Reprisal

[Armando]

Re: Reprisal

BBQ, (I know you weren't implying this but) I didn't pull that statement out of my ass. I said Hank is definitely wrong, because I went out and let some Lolibris smack me around with and without Phalanx, and with and without Stoneskin, to verify the claims made in the BG thread. And they are most certainly right. Why should Phalanx not be counted when Cocoon is? Because Phalanx is more "superficial", equationwise. It's just a subtraction at the very end of the calculations. Plus, Phalanx may or may not be there. Cocoon affects Defense, and that's a core part of the equations that can't ever be removed.

For your benefit: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...8-07-05-37.jpg

My Phalanx subtracts 18 damage. Reprisal reflects 50%. Add 18 to the non-zero numbers and divide by 2. Also notice how the reflected damages that are less than 9 occur on 0 damage hits.

[Taskmage]

Re: Reprisal

Posts in the nin vs pld line of conversation have been moved to the other thread. If we would please, let's leave that conversation out of this thread.

[Celeal]

Re: Reprisal

I just tried Reprisal in Campaign for 1.5 hour. I was using PLD/DNC all time.

My observation is, the usefulness depends on the mob. I was doing Campaign at Bastok side, and those *Turtles* cast magic very often, and their melee speed is slow compare to ToAU exp. mob.

On the other hand, Sentinel + Reprisal does not seems work well together --- The spike damage from Reprisal gets really low when Sentinel is up.

Note: If spread out Sentinel and Reprisal, the recast timer isn't too bad. Reprisal covers 1 min, and Sentinel covers 30 seconds; Sentinel timer can be merit to reduce, and Reprisal timer can be reduced by Haste. I think the usage of Reprisal is different, but it can fill in the gap nicely between other JA's.

I was using Koenig Shield. IMHO, the reflect damage in my case isn't impressive. When the Shield proc, the damage was already low. Half of that damage reflected is just very little compare to a sword swing, especially for Hybrid-DD exp. setup.

So far I don't see much impact with Reprisal yet. It is possible that my setup isn't build for Reprisal.

P.S. The mobs in Campaign seems to be smarter after the update, and the damage output of those mob is higher now. For example, the mobs gather as a team and back to back Curaga IV during battle ...... there is a battle i ate 5 stun-lock in a row --- back to back Shell Bash with no gap in between....

[Armando]

Re: Reprisal

Celeal, are you sure Sentinel + Reprisal don't work together? I don't want to turn this into a "I'm right, you're wrong kind of thing," but this screenshot disagrees. Admittedly, my testing is very limited, but it does at least suggest that the reflection damage isn't taking Sentinel into account. Perhaps you got unlucky with resists? Either way, it's still going to be better to "separate" them for defensive purposes, I'm just saying.

Reprisal isn't about the damage in my opinion. It's more about the boost in shielding rate.

[Celeal]

Re: Reprisal

I could be wrong.. I will need to use it more often~

Since it is magic, does magic skill cap affects the performance of this spell? Mine is way low (basically, half the cap)

[Raydeus]

Re: Reprisal

It probably depends on Enhancing skill (haven't tested it yet), and if it does then that will be yet another reason for me to finally cap Enhancing merits. Not that I needed more reasons anyway.

[Malacite]

Re: Reprisal

/whoosh

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYGTg1E9iZ4]YouTube - Top 100 video game music: Final Fantasy 4 Boss Battle # 82[/ame]

[Armando]

Re: Reprisal

I haven't done much testing yet, just got those basics out of the way. I haven't tried higher damage hits yet. I doubt there's a cap on the damage, since trying to get hit harder JUST for the spikes damage is counterproductive, and there's not much left to reflect after a shield block (except possibly against HNMs, but they'll probably resist your spikes anyways.) If this works like other spike spells, then the accuracy of the spike damage should be based on your Enhancing Skill, but I doubt there's anything else to it.

[Enghorr]

Re: Reprisal

I haven't done much testing yet, just got those basics out of the way. I haven't tried higher damage hits yet. I doubt there's a cap on the damage, since trying to get hit harder JUST for the spikes damage is counterproductive, and there's not much left to reflect after a shield block (except possibly against HNMs, but they'll probably resist your spikes anyways.) If this works like other spike spells, then the accuracy of the spike damage should be based on your Enhancing Skill, but I doubt there's anything else to it.

/salute

Me and my fellow PLD/RDM Miraiken(Ifrit) did some basic test. It seems reprisal deducts damage even while phalanx is on, and whatever is left lands in stoneskin. Size 4 reflect damage was avg of 60% return and block rate was pretty good increase. Size 3 overall I think still wins if you compare both. I dont have any aegis data, but I am sure its just sick lol

[Karinya]

Re: Reprisal

Karinya, one observation - taking damage negates Sublimation.

No, having your HP drop below half negates Sublimation. Small amounts of damage don't disturb it (either charging or full charged).

In many situations such as soloing or Campaign a PLD/SCH would not have to worry about suddenly taking half their HP - it's getting enough MP to keep up with the frequent small hits that eventually exceeds your 1/tick auto-refresh plus sanction/sigil.

[Armando]

Re: Reprisal

Ok, so FFXIClopedia's info on Reprisal said the reflected damage apparently depended on shield size. I was skeptical, so I did some testing. These were the results. No forms of damage reduction were used.

Size 1
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...9-32-01-60.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...9-32-06-70.jpg

Size 2
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...0-01-39-43.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...0-01-41-57.jpg

Size 3
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...0-11-53-73.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...0-11-56-10.jpg

Size 4
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...0-18-30-25.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...0-29-55-28.jpg

Using the numbers for damage reduction I had figured out years ago (Size = 25%, Size 2 = 45%, Size 3 = 60%, Size 4 = 75%) I did some backwards math and found that the Damage Reflected = 1/3 of the damage reduced by the shield block. E.g. If you take 100 damage and block it with a Size 3, the damage you take gets reduced by 60, so you see yourself get hit for 40 damage, and the reflected amount is 1/3 of 60, which is 20.

Once more, Size 1 is god-awful at what it does.

EDIT: Upon further reflection, the fact that it's based on the amount by which the shield block reduced the damage makes everything make perfect sense now. Phalanx, Sentinel, Stoneskin, Damage Reduction, all of those things are taken into account AFTER the shield block reduces damage. That's why they have absolutely no impact whatsoever on the reflected damage.

[WishMaster3K]

Re: Reprisal

Armando = For Great Justice.

Any word on the alleged increase in shield proc rate?

[Armando]

Re: Reprisal

Well, it's certainly noticeable on Size 3's. Size 4 still doesn't block as much as I'd want, lol. But no, I haven't parsed anything yet. I don't think I need to say how painful it is to parse stuff manually. I'm still hung over from my Counter test =P

EDIT: You can judge for yourself by counting the number of hits that proc'd spikes vs the total number of hits I took though. I'm too lazy to count right now.

[WishMaster3K]

Re: Reprisal

Then what makes you think I'LL count. >_>

[Armando]

Re: Reprisal

Manual parse from the screenshots.

Size 3: 12/18 = 66.67%
Average damage reduction: 0.60 * 0.6667 = 40.02%
Normal proc rate in 2006 parses: 25.75%
Boost: +14.27%/x1.55?

Size 4: 15/35 = 44.86%
Average damage reduction: 0.75 * 0.4486 = 33.65%
Normal proc rate in 2006 parses: 21.82%
Boost: +11.83%/x1.54?

Of course, sample size is still very insignificantly small.