Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

[csBahamut]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

I think they're talking about dps, but maybe I'm wrong. In a sense, WS isn't that good enough to keep hate for a PLD unless SE decides to give PLDs a bit more power in that respect. It's the dps however, that can make some difference, since the consistent shin kicking is more reliable than the occassional wtfmiss bodyslams...

Eh, sword WSes aren't that bad really. Though Vorpal Blade is weaker than Eviseration and Rampage, even with enough attack/accuracy. Of course, Joyeuse has low base damage. Company Sword puts up pretty nice numbers. And you're right, Joyeuse is more for the DPS than the WS, though I've gotten some nice Vorpal Blades in merit parties. I typically get 250-600 damage from Vorpal Blade in the ToAU WS-burn camps, while tanking and using Joyeuse. I can break 400 consistently if the WHM and DD's are good enough to let me keep up Berzerk.

[Maju]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

I tested company fleuret and it was indeed piercing but unfortunately company sword still dealt at least equal, if not better, DoT against lesser colibri.

[Armando]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

So does the Company Fleuret increase base DMG with each party member added into the party? Would you mind testing it? I'm pretty interested in the weapon. Not sure how familiar you are with the damage formula but it's basically (D + fSTR) * PDIF. Company Fleuret is a 36 DMG weapon, so its fSTR cap is 36/9 = 4. With capped attack, your PDIF can range from 1.6 to 2.4, and your criticals would range from 2.6 to 3.0, with about half of them being 3.0. So, on mobs neutral to piercing, with capped STR and Attack, Company Fleuret should hit for 64-96 on normal hits and 104-120 on crits when solo.

I'm guessing Company Fleuret's DMG would increase by 1 for each party member added, simply because if it increased by 2 DMG it'd turn into a 46 DMG 226 Delay weapon with 12.3 DMG/sec, which exceeds Maneater's even with the latent, and comes close to Company Sword's 12.7 DMG/sec (and would noticeably exceed Company Sword's damage on colibris, which goes against your observations.) I really don't see a predominantly RDM weapon being that powerful, since the general trend (save for Joyeuse) is for the bastard swords to be the more powerful weapons by far. 41 DMG seems a lot more reasonable.

Anyways, assuming it increases by 1 DMG per party member, the max crit damages should be the following:
1 party member: 123
2 party members: 126
3 party members: 129
4 party members: 132
5 party members: 135

If it really gains 2 DMG per party member, it'd be...
1 party member: 126
2 party members: 132
3 party members: 138
4 party members: 144
5 party members: 150 or 153*

*Most weapons with higher latent DMGs use their "real" or "base" DMG to calculate fSTR. I'm assuming this would be the case for Company Fleuret as well, but it's also possible that with 5 party members it uses the 46 DMG rather than 36, and calculates your max fSTR as 5 rather than 4.
You don't have to go out of your way to test it, but if you do, I'd be very grateful. I'm not high enough to test the fleuret yet, since I'm still 60.

[Maju]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

Company sword does not gain additional weapon damage in a party. It has been recently tested by a "reliable" poster on KI. Because of that I doubt the fleuret would have a hidden effect like that.

[Armando]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

It doesn't? Wow. So the hype was over nothing.

[Aeni]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

It doesn't? Wow. So the hype was over nothing.

I actually knew that over a year ago, when the Company Sword was going for 1.5 million and I was like, I see NOTHING on this sword that makes it worth 1.5 million!

Then a friend got it from a drop. I played with it and came to the conclusion that people who was hyping it up was smoking some good stuff.

Well, I guess I was right. Thank god I didn't go and try to pay that ludicrous sum of money (Since then it did drop to about 500K but still ... it's pricey)

[Gilge]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

i might be mixed up with another sword, but last i checked, i think company sword was only like 7k on seraph.

[Releena]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

Company sword does not gain additional weapon damage in a party. It has been recently tested by a "reliable" poster on KI. Because of that I doubt the fleuret would have a hidden effect like that.

Actually, it does. Those preliminary tests only proved that in a 2 person party, it does not do any additional damage, ie, the latent effect is not +2 dmg per pt member.

However, in that same thread we have conclusive screenshot evidence of people doing damage indicative of a higher base damage with a full pt along with anecdotal evidence earlier in the thread.

http://ffxi.killvoid.com/forums.php?...678544#2678544

[Maju]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

Actually, it does. Those preliminary tests only proved that in a 2 person party, it does not do any additional damage, ie, the latent effect is not +2 dmg per pt member.

