Quit your B****ing and read this!

[ibroyles]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

you're negative poweryoga. relax.

[Tipsy]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

just ignore that nub lol

[Rodin]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

you make it sound like rangers can still do good damage. They can, in exp parties, and only exp parties.

People sold their high end gear because rangers are the new dragoon for HNMs. You don't want them because

1) unreliable
2) low damage
3) low accuracy

posting a stupid compass doesn't help anything. Any ranger with half a brain has figured out the sweet spot and most of them still agree the job is not worth the cost anymore.

There's hardly any "adapting" to be done when there's simply better choices to be picked.

Survival of the fittest? More like the survival of the least-nerfed class. Believing the classes are balanced and only potential limiter for your effectiveness and damage output is the player's skill is uninformed, ignorant and most of all, stupid.

Poweryoga, think about it this way...Even tho it was nerfed, maybe some people still want to play the class, like some do with Dragoon. It's THOSE people I was trying to help...Honestly, I see the people that level RNG JUST to be the biggest Damage Dealers in the game is kind of noobish. Remember how many Elvaan DRKs there were just after the NA release and people started getting to 30? It's kind of like that in my eyes. Many people wanted to play RNG to be the "OMG..I'm doing more DMG than J00!!" type of shoot first, ask questions later type of person...and frankly, I think that those type of people are the ones that are complaining about the update. If you REALLY wanted to be a RNG, then you'd stick with it through the update, but if you wanted to be the lord of all that is damage, you probably quit and are currently moving on to Samurai or Black Mage, which a lot of people on Ragnarok are doing right now.

[poweryoga]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

Its like this: I leveled ranger to do good damage, and it was fun. Its been a year since I gotten to 75 and all I can do with rng is endgame stuff and merit parties. Now that they're more worthless than dragoons in HNM fights, there's no point in wasting money to do less, and more inconsistant damage than almost everyone else. SE replaced the fun of this job with annoyance, and I don't play this game with intention to annoy myself.

For all those that want to experience rangerhood, go ahead. I'm not about to waste another 500 hours of my life lvling another melee job to 75.

[Kess]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

Its late ill make my reply short.
This game has been out for over 3 years. Rngs were desighned to do devastating
damage for the cost of arrows.They changed the job because of the "true" whiners which are the kids that complained about rangers getting fast invites and doing to much damage.

3 YEARS. Now they ruined the hard work of others...You people who dont understand how this effects the job truly need to be quiet and stop acting like you know what your talking about. Its evident and your just making yourselves look like fools and while your looking like fools your also silencing the rangers voices by overtalking them and creating flame wars. ><

As far as realistic this is an mmorpg sir.... This whole game is unrealistic you ><!
Last i remember you cant cast warp in real life or am I wrong you ><!
Get the point ?!

Its not just about finding a sweet spot the change is much more severe then this.

This website use to be cool now its overun by flaming idiots.

3 years meaning that they didnt have a prolbem with ranger till now?! Some of you jerks I bet think the game first came out recently on the ps2 Na LOL .....

[Macht]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

They are constantly changing the game adding in more and more stuff. So the RNGs can't deal the best at any range like before, they are still capable of dealing great damage and with the more time I've spent with this new setup I've noticed my damage caps seemed to of been removed. I knew that every time I shot a lizard in South Gustaberg I would do 375 damage regardless of range or anything. Now it's anywere from 195-540. Even my Barrage on LL was at most with Bone Arrows 700-800 damage, since the update it hit at 3k damage.

The damage we can do and our accuracy has definatly changed, but if what I'm seeing is right then end-game just means the RNGs (Just like any other Melee) needs more boost to their Rng. Att. for greater results. In other words they are no longer such a superior force as RNG/NIN as they can be with RNG/WAR.

