Wow thats alot of farming -_-

[Caspian]

Cpl questions:
1. Any suggestions for gear changes till AF??
I have Noct +1 for everything except boots which are Custom M boots.
Horn+1 rings
Great Bow+1 (i think thats the name, the lvl 30 one)
Horn arrows
nomad mantle
rng necklace
getting drone earrings tonight.
dual archers (was gonna get emp pin and leaping boots with the upcoming bcnm money but decided to get dual hawkers instead)

2. Is brigandine better than noct doublet +1?

Other than that, if I have no major expenses I'm just gonna save up and get an E-bow (been wanting one since I was lvling THF only crappy thing is they were at a low of 3.5 million 2 months ago and have recently shot back up to 7 million.)

Thanks

[greysenn]

Caspian,

It depends if you're going for a defensive or Acc/power leaning. Hit rates were just fine before noct gear came out, so I like the old standby of RSE Gloves, brigandine, Bastokan/Republic boots/legs with whatever for a headpiece.

The Noct unfortunately has the defense of tissue paper, so I'm not really a huge fan of it. (Particularly for Promv. missions, where /nin gives you enough Racc as it is.)

[Caspian]

I thought about republic greaves and cuisses, but Im bastokan, so for the price it doesnt seem worth it considering I'll NEVER get the ranged attack out of it. (Unless there is something I can experience on in on of the two gustabergs ) I may give brigandine a whirl here in 10 lvls, should be pretty much a straight up trade with noct doublet +1. Thanks though, I'll look into it.


One other thing, a lvl 75 friend of mine said r. acc was great but didnt do squat if you didnt have enough agility. Does anyone know what he was talking about or if this is something new?

[imac2much]

This theory was formed on the allakhazam boards or something I believe. Regardless of where it started, it is just pure speculation. I have yet to see any solid evidence to back it up.

However, I have some evidence and also my theory why this is false.

The poster compared AGI + RNG ACC to other stat/secondary stat relationships like DEF + VIT, ATK + STR... there were some fundamental flaws to his theory, however.

First of all, he thought that past a certain point of RNG ACC, you need more AGI to make more RNG ACC effective.

This is never the case for any stat and stat-derived secondary stat. For things like ATK, it is based on a logarithmic curve that never has any diminishing returns, but has a cap. STR increases damage by a linear curve, and also has a cap. More STR does not allow more ATK to help. If your ATK is already capped, and you add STR, adding more ATK won't make a difference at this point.

Another thing, he assumed RNG ACC had "diminishing returns." This is a common misconception people make because ATK obviously has a cap and people say DEF has diminishing returns. However, DEF is on horizontal end of the logarithmic curve, meaning as it increases it just keeps approaching the static asymptote. ATK will always always keep increasing, but it has a cap to stop it. If ACC and RNG ACC are relative to ATK, that means they have no diminishing returns, but should have a cap somewhere. But from my parsings, +99 RNG ACC vs +91 RNG ACC don't have a cap, as there is a general 3-7% rng hit% difference between the two.

Which brings me to another point: Is AGI really 2 AGI = 1 RNG ACC? I honestly doubt it. As you know, I parse almost all of my parties. Nsxtasy is in all of them.. he is a taru RNG with slightly different equipment. First off, he has 6 more base AGI than me. I use genin and hawker+1 for 2 extra AGI, but I also use striders (+2 agi) compared to his winged (+3) so overall he has 5 more AGI than me.

For RNG ACC, I have hawker+1 compared to his Hawker, peacock vs rng necklace, noct+1 compared to RSE, for a total of +8 more RNG ACC than him. In parses my rng hit% is usually 3-7% higher than his. If 5-6 AGI was 3 RNG ACC, and I only have 5 more RNG ACC, would that make it possible to have 3-7% higher hit%? Perhaps, but I find that harder to believe.

But overall it's proof even with +90 RNG ACC, more is better. Maybe at 72+ with opti hat and dusk trousers and the last acc up trait it will be different.. but for now, every bit of RNG ACC counts. Maybe AGI helps too but it should definitely be a second priority.

[Caspian]

Interesting. I'd never heard that theory before but it seems kinda off. Especially since the str and atk stuff was in a developer's interview but I never heard anything about the agility stuff.
Right now I have base of 41 AGI +15 from gear. And I think I counted +39 r. acc not counting the acc up traits and acc from arrows. I'll get hawkers when I hit 40 and use the rest to lvl ninja up and hopefully get to 50 atleast with the rest. Like I said, I just dont think republic greaves and cuisses are worth it when you're actuallly from Bastok. I'll pick up some brigandine at 45 and see if I can tell a difference not having the +3 acc from noct +1. I dont have a parser so I doubt I will, but I prolly will notice the defense difference. Not really sure of any viable gear changes I could make aside from leaping boots and emp pin and I dont see the point in dropping 400k for each just for a cpl net stat points. Ah well, live and learn. Thanks for the help guys. Any other suggestions are welcome as well.

