Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

[Callisto]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

Stuff

Holy crap, WM3K is alive!

[Klumps]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

Ok, so the consensus seems to be to focus more on the VIT/DEF/enmity gear overall. At the least, that makes my decisions as far as which head piece (Rival) and whether or not to get a Woodsman (yes) easy to make, and those were my immediate concerns.

I can say for a fact that the mechanics of PLD tanking these days is significantly different than it was 3-4 years ago in this level range; I took a MNK to 61 back in '03-'04. Back then there were no woodsman rings (only sniper, which is kinda a no-no for pld), there was no parade gorget, or medieval collar, or Kampf gear, or auto-refresh, or shield mastery - shield skill itself was just another parry, etc.

PLD tanking these days is *significantly* easier than it was back then. Keep in mind with HB mantle alone I'm only three enmity short of a level 60 (well, effectively a level 72-73ish) PLD back in those days - and have been since level 36. I get more cures due to auto-refresh, as well, and more TP and fewer interrupts due to shield mastery. With current defense (380ish, as noted) in xp (granted, only up to level 50), I've been forced to use Banish II when I had refresh, simply because I wasn't taking enough damage to have to cure myself with Regen II up.

You could argue that melees (at least in my level range) are doing significantly more damage now, as well - I'd agree, but with a caveat. Mediocre melees are doing far more damage now than they did back then, due to sushi. Well-geared melees don't seem to be doing all that much more now compared to what they did 4 years ago - there does happen to be far more of them, though.

I guess I'd really take a ton of convincing that +3 shield skill from the buckler earring is worth 130k compared to what else I could be doing with that cash. That's not even one level's worth of skill (shield skill caps every level - again, unlike the old days).

I don't think I explicitly stated it - PLD is my highest level job. I unfortunately don't have a large coterie of bored 75s to draw upon (although I do know a few). I got help from one for my Genkai 1, and I'm sure I'll get help for the others as well, as needed - but anyone who hasn't already played a PLD 50+ or is looking at doing so is going to consider parade gorget a vanity piece rather than a necessity like Genkai quests, and so would be less likely to want to help, I'd think. I guess I could be wrong about that.

Anyway, I'm obviously missing something since I thought I was on the right track with the hybrid DD gear (keeping in mind that I'm *not* sacrificing defense going for this gear anywhere except the ring slots - on which most seem to agree +acc is the way to go). Do the camps get that much more difficult that I'm going to be getting creamed in the 50s like I never did in the 40s? I understand that I can't use food vs. colibris, so defense is good there (to the point of using phalanx rings, even?), and I may not be able to use JAs/WS against imps, so +enmity definitely will be important there. Obviously any situation without refresh (/shudder) forces me to turtle up a bit more as my MP usage drops to about 1/3 so I can't afford to take as much damage.

I'm also curious about the comment about jaridah peti not being worth it at 55 - why not? AF isn't until 60, and it's replacing IM Cuirass. Stat differential going to the J. Peti is +2 defense -1 vit -25 HP +5 Acc +5 Atk; that seemed like a no-brainer to me, especially considering it's actually cheaper than the IM cuirass. Going from RK chainmail to J. Peti is -1 defense -25 HP -2 str -2 dex +2 atk +5 acc, so J. Peti still seems better to me overall. I do understand that amemet mantle wouldn't be full-time, but if I didn't need the +5 enmity from the HB mantle (and I only appear to need it now in groups with exceptional melees), I'd be better off wearing the amemet, right?

So, anyway, like I said, I must be missing something - last time I went through the 50s it was still bats, beetles, crabs, pugils, and raptors, and I was on the other side of the mob besides. I drew my fair share of aggro back in the day, but I was also sporting +30ish atk +23 acc +15ish str, Cross-counters and meat food, so I pretty much expected to (God how I hated nin "tanks" back then).

[WishMaster3K]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

Holy crap, WM3K is alive!

Oh you guys didn't even notice I wasn't here.

._.

[Armando]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

Urgh, too many walls of text. Klumps, you want Acc/Attack, not VIT/Def. And if you have to choose, Acc/Attack > Enmity.

You want a Valkyrie's Mask, not a Rival Ribbon.

See my equipment guide for more details. I can't really make a long post right now.

[Celeal]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

Urgh, too many walls of text. Klumps, you want Acc/Attack, not VIT/Def. And if you have to choose, Acc/Attack > Enmity.

You want a Valkyrie's Mask, not a Rival Ribbon.

See my equipment guide for more details. I can't really make a long post right now.

IMHO, either way can work, mix both together works too.

I was using Rival Ribbon before AF, but that was the time before ToAU, before Auto-Refresh, and under traditional party mindset. The downside of Rival Ribbon is, it may take a long time to re-sell it once you got AF.

From my experience, Parade Gorget *alone* hardly make any difference. I suggest get a Dark Staff: There will be time when /head + Dark Staff is useful --- it is up to your decision when/how to use it or not.

