Koenig vs. AF in Dynamis

[Empedocles]

I'm currently on my way up (very slowly but getting there) to Maat and I'm starting to look into Dynamis.

I'm not particularly interested in the gods for Koenig, so I was wondering if I could use Valor gear (of course Gallant/Adaman first until I get Valor).

Do I really really super need Koenig for Dynamis? I know it kicks ass and is probably superior, but I don't really want it yet. I'll get it if I must, but I'd rather avoid it for now.

Thanks in advance.

[Davitron3000]

Re: Koenig vs. AF in Dynamis

You do not need Koenig for Dynamis. You do not have to have Koenig for Gods/HNM.
In fact, you can use your AF1 in both of the situations and it stands up pretty
well.

Valor gear is really nice also. I don't currently have any of this but I want it.

Also, Koenig is not always the end all of Paladin gear in my opinion (but man does
it look cool and yes I would die to have a whole set). I would think in some
situations you would want more enmity (kiting perhaps), and I am not sure if I
would ever use the feet over the original AF feet because I am a shield whore.

I only have one piece of Keonig (hands) and I have done well against both Gods/HNM
and in Dynamis, but maybe Paladins that have both Koenig and Valor can give you
more insight on to the pros and cons. However, I am just saying you can be fine
without them also

[Darkarcher]

Re: Koenig vs. AF in Dynamis

"Koenig is a luxury, not a necessity.
Teamwork and cohesion overrule a set of Koenig any day.
Equipment is important.
Teamwork is more important."

I have Koenig hands and head. I use em...because i have them. But for Off-tanking in Dynamis i'll use Valor gear for the Enmity boost. Its really up to you. I like to have enmity because...the VIT and HP boost aren't doing any good if you arn't getting hit.

Just my 2 cents

[JeanRC]

Re: Koenig vs. AF in Dynamis

Koenig = Highest Def + Vit eq for pld. But no enmity

AF2 aka AF from dynamis = Good Def + Good enmity

It depend on the fight itself that which is better.
Sometimes a mix of both may be good too since it balance up the enmity and def and vit. Example if someone keep stealing the hate away from you in pt or in dynamis or hnm and its hard for you to pull it back fast ( by saying fast i mean without him dying because of it or getting hit more then once ) then you need to switch to more enmity gear from koenig to AF2 or other eq that give you more enmity.

If you want to be the best pld, then you need to learn to switch gear a lot of times. Like when provoking, you switch to enmity gear then right after provoke you switch to DEF + VIT gear for normal monster or DEF + VIT + HP gear for very hard hitting hnm or boss in dynamis. And switch gear to hp when you get 300 tp to use your spirit within ws that the damage depend on hp which will give you tons of hate from it too. There are still more ways to switch gears to like switching to shield block gear since se make a big change to it and even accuracy gear if the monster level is VT or low and it dont hit hard ( by saying dont hit hard it should by constantly 70-80 damage below per hit for lv 70+ ) This enable you to tank effective and able to hit the monster to do a bit of damage and gain tp for spirit later. Often time your spirit well like on the last chain aka 4-6 chain monster then use it to help push or get the chain.

[Valrath]

Re: Koenig vs. AF in Dynamis

Koenig would be nice to have, but far from required. I do dynamis just fine in AF/relic. Mobs typically don't live long enough to do serious damage. Yes, they do hit hard and vanguard monks are just broken, but for the most part the mobs are sleeping or being zerged by 30+ melee. Hate will bounce around alot, but since they die in under 30 secs, its no big deal. Yiou just need enough emnity to keep the mobs off the sleepers.

Dynamis run can change very quickly, imo. At one moment, you're in control, next, you have a swarm of mobs after you. Having different types of gear will help. After a while, your group will work out the minor glitches so your suport team will be really good, and thats more important than gear. Gear keeps your alive for 30 secs. Your support keeps you alive forever.

[Karinya]

Re: Koenig vs. AF in Dynamis

The level 73 adaman cuirass set usable by WAR and PLD (made by smithing) is also a good option for people who don't have any of the rare/ex stuff yet. It has a nice amount of def, vit and enmity. (Not to be confused with the level 73 rare/ex adaman *hauberk* set, which is DD gear usable by WAR/DRK/BST.)

If you are new to dynamis, you probably won't be the main tank for your LS, so you should probably emphasize enmity mostly. You want to be able to keep 2-3 mobs off the sleepers until it's their turn to die. But have your best def/vit gear available to swap in when the LS's main tank suddenly dies and you have to take over - because sooner or later, it WILL happen.

I probably wouldn't wear more than about 2 pieces of Koenig most of the time even if I had them, because of the enmity loss compared to adaman, valor, or even gallant. Swapping in the whole set might be handy against monks, but having them tear through half a dozen DDs is usually even worse than having them kill a tank or two, so even then you shouldn't neglect your enmity too much.