[Funguwari]

Hawker's are 300k more than Archer's it it adds one more AGI+ and one more Ranged Acc.+...

300k (600k for Dual Weild) for +1 AGI and +1 Ranged Acc.?

Let's not getting fucking sick in the fucking head here, you're only Lv. 30ish.

Also, I don't think Ebow is worth it. I'm so sure I'm going to spend three months farming to get a Ebow when in that same two months, I'll go from 55-75. So while I skipped over my Ebow I hit 75 before you even made your purchace. And by 75, I'll need no money because I'll be spam killing HNMs, that's enough for me.

Majority of the RNGs on my server don't even go gun at 52, they just go bow and arrow. Most of them not even Ebow.

Does it matter? No. They still outdamage any class that comes near them. Period. Will the elitist 140 real-life days games played with all Lv. 1 jobs except for RNG, WAR and NIN? RNG:50, WAR:37, NIN:37 still farming for a Ebow do more damage? Yes. But at what price? Not being able to PT or do anything fun for 4 months? (|Thanks for the offer, but I'll have to say: fuck that shit!|)

I'm getting Noct+1 everything except for the pants. They're ugly and they're not going to help anymore than Martial Slacks would. Leaping Boots? AGI+3? So are my RSE... they're AGI+3 too... Hmmm, I'll obviously go Leaping Boots because they're more expensive and people will look up to me more... /sarcasam

Emperor's Hairpin? Sounds good. But for one AGI less I'll get a Noct beret+1. Besides, Elvaan look sexy in Berets. Oh and don't even fucking think about saying the Evasion helps. It does jack mofo, jack. My friend, 57 RNG right now uses both. Dodged one attack on the pull. WOW, he saved one shishei because of his 600,000g hairpin! That saved the mages ton of MP! And money on Shishei! I totally see it worth the 600,000g if it can save me ONE shadow image. No wonder why everyone loves it! /sarcasam

Get the AGI+3 (or is it 4) the HQ earrings. All Noct+1 except for feet, go Elvaan RSE or Leaping Boots. Get always +1 Bow and keep up with arrows and keep HQ equips always.

Just because you're not willing to spend 10 real life months farming for one extra Ranged accuracy dosen't make you suck.

Just make sure most of your gear is HQ! You can have all HQ gear like me and do the same as the fool with 140 day time logged. 90% of my equip is +1. I like to be the best RNG I can be within reason.

Man#1: farm for peacock charm and ebow and use guns and crossbows all in pt and make sure everything is +1 and +2 if possible this is the only thing acceptable, period otherwise you be gimp n00b
Man#2: Get as much HQ gear as you can, farm a little, camp some NM, get the best gear. Don't go for crazy things like Peacock Charms, etc. You want to have HQ gear, and you want to play your best. But don't gimp yourself.

If you want to be Man+1 get the Ebow and whatever other elitist equips you want. If you want to be Man#2, a man with a good head, play it the way he says it.

I can only imagine what these RNGs say with Ebow and Peacock Charm and the ready Lv:

Mom>>honey! go out to the store and buy some mouthwash, get the one on sale

RNG>>NOooooooooooooooooooooooooo FUCING WAY! CREST $100.000 tooth paste and listerine and spring water chilled with minted floss and toothpciks just in case! orny way to kill germs!

[Thegod]

STRIDERS ARE FNING RETARDED....


you are low level guy, calm down and dont even think for one second about striders....evenb if you did happen to farm 10 mil (aka goto ige and buy it) theres no way you'd keep those boots, you can barely even notice the 12% increase in movemnt speed.

how do i know?

i have a federation aketon and i can barely notice the 12% increase in movement speed. (not to say it isnt there, but 10 mil for a slight boost in runing around the zones speed, you must be joking me)

striders serve one purpose and one purpose alone, help to kite HNMs, tough BC mobs like the prom mea boss, and gods.......if you dont do any of those things you have no business with strider boots.


im sorry i lost alot of respect for imac's opinions, he says IMO agi isnt worth anything....lol he couldnt be further from the truth, agi is everything especially if you use xbow or gun, your damage with xbow or gun is solely related to your agi..


ever wonder why taru rangers using guns outdamagae elvaan rangers using guns...well thats why.

your gear is fine, save the gil for ammo guy, and use a gun...

if you think your rich enough to afford 100k+ per level every level after 55.

