Quit your B****ing and read this!

[JP_Ikari]

Re: In response to Jp Ikari

Im responding to this with just a few remarks then ill end it here.

1. I am not a Ranger im a level 75 Ninja

2.Ninja were never suppose to be pullers."Where do people get that idea"They were suppose to be backup tanks that turned into main tanks...

3.I just leveled in a few parties with rangers and I was shocked with there performance.The ranger couldnt even pull hate for TA not once!! He missed alot of WS's and he was trying hard to stay in his little spot.

The skillchain was Heavy Shot > Spininng Slash

4.Rangers job decription is to deal massive amounts of damage using ranged attacks.

Dont give me silly lines like "The True Rangers Will Excell" Makes me laugh everytime I hear something like that.There will always be people willing to play a job regardless on how bad it gets nerfed.Then there are those who dont like to take it up there $$$ and continue playing like nothing happened.It just all comes down to how bad the nerf really is.

The Rangers I partied with were all great players with top of the line equipment.

I feel bad for all rangers... Good Rangers - Bad Rangers - Blind Rangers
Im sure the nerf doesnt seem that bad in low or mid levels thats a given.Try using one in a high level exp party. "I wont even get into Hnms but I would say why do you pay to play again?"

The Darkknight had to sata on to himself cause the mob wouldnt turn for the ranger we did this for 5k exp and the Drk almost died 8 times..

Ranger costs alot of gill to maintain and level.I would be skeptical for new Rangers to go down this path until things are sorted out considering the maintance costs and Endgame participation issues.

/sigh

I like to add one last thing for Ikari. We are talking about the Ranger Nerf not the TP Nerf. Almost all rangers would agree that a nerf would be ok but what they got was extreme...

I know that complaining about a nerf isnt gonna make it go away but there is no reason to ridicule and shame those who complain about a job downgrade considering the costs.

As for the original poster nice link.

But patches/updates/nerfs will always be there. That's the problem. Further more, this game is a revolving game. Sooner or later, they'll find something that they (the developers) find flawed and will get changed. Regardless if Mobs getting overpowered, classes being down-graded, duration of spells getting limited to even under-powering certain JA's. While unfair, all I wanted to tell everyone is, we're gonna have to live through it. Like it or not, it's here. I love RNG's, damn I thought they're the coolest class besides NIN and SAM. So I'm not here to hate on them. Shit, more or less, I feel bad about it, but even I think Ice said it in his previous post, if you think this change wasn't on the horizon, then you're living under a rock.

The class/character doesn't make the player better. It is the player, that makes the class/character better. It's you. And always will be you.

"The True Rangers Will Excell"

No matter what, that will be the case.

JP

[poweryoga]

Re: Flame Free. Just facts

See, this is the stupid crap that gets people into trouble. Misinformation = you lose.

All of you that claim the TP nerf was nothing?
Consider this:
Dragoon uses a five-fold attack, it deals awesome damage, and if I remember right, it used to open distortion. now the thf can close, and the 'goon has 60+ tp. he can /sam and med up and penta again, or he can be /war and just swing his spear a few more times.

This affected every single class, mainly caused by monks with relic knuckles spamming asuran fists nonstop. Don't tell me penta thrust was intended to be spammed by dragoons till the fight was over, because thats what all drgs wanted to do: spam penta. Guess what? Double thrust opens up distortion too, and it doesn't do bad damage. Rangers weren't affected because everything is 1 hit. Pre tp nerf i partied with too many samurais that wanted to spam penta thrust and didn't want to SC at all, and I'm personally glad they nerfed it those idiots stopped.

Now let's look at RNG:
sidewinder for about 5x damage. Each shot gives more tp than any melee weapon, and you can now barrage for more damage than other DD's WS. You'll get hate, but you have shadows to hide behind which no drk or drg could ever get away with. Oh, did I mention your Sidewinder/Slug Shot opens Distortion? And that the Barrage gave you AT LEAST as much tp as a drg/sam will get from med?

Sidewinder does 5x damage, but its a WS that Square designed with terrible accuracy to offset the damage, meaning you need to save up 200% tp or more. Barrage is 5-7 shots, which can miss. Some people sub war (like myself pre 74), so don't make it sound like blinking is the ranger's innate ability.