However, in that same thread we have conclusive screenshot evidence of people doing damage indicative of a higher base damage with a full pt along with anecdotal evidence earlier in the thread.

http://ffxi.killvoid.com/forums.php?...678544#2678544

Ah, that's pretty cool. Hopefully he wasn't just using another sword to screw with our heads, though.

[Davitron3000]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

Actually, it does. Those preliminary tests only proved that in a 2 person party, it does not do any additional damage, ie, the latent effect is not +2 dmg per pt member.
However, in that same thread we have conclusive screenshot evidence of people doing damage indicative of a higher base damage with a full pt along with anecdotal evidence earlier in the thread.
http://ffxi.killvoid.com/forums.php?...678544#2678544

Thanks, I hadn't read the rest of that post. I definitely will be holding onto my Company Sword now.

[Armando]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

Ah, I see. It's good to know it does have a hidden effect, even if it's been described inaccurately. So, anyone feel like testing Company Fleuret? >.>

[Altae]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

Yes, all rapier-type swords deal piercing damage. From fleurets, degens, rapiers, as long as it's a rapier class sword. The different weapon classes do different weapon damage types. Like blades are slashing. Same with MNK weapons. There's a huge misconception going on that all MNK weapons are blunt, except for 1-3 exceptions. This is not entirely true. Claws seem to be piercing and katars seem to be more of slashing. Just the other day when I was leveling my MNK around Lv45. The Mythril Claws did more effective damage to a beetle in Garlaige Citadel than knuckles and cesti types. Especially since MNK AF1 is a cesti type. And it's nothing to do with the different +damage provided by each weapon.

[bside]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

I tested company fleuret and it was indeed piercing but unfortunately company sword still dealt at least equal, if not better, DoT against lesser colibri.

According to the "Weapons and Armors Thread Lv58" on 2ch (actually one of the 2ch-compatibles), Company Fleuret and Mensur Epee, both added on 7/25 patch, do NOT do piercing damages, although both are of Fleuret-type graphics.

This was tested by using them against the crabs in Apollyon SE, that have 100% resistance against cutting damages (such as Axes and Katanas) but are weak to all other kinds of physical damages, and the test resulted in 0 damages on both of them. That simply means those weapons possess cutting attributes.

Actually, it does. Those preliminary tests only proved that in a 2 person party, it does not do any additional damage, ie, the latent effect is not +2 dmg per pt member.

However, in that same thread we have conclusive screenshot evidence of people doing damage indicative of a higher base damage with a full pt along with anecdotal evidence earlier in the thread.
http://ffxi.killvoid.com/forums.php?...678544#2678544

Hardly a news. It's been tested a number of times for its validity and reliability, and long known that Company Sword's hidden effect kicks in when in a party of 3 or more; +2 to DMG for 3, +4 for 4 +6 for 5, and +8 for 6, thus not activated when in a party of 2 players.

Besides, the tester in the linked thread is testing against the tiger in Jugner, but it's something he shouldn't be doing in the first place if this is to test the DMG rating. In order to gain the valid numbers, it's best to do this against the lvl 1 mobs around the 3 starting cities, as the higher defense and VIT of any higher lvl mobs could affect the outcome. (I do agree that tigers in Jugner are low lvl enough for this test to be valid and reliable, but in the tests like this we need to rule out every single possibilities that could affect the validity and reliability of the result.) Not to mention it's usually done by using SA, not by waiting for the critical to come in.

So, anyone feel like testing Company Fleuret? >.>

Although it's yet to be further tested, it seems that Company Fleuret doesn't have any DMG-related hidden effects. There's simply not enough sample to prove this at this time, so like I said, it's to be tested further for validation.

On the other hand, Mensur Epee was found to have a hidden DMG-related effect that is completely opposite to that of Company Sword. In other words, the fewer the people in a party, the higher the DMG.

Or, as follows;

Solo: D47 2 ppl: D45 3 ppl: D43 4 ppl: D41

while stated base DMG is 39. As w/ Company Sword's hidden effect that doesn't kick in for a party of 2, this effect doesn't kick in for a party of 5 and 6.

[csBahamut]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

Good to know about the COmpany Sword. I could have sworn I've seen 200+ crits on Tough mobs.

[Aeni]

Re: Are all rapiers piercing weapons?

The only real way to test it is by putting the weapon in the hands of a job class that can also use other similar weapons with the damage rated listed through the hidden effect. In this manner, if you see consistency with the numbers with each increasing damage weapon, then you can safely assume that the company sword has a hidden latent effect.

Right now, all I see is (a) a possible damage increase or (b) a possible DEFENSE reduction on mob.

Best way is to test it on a STEELSHELL with party members whacking away with it as well and see if their damage also increases.