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Ranger Accuracy Trait

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  • #31
    You can figure it out, it's just a multi-variable equation applying a calculus level of math should get you close to the actual equation. The key part though is gathering what information you can do the best with to determine that. In this case a parser can be somewhat useful. However when determining the Acc. the parser shouldn't be doing it in number of battles, but in number of shots and misses or attacks and the misses.

    With that kind of info and done along a large number any randomness to it ends up being filtered out. You ever do a math equation that has a base number it and some randomize portion to it. That all the resulting numbers you get and average it, depending on the numbers variance the average can filter out the random factor after as few as 1,000 attacks.

    In this game with the variance in accuracy that occurs it seems that somewere around 10,000 swings/shots the characters actual accuracy value should become quite clean.

    EDIT:

    After you have an Accuracy value from that testing then you do testing to determine to what Stats cause the evasion check to change to the monster. (When testing with Range Accuracy you'll have to preform the Accuracy value test multiple times with each stat changed to see what difference occur).

    All that is just preliminary testings to start gathering data no true mathmatical equation should come out of it as of yet. Once you've done the testing with STR, DEX, AGI, VIT, MND, INT, CHR, Accuracy bonus items, Accuracy bonus abilities. Then you'll used that gathered info to determine what Stats actually effect the Accuracy. This is were you'll start to formulate a mathmatical formula, the formula will most likely have around 3 variables you won't know however (possibly more).

    Once you have formulated your inital formula then you test that equation in actual play with different monsters to see if the accuracy value fits. In this test you won't be determining number of swings/shots but more over a scaled ratio with different monsters to start formulating what possible stats the monster has that effects your ability to hit.

    When you start to gather more and more info along this line you should starts to see between monsters of different types some variables that they have that effect your known variables.

    The ability to figure it out is possible, the question really is if anyone has the patience and time to do it. I mean to do 10,000 swings/shots in a properly controlled setting and to possibly have to do this about 9 or 10 times is a lot of time to be spending on that.

    To give an idea on the time spent doing that with RNG only using a flat out shot every time and shooting as soon as it's available to me (no kind of multi shots or anything that has an actual accuracy boost to it, like using Sharpshot or Eagle Eye, and definatly not using Barrage) I can use up about only 1,000 arrows in a 9hr play.

    So doing this for around 2 day straight (no restroom, food, or any kind of break) gathering all this detail. It'll actually end up a lot longer unless you have other people with you to mule some arrows and the items for testing the Accuracy effects.

    I haven't seen anyone willing to do that yet, most of the time the results gathered from parsers are done in a two fold effect which really only shows that current parties effeciency (States nothing about the accuracy or anything, at best it only really shows the players skills).

    The other were people have parsed information along this line is while they aren't in a party and most of the time all the possible variables are not considered. After all you should also consider day as being a possible effect to your accuracy as well, and even Moon Phase. So these testing would really only have a 1 hr window every some real life days.

    Also to add even more when doing the controls and such to do this no stat effects should be in play so you'd need a RDM and a WHM willing to accompany you through these testing so they can dispel and remove any stat effects.


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    • #32
      If you ask me, best way to test this is in Ballista with PVP where you can get definite numbers for someone's evasion, atk, def, etc. Against monsters it's kind of like shooting blindfolded not being 100% or atleast 90% sure of what the evasion numbers are, atk, def, etc. Few of my friends in the linkshell wanted to test out stuff like this in ballista and were going to since we were split up with 4 of our linkshell on one side, 2 on the other with 2 japanese players. We couldn't figure out how to explain to them that we wanted to test stuff out, so they kept AOE sleeping us while we were fighting each other. >.<
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      • #33
        Yeah, we should take advantage of Ballista to verify these. So, when we examines our oponents, there should be the same sort of dialog displayed like "Even Match with high defence."

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Macht
          In this game with the variance in accuracy that occurs it seems that somewere around 10,000 swings/shots the characters actual accuracy value should become quite clean.
          This would only apply if you could fight the same mob for 10,000 swings.

          There is no way to put enough controls in the game to determine accuracy solely from parsing. There is simply too much randomness and variance in enemies (not to mention status-affecting buffs and debuffs).

          Apple Pie's method of using "low evasion" check is quite ingenious, and works well because you don't have to fight or kill the mob. Nevertheless, while it can be used as a model to learn about the game, there is still a limit to the level of precision that we can obtain when trying to find out about the inner workings of the game, unless Squenix is kind enough to hand us data.

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          • #35
            I think if you use ballista instead of mobs to fight for 10,000 swings, you could VERY accurately determine your accuracy rating and such because of multiple reasons.

            1.) Nothing changes on the person (unless they change gear). ATK, DEF, Evasion, etc. are going to be the same the entire time you fight them.
            2.) You can get actual numbers of what someone has for these.
            3.) Very low chance of death to someone in ballista if you're testing something

            If anyone wants to write up a few example tests and how to do them, I will gladly forward them onto my LS and we can attempt to run them for some qualitative data. I think a friend of mine really wants to anyway, we just need a method to our madness first.
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            • #36
              The only objection I would raise to that is the fact that the "laws of physics" are a little different in Ballista. For example, we know that player resistances to status effects are changed. Fighting an even match PC in Ballista is nothing like fighting an even match mob.

              Centurio X-I 1/1 - Celphie 1/1 - Deadly Dodo 0/2 - Doppleganger Dio 0/1 - Jaggedy-eared Jack 0/7 - Joo Duzu the Whirlwind 1/1 - Leaping Lizzy 2/16 - Mimas 0/1 - Odqan 1/9 - Orcish Wallbreacher 0/1 - Ose 1/3 - Sagittarius X-XIII 1/1 - Serpopard Ishtar 3/6 - Silk Caterpillar 1/2 - Tom Tit Tat 0/2 - Trickster Kinetix 0/2 - Valkurm Emperor 6/10 - Wyvernpoacher Drachlox 1/1

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              • #37
                There's also SE's special Ballista rules.

                "(5) Damage and accuracy values between characters of different levels will be changed. As of this event, your damage and attack will increase when you attacking a player who is a higher level than yourself."

                http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/polnews/news2182.shtml

                This is easily remedied tho (unless its uncapped).

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                • #38
                  Ya, I've noticed that in ballista I usually do the same damage to a galka PLD per shot and a taru SMN. The range is usually only about 20-30 difference, just the galka can take a lot more hits On weapon skills/barrage, the damage can change drastically between targets though. Mostly do to more/less TP or all 4 arrows hitting on barrage or just 2 or something.
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