Who cares if side/slug opens distortion? So does a million other WSes, a lot of which gets used quite often. Also, distortion isn't the best thing to burst on a lot of mobs, so that point is moot. Barrage gives you at LEAST nothing. It can MISS. Barrage scales up, being 5x your normal tp gain at 50, 6x at 60, and 7x at 75. If i recall correctly, meditate gives you 100 tp. Barrage can miss, give you anywhere from 12 -> whatever your barrage amount is at.

people like this guy, posting misinformed crap about rangers being gods when they infact know nothing about how the class is handled, is why people are still flaming rangers on whining about the nerf.

[JP_Ikari]

Re: Flame Free. Just facts

See, this is the stupid crap that gets people into trouble. Misinformation = you lose.



This affected every single class, mainly caused by monks with relic knuckles spamming asuran fists nonstop. Don't tell me penta thrust was intended to be spammed by dragoons till the fight was over, because thats what all drgs wanted to do: spam penta. Guess what? Double thrust opens up distortion too, and it doesn't do bad damage. Rangers weren't affected because everything is 1 hit. Pre tp nerf i partied with too many samurais that wanted to spam penta thrust and didn't want to SC at all, and I'm personally glad they nerfed it those idiots stopped.

Just wondering, what is this relic weapon spamming monks you talk about?? The TP nerf happened even before Dynamis came out. But the thing is, TP nerf happened cause the engine of the game made it possible for Multi hitters to get that much TP back. That's the thing. That's why they changed it, even you said it:

Don't tell me penta thrust was intended to be spammed by dragoons till the fight was over, because thats what all drgs wanted to do: spam penta.

yes, they didn't, same with any multi-hitting skills. That's why it was changed. They changed the RNG's cause they didn't intend the RNG's to be this way. Again, everyone should stop getting mad about this and just play, cause we can't do anythign about it. All we can do is change. Read the interview and how the developers are seeing this patch as.

JP

[Icemage]

Re: Flame Free. Just facts

Just wondering, what is this relic weapon spamming monks you talk about?? The TP nerf happened even before Dynamis came out.

This is incorrect. Relic knuckles were indeed available before the TP nerf, and were one of the primary reasons it was put into place.

Feb 26, 2004: Dynamis-Bastok/Windurst/San d'Oria/Jeuno are introduced

Apr 22, 2004: Multi-hit WS TP gets nerfed.

Otherwise I agree with the rest of your post.


Icemage

[Lmnop]

Re: Flame Free. Just facts

See, this is the stupid crap that gets people into trouble. Misinformation = you lose.



This affected every single class, mainly caused by monks with relic knuckles spamming asuran fists nonstop. Don't tell me penta thrust was intended to be spammed by dragoons till the fight was over, because thats what all drgs wanted to do: spam penta. Guess what? Double thrust opens up distortion too, and it doesn't do bad damage. Rangers weren't affected because everything is 1 hit. Pre tp nerf i partied with too many samurais that wanted to spam penta thrust and didn't want to SC at all, and I'm personally glad they nerfed it those idiots stopped.



Sidewinder does 5x damage, but its a WS that Square designed with terrible accuracy to offset the damage, meaning you need to save up 200% tp or more. Barrage is 5-7 shots, which can miss. Some people sub war (like myself pre 74), so don't make it sound like blinking is the ranger's innate ability.

Who cares if side/slug opens distortion? So does a million other WSes, a lot of which gets used quite often. Also, distortion isn't the best thing to burst on a lot of mobs, so that point is moot. Barrage gives you at LEAST nothing. It can MISS. Barrage scales up, being 5x your normal tp gain at 50, 6x at 60, and 7x at 75. If i recall correctly, meditate gives you 100 tp. Barrage can miss, give you anywhere from 12 -> whatever your barrage amount is at.

people like this guy, posting misinformed crap about rangers being gods when they infact know nothing about how the class is handled, is why people are still flaming rangers on whining about the nerf.