[Mephisto]

Re: Koenig vs. AF in Dynamis

There's really no right or wrong answer -- basically you just mix and match based on what you have. All I can really say is remember that equipping a piece of Koenig over AF or AF2 makes you lose out on quite a bit of enmity that you're going to have to (most likely) make up for somewhere else. I think in an ideal situation (5/5 af2, 5/5 koenig), I'd probably only be using the Koenig body. A PLD without hate isn't going to do anyone any good, and if you take 150 a hit instead of 130... is it <i>that</i> big a deal? That's what healers are for.

[Empedocles]

Re: Koenig vs. AF in Dynamis

Thanks for all your input guys, much appreciated

I have all my Adaman bought already, just need 73 so I can use it..

As I have seen mentioned a few times that you encounter groups of mobs in Dynamis, and need to be able to have hate on multiple opponents, does anyone have a normal area/dungeon where I could practice under similar conditions? Movolpolis(sp?) comes to mind, are there others?

[Valrath]

Re: Koenig vs. AF in Dynamis

Easy way to do that would be to camp near the delkfutt's tower zone and voke/flash the train of incoming wrights/banshees/crabs and other nasties people aggro. That'll give some practice is handling multiple enemies.

For hate management, if your pt gets a link, voke/flash the link, then use a buff JA. If someone tried to sleep the link, use rampart/warcry, that will create a large hate spike on both mobs. Also, casting cure I on the sleeper, then dump a cure IV on yourself will help too.

[Credos]

Re: Koenig vs. AF in Dynamis

"Koenig is a luxury, not a necessity.
Teamwork and cohesion overrule a set of Koenig any day.
Equipment is important.
Teamwork is more important."

I have Koenig hands and head. I use em...because i have them. But for Off-tanking in Dynamis i'll use Valor gear for the Enmity boost. Its really up to you. I like to have enmity because...the VIT and HP boost aren't doing any good if you arn't getting hit.

Just my 2 cents

Whren did say it best.

[Uiruru]

Re: Koenig vs. AF in Dynamis

Ya for dynamis a enmity build is best with enough hp to keep you alive in dynamis most of them time you will be just taking hits just long enough for your rdm's to resleep the mobs and repeat and koenig usually won't offer enough hate during the bigger pulls when the rdm's will come close to just chaining sleepga whenever its up.

[Rellinger]

Re: Koenig vs. AF in Dynamis

It really depends on what you have. Wearing full Adaman armor (except the feet) is fine for Dynamis. Even full AF1 is fine for Dynamis. I personally like to wear:

Head: Koenig Schaller
Body: AF1
Hands: Valor Gauntlets
Legs: Adaman Cuisses
Feet: AF1
Rings: Jelly + Herc
Main: Machulitit+1(sp?)
Sub: Koenig Shield
Ammo: Bibiki Seashell
Earrings: Knight's + Drone
Back: Resentment Cape
Waist: Warwolf Belt

It's a very Enmity heavy setup. If I'm really having trouble holding hate (yay for Ridills) I'll swap out Koenig Head for Aegishjamlr.

[csBahamut]

Re: Koenig vs. AF in Dynamis

Depends on what you do in Dynamis, and how far along you are (the mobs are weaker in the beginning than at the end). I know some LSes use a main tank, but mine doesn't. Us PLDs just keep as many mobs as possible off the sleepers/healers. It's too inefficient to have one tank keep hate 100% on every mob, except for MNKs and NMs. For those, who ever the PLD is that has control of them will tank it. We have a DD play targeter.

So based on the way we play, I go for full emnity setup with damage reduction through shield blocks. Thus, I use AF/Relic with shield torque, AF boots, Knight's Earring, and Boxer's Mantle. About halfway through, I'll toss on my Koenig helm for the additional def, VIT, and shield skill. For the NMs, and sometimes MNKs, I'll toss on my Koenig Hands as well. Of course, that's just my setup. I've seen plenty of people just use a mix if AF, adaman, relic, and Koenig. It all works fine since the mobs are kept asleep most of the time.

For hate management practice, nothing works better for practice than links on pulls, or adds, during exp. Or there's WS burn parties (yes, I do tank in WS burn parties as /WAR). When a mob dies in 30 seconds, you learn to keep hate in ways other than purely provoking. Just remember though, you need to at least keep hate on one of your targets. If you think you can't handle as many as you have, make sure you have at least one, just like Whren's guide states. For my LS, MNKs, WHMs, and PLDs would be the primary jobs to keep hate on. MNKs because they can kill any non-PLD faster than you can blink. WHMs because they tend to be last. And PLDs because they tend to resist sleep.