Last time I checked I could only find 3. Lets count now, 1....2.....3!!!! RNG/WARs out of 110. All the rest were RNG/NIN, and like SEs last census they were praising the fact that players were using different job combinations, if that is the case then RNGs must of been the exception and there was a reason why. On top of that RNG/WARs damaging capabilities were constantly being overlooked simply because RNG/NIN provided so much better security which it no longer is capable of.

As far as I see it RNG/NIN became what SE was intending NIN to be and RNG/WAR was getting shunned by elitism attitudes. You won't believe the amount of party invites I was refused before this update because they wanted only a RNG/NIN. A party with a freaking PLD and THF that is already able to create a great amount of hate holding wanted a RNG/NIN over the RNG/WARs superior damage abilities. There is something seriously wrong there.

Just as I always stated that there is something wrong when a NIN can be a tank and take no damage leaving the WHM to basically be a leech. SE may be late on it but they are balancing the game like so many have demanded.

[Lmnop]

Flame Free. Just facts

listen, Kess. These whiney kids you speak of have more base for arguments than you let on. And these flame wars? it's the "Sky-is-falling" Rangers who keep getting touchy and rejecting everything anyone says. It's getting old already.

All of you that claim the TP nerf was nothing?
Consider this:
Dragoon uses a five-fold attack, it deals awesome damage, and if I remember right, it used to open distortion. now the thf can close, and the 'goon has 60+ tp. he can /sam and med up and penta again, or he can be /war and just swing his spear a few more times.

Now let's look at RNG:
sidewinder for about 5x damage. Each shot gives more tp than any melee weapon, and you can now barrage for more damage than other DD's WS. You'll get hate, but you have shadows to hide behind which no drk or drg could ever get away with. Oh, did I mention your Sidewinder/Slug Shot opens Distortion? And that the Barrage gave you AT LEAST as much tp as a drg/sam will get from med?

No. I don't feel sorry for the Rng at all. If you're still pulling hate reliably in some of these CoP battles so you still need /nin, then your damage must not be all that bad.

and on a more friendly note. my underleveled throwing skill keeps hitting when I'm in melee (sweetspot for it) on things that are some 30 skill levels ahead and with no +R.acc gear. methinks my accuracy is enhanced. ^^
Oh, and Macht you rock, keep up the good work.

[peacemaker]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

Macht, with all due respect. There is a reason why so few people leveled RNG before the NIN job became available for reasons other than money, lack of decent range accuracy equipment, and the inability to stack 99 arrows/bolts/bullets.

1. That extra Archer or Hawker Knife adds an extra +10 to 11 range accuracy, and at higher levels Fransisca and Kriegsbeil, all of which are especially useful now that RNGs miss A TON. A RNG is not doing great damage if they can't even hit the mob or takes years to accumulate TP.

2. You may not feel the stress, but as a PLD when I partied with RNG/WAR and RNG/SAM before the patch, its heart attack everytime to see their HP shoot down when they do a Sidewinder or Slugshot. I'm not saying that RNG/WAR is not a viable combination, but it should not the your ONLY combination because some parties don't have THF or /THF melees. And if you sub anything other than NIN with RNG in most endgame events, you will die and slow down everyone else.

3. Nerfing a job is not "adding" anything to a game. They took the easy way out, instead of strengthening other jobs, they weakened one job.

4. SE has made mistakes before, like the ridiculously low 60-65 exp rate when the 65 cap was first released, they fixed that and hopefully they will fix this.

Again, as a fellow moderator, don't take this as criticism, but this is the Ranger forum and a lot of rangers, especially those who invested years in their job and use it for endgame events, this change affects their role a lot more than you think.

[JP_Ikari]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

Its late ill make my reply short.
This game has been out for over 3 years. Rngs were desighned to do devastating
damage for the cost of arrows.They changed the job because of the "true" whiners which are the kids that complained about rangers getting fast invites and doing to much damage.