[Omena]

I recently started leveling ranger and I got to L20 today. I have no idea of how I'm supposed to be able to afford e-bow...ever. I have a L70 thf and I can farm maybe 300-500k in a day if that's the only thing I do and I do it for many hours.

Let's see now. If e-bow is 7 million (not sure, haven't checked), I'll have to dedicate at least two weeks into famring, and only farming, which by the way, is very, very boring.

Is being in a HNM LS or buying the gil the only option?
My L70 thf equipment doesn't even total to 7 million. I have 2x snipers, hoplites harpe, amemit +1, hairpin, leaping boots, blue cotehardie, lightning bow +1 and lots of other equipment with smaller price tags and many times people have complimented my gear, yet I'm not even close to obtaining anything worth three million or more, even though I spent most of my thief days, that's right, farming. Whenever I was LFP (often the entire day), I would be farming or coffer hunting.

[ClydeArrowny]

im sorry i lost alot of respect for imac's opinions, he says IMO agi isnt worth anything....lol he couldnt be further from the truth, agi is everything especially if you use xbow or gun, your damage with xbow or gun is solely related to your agi..

Thats not true. The /secondary modifiers on Weapon skills for marksmanship/ are AGI only whereas the ones for archery are AGI and STR. Does that affect normal shots? no Does that affect the entire dmg of a WS? no A secondary modifier is just that, a modifier. Some rngs I know get more dmg WS on average on kirin by increasing STR than AGI.

[Thegod]

WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT??

go read the interview with the SE developers thats where i got my information, ill post a link as soon as i find the site.

agi affects marks WS damage......


ummm in that part where i said ive tried everything....also mgo read the adding str thread on this board, everyone agrees.

my commment to imac sounded way to harsh for what i meant.

AGI is crucial saying it is not inportant is misleading.

and taru rangers with guns hit for more damage then elvaan rangers with guns....bottom line im in a ranger static thats all we do is rng rng rng and sometimes a fourth will come.

[ClydeArrowny]

agi affects marks WS damage......

The /secondary modifiers on Weapon skills for marksmanship/ are AGI only whereas the ones for archery are AGI and STR. Does that affect normal shots? no Does that affect the entire dmg of a WS? no A secondary modifier is just that, a modifier. Some rngs I know get more dmg WS on average on kirin by increasing STR than AGI.

Where did I say AGI doesnt affect dmg? I said its a secondary modifier for the WS. A hume 75rng/nin on my server gets stronger slugs on kirin using hellfire+1 and silvers when he replaces AGI with STR. STR increases the dmg curve whereas the AGI is a multiplier in the WS dmg. They both increase dmg for WS, but AGI isnt the end all stat for WS dmg and doesnt affect at all the dmg for regular shots.

lol he couldnt be further from the truth, agi is everything especially if you use xbow or gun, your damage with xbow or gun is solely related to your agi..

This implies raising AGI will increase dmg for your regular shots, which is not true. IMO this is misleading which is why I tried to cleatr it up a bit

[Thegod]

yeah you are correct...

...not that i was wrong IMO dmg is dmg, but i was misleading sorry ><

but you do agree with imac????? that a few points of agi can be ignored??

[ClydeArrowny]

Personally I believe for hiting mobs consistantly, rng acc is more important than AGI to an extent. The AGI however will allow you to have a bit more dmg on the end of your WS. I, persoanlly, would go with rng acc over AGI, but others may choose to have more AGI. Now as far as ignoring AGI....if its 0 stats VS AGI I would say dont just ignore it, though prices do factor in.

[Thegod]

hrrmm, i dunno

i hear agi increases the rng accuracy cap, and i know im not anywhere near the cap, but i figured if i could max my agi absolutely max it, and me being a mithra, then i could be the most accurate i could possibly be.

I am not at the point where i can sub out rng acc. for agi....the only slot thats possible for me now is in the pants.

republic vs nocts.

off topic

would you wear snipper's mantle or nomads+1

i mean if that 2 agi is worthless or overkill, then i want the +1 ranged attack.

i have 25agi w/o food w/ nomads+1 equiped and republic pants.

[ClydeArrowny]

i hear agi increases the rng accuracy cap, and i know im not anywhere near the cap, but i figured if i could max my agi absolutely max it, and me being a mithra, then i could be the most accurate i could possibly be.

Well yeah imo it increases the cap, however from what I've seen its already near impossible to reach the cap for ranged acc so it doesnt seem to help that much compared to pure ranged acc.

would you wear snipper's mantle or nomads+1

The mantle only works with a specific subjob. And since I assume you have war or nin sub, you wont get the bonus from the cape. The agi will increase your ranged accuracy a bit, just not as much as rng acc+2 would imo.