I don't think your theoretical DRK/RDM is going to give up his 90% TP to switch to a staff or wand just so he can cast Paralyze, mkay? Not to mention as a WHM70 I have way, WAY more natural MND + more boosts from my gear than a DRK has.

Originally posted by Macht
That is just my point though, I start demanding actual proof and now you try to belittle me. That's why combinations are never seen in the possibilities they could provide. Of course if I were to state this on the DRK board they'd shun it as well without actually gathering physical data to prove it.

If you never did actual true testing with it and can't provide me that data then I'd hold back on your criticism till you have that data. Here is a prime example of a theory and a sort of joke:

How about you actually play the game and realize how clueless your stated opinion really is before you start "demanding proof"?

I'll say it again, just for your edification:

Past level 60, RDM Enfeebling >> WHM Enfeebling >> DRK Enfeebling

Originally posted by Macht
That is a totally legit theory, now you are going to try and discredit it and say "Duh, you idiot it couldn't jump because it didn't have it's legs!", problem with that is that the crickets ears are on it's legs so you didn't prove him right or wrong. You just made yourself look more stubborn and fearful of changes.

I play WHM/BRD quite successfully, thank you, so I think I know a little bit about unconventional subjobs that work. DRK/RDM isn't one of them.


Icemage

[Apple Pie]

They seem to belive that their TP is more important then their MP. I do remember what a RDM/WAR told my group once when we told him to rest to get back MP. I have 30%TP I need to save it for the next fight!

lol Exactly the same thing happened to me yesterday.

I, BLM34/WHM17, was invited by JP mithra RDM35/WHM17 and we went to Garlaige Citadel. Rest of our PT members were PLD/WAR, WAR/THF, THF/NIN, and WHM/BLM.

I was first shocked to see her low MP. She only had 256MP although Hume WHM had 400+ MP (I had 470+). Then, while we were talking about SC, she told us she wanted to join in SC. We simply ignored her

After we started leveling, she hardly rested. She never healed others. After she casted Slow and Paralyze, she concentrated on melee. She never recasted them after they went off. What made me angry was she didn't dispel beatle's buff at all. I asked her to dispel it twice but she ignored me.

We had linked bats several times (not puller's fault though) and we, except for this RDM, once used our 2H because both WHM and I had a little MP left. However, this lazy cat kept meleeing. It was lucky that noone was killed but after this incident, WHM got mad and told her stop meleeing and rest.

I drunk 52 bottles of pineapple juices and WHM also had auto-pineapple-juice trait like me but she had nothing to drink. You know, it's just waste of time waiting for RDM storing 100% TP to start SC. She and PLD sometimes did Burning Blade >>> Flat Blade [Fusion] but I didn't have any extra MP to cast Fire / Firaga because she never did back-up heal. So, there's no need for another SC...

One of the worst PTs I have ever had. She finally casted dispel after she'd come to know I was RDM66 and WHM was also RDM71 but only once in 2.8 hours! ヽ(｀д´)ノ

[Discordian]

The bonuses stated for drk/rdm are situational making it a fine combo for some skygod fights when additional MP is needed for Stun and being able to cure themselves after aoe damage. Also you can solo with this but its situational.

For party this doesn't work well and I invite you to enfeeble a IT++ enemy in the distant future of 50 and you'll see where just 10 points of enfeeble skill can do (more like 20 but who's counting?). Later on rdm gets the level 58 warlocks tabard which is essentially the last body piece a rdm in a serious xp party will ever use because enfeeble+15 is required to land spells just like a Lifebelt and Snipers are highly desired for Dark Knight and samurai. You can argue about having a large macro to switch gears but when you are swaping to a wand to do enfeebling watch your TP go from 75% to 0% so you are no longer a Dark Knight doing weaponskills because thats your job, to kill things.

End result it kinda works but it doesn't work for the other 5 people in your party. War and Thief subjobs are tried and proven and work very well at killing the enemy. There's only so many party friendly combinations that make sense and trust me that later on when you are looking at 40,000 tnl you will want to get as much xp as fast as you can because otherwise you are just wasting time.

Its not that we're telling you this combo won't work we're telling you that it won't work WELL, there's a difference. You can make a party of 6 rdms with a couple rdms as a tank.
Does it work? Yes.
Does it work well? No.

Its like having the summoner involved in the skillchain. Analyze the reasonable pros and cons of of the combination and what major gains and tradeoffs you have to make. Thief and war subjobs are packed with increadible bonuses to help you exterminate the enemy asap because they assist the skill ranks that help you do your job best which is Great Sword and Scythe Skill.

[Magus401]

Heh yeah I use dagger and stuff ....

And i really don't care about TP...i mean..yeah..WSs are fun to throw in every now in then, but i don't conserve it ..I rest just like normal..and if i get 100% tp i use it ^_^