Gun or Bow - Better in the Long Run?

[Rogan]

Originally posted by Xodia
i knew a guy on midgard that used to always say kthxbai .... do you know Omgwtflol rogan?

46 RDM / 23 BLM )

yep

[nsxtasy]

Originally posted by Hisdon
However, Obow is faster, gives holy bolts (btw these things are nasty, I've seen em do 20-30 bonus dmg per shot), and venom bolts (these help a ton, and raise a O-bow users dmg plus mine by about 10 per hit)

However an O-bow user gains TP twice as fast as I do. How do they do this? the O-bow user shoots 2 shots per my one hit usually, E-Bow users usually attack at my rate...At this point in the game where everything will do around the same dmg as far as your ranged weapons go, you want the speedier weapon that can pull off bonus dmg (if venom sticks and even if holy only does 10 bonus dmg, that's 20 dmg over the E-bow per shot) I'd also like to add the only differences these RNG's had equipt wise, was the bow/ammo (I swear every 70+ RNG has the same set up almost xD)

From my own experiences, O-Bow is the supieror of the two weapons.

Hmm. Where to start.

I think this pretty much sums up your O-bow is faster than E-bow claim.

ebow + demon = d105, delay 580, str+3, agi+3, rng atk+23, rng acc+7
obow + darksteel = d104, delay 624, rng atk+18

Higher base damage, faster, higher rng atk, +rng acc, + str

Add in to that, the fact that rapid shot goes of w/ bow but not x-bow.

What did O-bow have over E-bow...? Oh yeah, acid bolts.

You want to stick acid bolts to up damage....thats great if it sticks right off and you don't spend half the fight shooting acid bolts for 70 damage.

Acids help other melee do more damage per hit. This might help more depending on PT setup. I pretty much only partied w/ Rugal in my PT, and mobs weren't alive long enough for any melee's to get enough swings in to have this add up. So you do an extra 100 to 200 total, kinda pales in comparison to the 4100+ damage the 2 rngs average per mob.

Rugal parsed all our parties and E-bow ruled all pre 70. (We stopped xp at 68-69)

Sidewinder: E-bow w/ PPA blows away the O-bow, its not even close. Both in accuracy and damage.

Arching Arrow/ Slug Shot: Ebow does a little more, but this WS is about setting up for a Light burst rather than doing the big damage on its own.

I used O-bow and E-bow on the same mobs (darters in dragon aery) and I did just as more damage per hit w/ E-bow demons. E-bow scorps was just a hair under O-bow w/ acids on. Add in the speed of e-bow and rapid shot and the clear WS advantage...

E-bow >>> O-bow.

[kuu]

hrmm, my problem is rank, so w/o the CP bolt/arrow witch weapon would you guys go with for level 52? gun or warbow+1

Gun has a nice advantage in the 50s-60s from the muskeeter gun+1/+2

They are pretty cheap, and lots or rracc. Add that to silver bullet and they hit pretty dang hard.

They are slow as heck, but that's where you play your strengths. High damage can work in your favor by lowering the TP gains if a monster.

It can also be your weakness as if you miss the sidewinder (when you get it) It's a long way back up in the TP scale.

So time your skills and tactics right, and you won't go >.< so often. Basically keep track of anything that make you easier to hit them such as gravity/frost/ breaks/sharp/ etc.

My advice if you go that way, is CHECK like heck(discription changes with debuffs) If you think you're going to miss sidewinder, don't bother use blast arrow or whatever.

If you're going bow, then by all means use elemental arrows (though I don't know their price) for normal hits, and your highest arrows for Side and maybe barrage. I would definitelly suggest scorp change for sidwinder from the acc. You need every bit you can muster with that WS, not to mention it won't do elemental damage anyway.

You can use a weaker arrows as a way to regulate your hate. That doesn't mean use only weak arrows It's not the best solution, but it's a convient one.

Invest in a CP arrow at least ^^

If you didn't know the stat's of windy CP arrow it's
Dam 60 ranged Accuracy+40 Ranged Attack+10 Additional Effect : Paralysis

Tacting that on to a very easily missing sidwinder and hard hitting is a good thing obviously.

Or if you're in deep doodle like my ebow ranger get himself into way too often, you use unlimited and shoot, which almost always does Paralysis, saving his ranger rear long enough for ichi to recast.

E-bow >>> O-bow.

O-bow is also pretty easy to get and it regain's some of its fame when you head to lvl 70+s doing Weapons. Holy does a good deal more to those suckers, especially the annoying redmages that have 10 buffs on them. Also Acid is tricky, but my ranger rule is don't use more then 3-4 if it can't stick by then. They stick often though. Obow damage also seems to match ebow somewhat both regular hits and in Arching/heavy.

In the end I found obow nicer but ebow has the edge slightly. Using them side by side for 2 rangers is super powerful though

[Lynsy]

Originally posted by kuu
ebow is not for show. It's does an average of 20 damage over warbow, more if you acid and dia2, sidewinder averages 100damage more, and CP arrow about 200 on top of that.

Not being able to afford scorp has nothing to do with having an ebow or not. Its only more options.

You DON'T have to use expensive arrows ALL the time. You can play hate control to your own tune. Changing to scorp when you WS, Change it to barrage, Unlimited with CP, and if you feel it's worth the money, change when your sharp.

If you're in a pinch shoot wooden arrows for regular.