I tried to keep my first post short but it just got me flamed so now I have to elaborate ><
OF COURSE the tp nerf didn't affect RNG. it toned down every melee BUT RNG. is that so hard to understand? when I talk about the tp nerf, I know it didn't affect RNG. that's the point. you can still barrage for more tp than a penta thrust pre-nerf could get. you're right, Barrage can completely miss and it's quite painful. but most Rng I partied with regularly hit with enough of its hits to stiill get rediculous amounts of tp. Not to mention it's WS-like power. So what about opening Distortion? well, consider the only part of my argument that I'm really not sure about. If I'm right that in the beginning, Penta opened disto, then there's a reason they moved it out. Drg and War could spam penta -while- helping the party out so S-E made penta absolutely useless SC-wise. but then /sam made sure it wasn't even worth SCing. Now when you consider Sidewinder, maybe S-E didn't wanna make the same mistake twice. You say "who cares if it opens distortion" but you'd be damn pissed if they put it in the same category as penta. then you'd be back to piercing arrow. all those other great disto openers? yea I know loads of 60+ samurai who love using enpi whenever they can. double thrust and enpi... any more good ones? I guess vorpal scythe ain't bad. nothing in that slot of rampage or raging fists power though.

S-E didn't want to make the sidewinder opener completely useless like they did penta, they just wanted other jobs to be able to -oh, I don't know... Compete? Fact is, yea distortion isn't the only SC, but it's the one people want the most. I think only things I ever exped on that weren't weak to distortion were dhalhmel 1-60. There's nothing moot about that. And you're right, rng can sub war. I like Rng/war as long as there's a trusty pld. But in no way is rng/nin gimp. It enhances your job as those stupid subjob guides all over the internet would love to point out. for drg or drk or sam? it's blinks which prolly won't be used. Why would they want a sub like that? meanwhile your 2 weapon slots are just more potential to up your ranged damage. Same can be said of melee of course, equiping Lightning Bows and Bomb Cores. but I haven't seen a ranged weapon that gives me +20 accuracy recently. I could rant on and on because I'm a windy guy if you haven't noticed, but I don't think I'm misinformed. I have some great Rng friends. don't think I"m biased towards the job as a whole. Oh yea, when subbed, Meditate gives 60% tp. No more. I know none of this changes your mind. You're bent on hating the RNG change. From your other posts I'm pretty sure you've given up on it, in fact. That's fine. just don't go spreading misinformation saying the tp nerf wasn't nearly as bad as this. It may have been an exploit, but it was still their means of doing amazing damage in short periods of time.

[JP_Ikari]

Re: Flame Free. Just facts

This is incorrect. Relic knuckles were indeed available before the TP nerf, and were one of the primary reasons it was put into place.

Feb 26, 2004: Dynamis-Bastok/Windurst/San d'Oria/Jeuno are introduced

Apr 22, 2004: Multi-hit WS TP gets nerfed.

Otherwise I agree with the rest of your post.


Icemage

/bow, oops, sorry hehe ^ ^ b.

JP

[Muu Yi]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

Actually Pentathrust can still open Distortion, you just need 3 melee in your party who can get TP at about the same time. I actually posted this on the Samurai forum, but basically here it is:

Let's say you have Ninja, Thief, and Dragoon in your party. Distortion skillchain after level 60 proceeds like this: Pentathrust > Blade: Chi (Transfixion Skillchain) > Dancing Edge (Distortion Skillchain)

The Ranged Attack Accuracy changes take quite a bit of getting used to, but Ranger are still strong damage dealers although their higher level weaponskills have apparently been toned down. And it is actually a lot easier to solo as Ranger now that you can exp on mobs that used to con as too weak. You can solo all the way to level 75 just fighting worms and really get to learn what is your "sweet spot" all the time, although soloing probably will take a chunk out of your wallet for ammunition. But that also means you can solo as something like Ranger/White Mage and not have to buy the extra ranged accuracy daggers or buy particularly good ranged bonuses armor since the damage taken from worms is magical damage. So it actually kind of evens out in the cost department. I'm treating Ranger much like I treat my Beastmaster now - as a strong soloer / NM farmer who has widescan and helps greatly in farming beastman seals and crystals. ^^ If people still invite you to party with them while you're soloing you can spend the extra money to keep equipment geared towards partying in the mog safe and just let them know you have to a stop back at mog house to change subjobs and equipment. Honestly, soloing to 20 as a Ranger feels like a piece of cake now though.

[Zempten]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

RNG had the potential to solo pre patch up to 33, it just got speed up when we had access to Bloody Bolts. Of course the targets was Mandys in the jungle, might pose quite a problem now with the sweet spot so Worms are good ^^