3 YEARS. Now they ruined the hard work of others...You people who dont understand how this effects the job truly need to be quiet and stop acting like you know what your talking about. Its evident and your just making yourselves look like fools and while your looking like fools your also silencing the rangers voices by overtalking them and creating flame wars. ><

As far as realistic this is an mmorpg sir.... This whole game is unrealistic you ><!
Last i remember you cant cast warp in real life or am I wrong you ><!
Get the point ?!

Its not just about finding a sweet spot the change is much more severe then this.

This website use to be cool now its overun by flaming idiots.

3 years meaning that they didnt have a prolbem with ranger till now?! Some of you jerks I bet think the game first came out recently on the ps2 Na LOL .....

Yes, 3 years, 3 years and they finally thought of what?? How long have we gotten the game again?? 1 year and a half comming to 2 this year. You're saying even though it's been 3 years, that it should be left behind. Then why did they nerf the TP of multi-hitters (which btw was introduced 2 and a half years into the game). They're not perfect. They're still trying to find things that are un-even about the game. Yet you sit there and even think that "since it's been here for 3 years it should be this way". I'm asking again, and again. What did SE make the RNG's to be?? I don't know...do you?? Give me a direct answer, and not from what "YOU" think is the answer. From "THEM". Obviously, they didn't meant the multi-hitting WS's to give back that much TP. That's why they changed it. But think about it for a sec, could you even imagine how broken it would be, to see Guillo, Penta, Vorpal, Asuran spams left to right? But of course since you want it to be left alone since it's been "3 YEARS", then it should be ok.

If you read my post I said "NIN's were designed to be pullers by SE. But the players (and I again I will say this) made NIN's to be Tanks." Did you think they were tanks when you started or even when they were introduced?? NO. The players that has played this game for 3 and a half years (2 before you even touched this if you're an NA player) thought and made NIN into tanks. But you make it sound as if when the RNG's were introduced that all of a sudden they're the "heavy damage dealers" of the game. Give me an answer, please cause no one has yet to answer me to this question. Updates are introduced cause the developers are never perfect. Shit don't we have one right now?? Things are introduced and they look into what they recently introduced. If they have time they will look into what they missed a few updates back (even years back). That's why the TP nerf happened 2 and a half years after it was introduced in JPN. But of course with you saying everyone that is praising this nerf are whinny babies, can you tell me what you're doing now?? You're not helping, only fueling the fire that is in this forum or even in this thread. Shit I know it's hard for you guys to find this spot.

But damn it players can break games down, evolve and become better. And that's a problem. Not just with this game, but with any game I play. Everyone is so used to everything, and being happy on how everything is, but is never prepared for when a change comes. And when a change does happen they faulter, give up or even just cry and say "THIS IS BS>>>". I said it before, and I will say it again..."Great players evolve, what ever the situation is."

JP

P.S.

They changed the job because of the "true" whiners which are the kids that complained about rangers getting fast invites and doing to much damage.

I didn't appreciate that comment the most. It makes you look like you think very highly of yourself, and you prolly were one of the few that got so mad that this change happened. Very inconsiderate and very conceited. Again, think of what you're saying, very hard...and ask yourself that you're not whining.

[Macht]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

I could understand it may still need some adjusting, and being RNG/WAR my entire playtime I've learned how to adapt my attack strength so I can still deal out a great amount and not be the tank. What you state as good reason for having /NIN are the exact same good reason a BLM should if they want to go all out with their strongest spells, but now they handy cap themselves with not being able to cure in many players view.

As far as "nerfing" a job not adding to the game, then the same could basically be said with HNMs increasing in power as the fight progresses. It isn't likely that every fight ends at the same amount of time, so some fight are going to get harder. The fact that RNGs can still achieve their previous damage shows it was more of a change to presuade against undesired play methods, or behavior that is shunning a job choice.

It isn't the change to how range attacks work that is the problem I see. What I see that effected the RNGs end-game the most was that our damage being measured against the monsters level when it's higher then our own. The conditions to that is what I see was made to be a little to harsh, that's the conditions I still need to test out a lot more. I believe though that this is the real culprit to what most RNGs are not liking.