First of all, I never stated nor implied that EBow was just for show--it is the best bow available (realistically...damn relic) and is, IMO, worth the trouble of getting. What I did say was that if the show factor was the only reason you are getting an EBow then you are vain and moronic--a point I will stand behind. After 60, the damage output of EBow and Scorps is not significantly different than the damage output of War Bow+1 and Demons, not saying its no different, but its not 8mil different. If getting EBow means you are going to have to skimp in other areas, its quite simply a stupid purchase. With the price difference in scorps and demons (on Hades anyways) it is roughly 1 million stacks of ammo before going War Bow+1 and demons would catch up to you financially with Ebow and scorps.
Reminds me of a WHM I knew with a Nobles Tunic that refused to use +MP/healing food because it was too expensive. Show pieces mean quite precisely jack shit if you aren't living up to them. Show pieces are worthwhile if, and only if, they improve your overall performance at your job. If you must chose between A and B and both will provide you with roughly the same benefit, but A makes you look cool and B noone cares about, far too many people will see A as a better option, even if B will cost a small percentage of the cost of the other.
Its kind of the same thing as asking yourself if you should replace your dual archers with dual hawkers or your rangers necklace with jagd gorget since you have 500k free to spend. By spending that 500k on dual hawkers, you get 1 more melee dmg/weapon, 2 more AGI, 2 more CHR (not that anyone cares) and 2 more RAcc. By spending it on Jagd Gorget you get 6 MP, 2Def and 1 more RAttack. (Though, its somewhat the opposite as far as "cool factor" the point, in essence, remains). If you are trying to decide between EBow and then using scorps forever or sticking with War Bow +1 and going with demons from there on out, IMO the smarter decision is to go with better ammo. Which basically means that if you used 10 stacks of ammo every single day, it would take you 274 years to spend the current savings in bow price (or roughly 3 months if you shot back to back non-stop 24 hours a day).
Any RNG that thinks EBow is worth it but using Wooden Arrows is Ok is the type of person Im talking about--if you are using woodens with EBow it best be some kind of joke or you are as vain and moronic as they come. The "OMG I'm so 1337 for I have teh EBow" mentality wont cut it when, at the core, you are a complete and total gimp.

[sylvanas]

rapid shot not going off on xbow? that uh...doesnt sound right to me @_@a it goes off just fine with a gun >.>a

[kuu]

Any RNG that thinks EBow is worth it but using Wooden Arrows is Ok is the type of person Im talking about--if you are using woodens with EBow it best be some kind of joke or you are as vain and moronic as they come. The "OMG I'm so 1337 for I have teh EBow" mentality wont cut it when, at the core, you are a complete and total gimp.

So...

I shoot with war bow +1 with only best type of arrow.
shoot 100x3
stop shooting, because you have hate.
ichi recast
wait for hate to jump back
shoot 100x3
side for 800
damage output: 1400

Vs
ebow
wooden for
50x6
switch to highest
sidewinder for 10000
get hate
ichi cast
damage output = 1300 + less time since you didn't have to stop shooting to loose hate+ having another ichi casting ready.

This is not counting whatever SC damage if you're the end of WS.

Sure it's easier with using highest arrows, but not using it all the time doesn't make you much weaker.

As I said, you're not using wooden arrows ALL THE TIME.

Situations where it's benifitial for you to go [full attack] and when not.
I can switch arrows durrent, WS, SHARP, BARRAGE, UNLIMITED. CHAIN4/5 maybe too.

Other then that, I get to choose how to pace myself with hate.

I wouldn't use wooden, but if you're in a pinch, you can decide to cut corners. Ebow gives you more options not less.

Regularlly people switch between socrps and demons.

[Funguwari]

My spin...

I'm planning on using War Bow+1 and Demon's (Ebow is ridiculous on my server and I'm not going to farm 9 million gil just so I can do a tad better than the War Bow+1 guy. While you're busy being a elitist I'll be Lv. 75 where I don't need a bow anymore. In the end, we're going to be using guns so, IMO, it's not worth using some crazy bow for that much time.) until I can get O-bow and I'll use all the ammo possible depending on the situation. You know, whatever bolts best for that Lv. for WS, Barrage and whatnot. And use Acid, etc. And then drop all of that shit and just get a Hellfire+1 and go nuts with Silver Bullets.

I think it mostly depends on your PT config. If you have a melee intensive PT. I think it would be best to use Acid bolts; therefore, making O-bow more effective. Warbow+1 w/Demon's and your Ebow setup if it's just you and a THF or something like that. Guns if you really want to be a elitist. And drop all that for Hellfire+1 when it comes.

It dosen't matter really. It's not like you're going to be waiting for hours for PT because you don't have a Ebow. And you're still going to be the most damaging class without the best equips, even though, IMO your gear and wpns should always be pimped but don't go overboard.

If you're the type of person who went farming for Peacock Charm when it came available, then go Ebow. If not... get a War+1.

It all depends of personal preference and how much of a elitist you are. I am a elitist in a sense but I won't farm for 6 months so I can get 10 levels doing more damage. It's not like my invites are going to be much faster/slow with or without it. And most people wouldn't be able to tell the difference in damage. Except for your assumption differences. "omg, he got e-doritoz bo? omffgbbqq omg hez defintnitntiyl doin more!111!11one!!!!"

[Thegod]

Ebow is 6 million gil, but the ammount you'd save on ammo from 55-67 alone might be worth it if your using a gun.

bottom line im 56 now ive tried ebow and must+1 and must+1 blows away ebow in every kind of dmg you wanna compare.....

...the question is spending 13k per stack of silver bullets something you can even do....ive only been doing it for 4 levels and its kicking my butt.

im going ebow ASAP the ammount saved on ammo is just too good to be true..


oh and obow goes through twice the ammo ebow does, concider that as well, holys and darksteals may not cost 5-6k a stack, but you'll be going through them way faster.


IMO gun's +10 rng acc. is needed for me at least untill level 58, I got my ran ger JSe and the +7 rng attack has put me over my damage cap, str down doesnt even lower my dmg anymore, not even 1 point....


^^ on that subject ive tried subing in str gear and nothing works im at my cap.