[Callisto]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

Oh you guys didn't even notice I wasn't here.

._.

I hadn't seen a post from you in like 2 months lol, I had actually been wondering where you got off too!

[Klumps]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

Ok, that's what I thought Armando - I have been working off your guide throughout the levels. Everyone else is contradicting it though, which confused me, considering all the posts in your thread are very positive.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

Contradictions... Hmm.

Basically, Armando was able to shift to DD style PLD much earlier than most of the other posters. So, the disagreement is really about at which levels should PLD go full DD, hybrid, or turtle.

No one disagree with the notion that defensive style tanking works, though, at least to Lv.70; it's whether it would be more beneficial to do DD or hybrid before then that's in question.

[Klumps]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

Right, peoples' opinions contradict each other. I guess what I should be asking is how recently did everyone level their PLD up? Someone who leveled up in '04 or '05 is going to have a vastly different opinion than someone who leveled it up in '07.

[Armando]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

I leveled during the later half of '07.

[Empedocles]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

Well I level'd my Paladin up turtle-style, all def and no attack/acc gear, def food (but I wasn't using defender. I see Paladins using defender in exp nowadays and I cringe.) I even used Earth Staff 51-55, fighting crabs. I did almost literally nothing with Earth Staff in those levels to add to damage, hitting from 0-15 on hits and maybe 25 on ws to crabs in Kuftal Tunnel. (It taught me a lot about hate management and how effective your damage contribution is to tanking)

BUT that was before even the shield frenquency update and even before (or just after) CoP came out, which was quite the while ago. Many things have changed since then, and I endorse Armando to the full because he's generally right on the money. New/better gear, new/adjusted job traits, heck, even new food has come out since then, and tanking has changed dramatically. Whenever LS people ask me about tanking as Paladin (I'm generally considered the main Paladin of the LS since I've been Paladin the longest and I'm always on, so..) I generally recommend food/gear setups depending on their situation, or if they plan on taking it to 75 (or even 37) the first thing I do is direct them to Armando's equipment thread and occasionly to Armando's shield size test thread as well if they ask about shields.

The good thing about the Paladin forums on here is that while it can occasionly get heated, there is very little flaming and a lot of dicussion/debate over ..well... everything Paladin. This thread is a good example

Edit: I level'd VERY slowly, being in a partial-static and then in a duo when the static broke, and my duo friend wasn't an exp-freak. My friend was worth more to me than exp, so I leveled Paladin from about mid/late '04 right up to late '06/early '07 IIRC.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

Had a almost-once-a-week static party for long time, until Lv.60-some. Hit Lv.70 sometime last year in pick-up groups. Usuall full turtle--about 80%; 15% hybrid. The last 5% is for that those very few times when I felt comfortable enough to use Dorado Sushi.

As RDM75, partied with many defensive and some hybrid style PLDs in merit parties. Full DD PLDs probably would have done better in most parties, but it's not like a turtle PLD is worthless in meripo. I think in only one party where I could definitely say "The turtle PLD was trying hard but it just was not working out."

Haven't found the time to go back to finish up the last 5 levels, yet.

[Vandros]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

Leveled Pld from Jan 07 to about October on a new char. I went basically full DD from 40 on in gear, and switched to sushi in the early 50s (outside colibri of course). That being said, I was in a static with trigger happy DDs and we tried to avoid overhunting IT+ stuff for most of the levels....so your mileage may vary, etc.

That being said, I still think going fully or nearly fully DD is the way to go from the second you step out of your MH to the moment you hit 75. The only time you'll get hit very, very hard is when you're fighting stuff that's IT++ with food on...and you'd get hit very very hard wearing Gallant instead of Hauby on too! It's best just to disband and find something else to do in that time frame, exping like that is just miserable for everyone.

[Celeal]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

<-- very slow leveling ... Orz

I start playing PLD part-time a few months after PS2 NA release, trying multiple jobs in the game at that time. During the CoP era, I was working on different jobs in the game, including PLD. After ToAU is released, my jobs narrow down to a few frontline melee jobs, PLD included, but still not sure what job to level 75. Finally my PLD reach level 75 --- my 1st level 75, after WotG released this year

[Roo]

Re: Low/Mid Level PLD Gear

Lets see pld was 04/06 - 12/06 dinging 75 on aura weapons in sky, war was 04/07-06/07, nin was 08/07-09/07 the latter two in ToAU areas. I've levelled all the tank~ish jobs to 75, in ToAU areas I switch to Acc/Att gear in the mid 50s. Nin can gear for evasion if they want but its just like turtle tanking, it just doesn't hold hate as well as you might hope. There isn't a need to tell me that nin and pld are completely different, after taking both jobs to 75 I'm well away of the difference in tanking styles and the basic principles of tanking. I don't tell people how to tank, I'm just saying how I tank. My way of tanking is steady constant emnity gain, i prefer constant cure 3s and decent melee acc instead of dropping big cure 4s