[Rodin]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

Macht, I want to thank you for trying to work with RNG after the patch. You're not whining, and you've found out that you can do on par damage before the patch.

/salute

Also, I do not think that I've been flaming. I've provided a link to a helpful visual. And if some people would try it, they would find that they can do good DMG as RNG. I was in the Boyhada Tree yesterday and a RNG was pulling hate from our PLD. That was without Sidewinder. Now, with Sidewinder he would ALWAYS pull damage. Our PLD wasn't a bad PLD either. He was very skilled, and he would Flash/heal himself frequently.

Point I'm trying to make. RNGs can do the best DMG in an EXP. party if they do a little bit of walking around to find the sweet spot. As for engame on the gods, I'm sorry, I don't know what to do there. But you can still try and find things out. If you find anything that helps. Post it here.

But, as for flaming; I think not.

[Macht]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

The thing that's still got my curiosty to get is the Selene's Bow. This was also released with the update to the RNGs, I have a strange feeling it might also be part of the reason for this change.

[Kess]

In response to Jp Ikari

Im responding to this with just a few remarks then ill end it here.

1. I am not a Ranger im a level 75 Ninja

2.Ninja were never suppose to be pullers."Where do people get that idea"They were suppose to be backup tanks that turned into main tanks...

3.I just leveled in a few parties with rangers and I was shocked with there performance.The ranger couldnt even pull hate for TA not once!! He missed alot of WS's and he was trying hard to stay in his little spot.

The skillchain was Heavy Shot > Spininng Slash

4.Rangers job decription is to deal massive amounts of damage using ranged attacks.

Dont give me silly lines like "The True Rangers Will Excell" Makes me laugh everytime I hear something like that.There will always be people willing to play a job regardless on how bad it gets nerfed.Then there are those who dont like to take it up there $$$ and continue playing like nothing happened.It just all comes down to how bad the nerf really is.

The Rangers I partied with were all great players with top of the line equipment.

I feel bad for all rangers... Good Rangers - Bad Rangers - Blind Rangers
Im sure the nerf doesnt seem that bad in low or mid levels thats a given.Try using one in a high level exp party. "I wont even get into Hnms but I would say why do you pay to play again?"

The Darkknight had to sata on to himself cause the mob wouldnt turn for the ranger we did this for 5k exp and the Drk almost died 8 times..

Ranger costs alot of gill to maintain and level.I would be skeptical for new Rangers to go down this path until things are sorted out considering the maintance costs and Endgame participation issues.

/sigh

I like to add one last thing for Ikari. We are talking about the Ranger Nerf not the TP Nerf. Almost all rangers would agree that a nerf would be ok but what they got was extreme...

I know that complaining about a nerf isnt gonna make it go away but there is no reason to ridicule and shame those who complain about a job downgrade considering the costs.

As for the original poster nice link.

[Icemage]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

I agree that RNG did get overnerfed slightly. The real culprit isn't so much the damage (which I do think was overnerfed a bit, though only a bit), but rather the accuracy penalty at longer ranges.

Part of the issue is that it leaves RNGs with no viable options about where to stand. Too far, and you have zero accuracy. Too close, and your damage is halved. That's a bit too extreme, I think, and I really think S-E should consider bringing point-blank damage up to about -25% and bring down the range penalty to something more reasonable - i.e. I don't think RNG should be suffering an accuracy penalty if they're standing in the "sweet spot" for their chosen weapon I'm not even sure if that would be enough to fix things, but it'd certainly be a step in the right direction.


Icemage

[Kess]

Re: Quit your B****ing and read this!

Icemage you 100% correct the nerf is to extreme and If people read your reasoning theyll see that Ranger went from being a great DD to becoming the most costly and annoying job to play in FFXI.

Ok this is my last post for real I quit and im a ninja LOL
goodbye