Holy Crap

[csBahamut]

Re: Holy Crap

Even if SE gives us auto-refresh and better shield blocking (both reducing the damage we take), we still get hit and we still don't deal damage while tanking (NIN is a DD and a tank at the same time). There would have to be some kind of major change to change the current player attitude towards PLD. def vs mob attack just doesn't compare to shadows that always completely nullify damage. Level 12: A high def tank takes ~10-40 dmg a hit and does just under par damage. A blink tank absorbs the damage completely and deals OK damage. Level 75: A high def tank takes 130-180 damage a hit and does crap for damage (~4-7%). A blink tank absorbs the damage completely and deals good damage.

Even if PLD takes less damage and get's auto-refresh, people still wouldn't want them because the auto-refresh would not be enough to make PLD self-sufficient (would still need healing and refresh), and because we're still not dealing any damage. SE has to make it so that tanks who take damage, and don't deal damage, disirable by players. How they can do that, I just don't know. Nerfing Utsusemi (the reason why PLD is a 'waste' of MP for endgame exp) would completely ruin NIN as it currently is. Giving PLD provoke (even it it was on a 1-min cooldown) would just make PLDs into wannabe blink tanks 74+.

[Deltran]

Re: Holy Crap

yeah i really dont see how they could put them on par without breaking nin or some how giving pld shadows lol

[Balfree]

Re: Holy Crap

SE:

PLD now get spike spells and stoneskin, XD

lol

[Jei]

Re: Holy Crap

they can give pld new spells... something similar to nin...
omgshieldpwn I = level 12, blocks 3 hits with shield guaranteed
omgshieldpwn II = level 37 blocks 4 hits with shield guaranteed

[tdh]

Re: Holy Crap

Updated thread lists that there may be "updates" to RDM and BLM jobs. They seem to have changed their mind on Manaburn parties. They once said they loved that people found new interesting ways to get EXP, and now they're saying it's too powerful. So they mentioned lowering Magical damage if there are X number or more BLMs in a party.

I don't really see RDM as very powerful, then again, I am a RDM. lol We just have a lot of tools available to us, and we use them very well. (That's my story and I'm sticking to it.)

I like the idea of updating PLD. They said they were looking into offering bonuses for having different subs. They realized that past Lv.48, basically EVERYBODY subs NIN all the way. And we all know PLD subs WAR for ALL EXP parties. (O.K. There has been the rare occasion of a PLD subing NIN reported, but it is a rarity.) I'd be interested in seeing how they change that.

But this was just funny!

they can give pld new spells... something similar to nin...
omgshieldpwn I = level 12, blocks 3 hits with shield guaranteed
omgshieldpwn II = level 37 blocks 4 hits with shield guaranteed

[Jei]

Re: Holy Crap

hurry your blm to 75 before next month if you wanna do divine might!

[Deltran]

Re: Holy Crap

lol that cpuld be a good idea jei not as a spell, but as a job, tho even with shield you still take dmg so unless pld get thst taken way for pld

[Kaickul]

Re: Holy Crap

They made mention of how Paladin has been taking a distinct second seat to Ninja lately.

Lately? Try for the last 2 years, which is the main reason why I quit PLD. Until PLDs get their own form of provoke they will not be prefered over NIN,. Auto-refresh and increased shield block isnt gunna do s**t for them getting one shotted by HNMs or being MP sucking secondary tanks.

Q: Paladin reliant on Warrior Subjob?
A: They actually want to give more jobs more options for subjobs, including Paladins.

If this actually becomes possible I might pick up PLD again for /MNK.


Until PLDs get the job ability they should have had since day 1, I am not impressed with any changes otherwise. They are not going to win over the HNM community that PLDs can be useful tanks until then.

...yes you could say Im a little bitter about how my PLD career went.

[Omniblast]

Re: Holy Crap

For the most part I think they're looking really good ^_^ This is some quote posted on a thai forum.

war : ability to throw axes
pld : auto-refresh, more TP gained from shield block
rng : thinking on a way to give rng more damage from last patch
sam : new ability to decrease enemy's TP when hitting them....subtle?
blm : it doesn't seem they are picking on blm
drk : adding more benefits to use scythe
bst : recognized lots of ppl have been complaining about last patch reason they believe that bst is a strong job, but don't want to completely undo changes so they will look to do "something"
brd : change it so there are more places for them to use other songs
nin : not going to make nin any weaker
most difficult thing, need more time to think of what to do..bu bu!
drg : no plans to change anything, still evaluating impact of lastest changes
smn : change so that duration and effect of avatar buffs are calculated based on summoning skill, increase more abilities for the avatars
thf : perfect dodge change it in battle so that it will increase the damage attacking from behind
whm : thinking of other ways to involve whm in front line, new abiltiy to give HP or MP to other PT members
mnk : new ability to boost other PT members HP

noticed Rdm isn't mentioned.

They also said "Look into it." for adding a Refreshga for SMN.

[qaitakalnin]

Re: Holy Crap

getting back on track just a little, i like the idea of stoneskin and spikes for the plds, i mean plds get hit anyway right may as well make that getting hit useful in someway. Definitly, definitly need a way (before lvl40) to have a free provoke ability (from what i have read flash is as good as provoke for hate, but that costs mp)

Me personaly i would like to see something like sentinal be changed, instead of just increasin you def, actually make it a mini invicible. I mean look most jobs have a mini version of thier 2 hours, whm have cureaga, wars have beserk, rngs have barrage, now yes none of these are as powerful or relaiable (maybe a divine seal cureaga from a whm) but being immue to physical dmg for 30sec or heck even a new ability on a 5 minute timer that makes you immue to special attacks might be worth it.

Quick thought about the spikes and stoneskil, why not make shields that can cast those spells? so the pld doesn actually get the spell but can use items that can cast those spells?

[dirtyclown]

Re: Holy Crap

I think the main reason why Paladins can't use spikes and stoneskin is because they're considered "Arcane" magic. We aren't mages, we're soldiers. That would definitely rock if we could, but it contradicts the idea of a Paladin. Enhanced uses for shields might be something like adding a latent effect to our shields that kicks in when we successfully shield block. Restored hp, or maybe a spike type ability. I think I'd prefer a few new shield based job abilities, though. A better shield bash or a trait that makes blocks occur more often or something. Back in the day, I never got into the HNM scene because of the reasons mentioned above. If it's a mob, I'll tank it. But if I'm going to be put on the bench and be a backup tank, I don't think so. I'm running with a set party right now, and we do alot of different things so these new updates and such are going to be very welcome, whatever they might be.

[Macht]

Re: Holy Crap

Well don't forget Shields once before use to completly nullify damage if they were successful. They could work this old design into a new trait or ability for PLDs, coupled with the new ability activating more it makes a potential of a PLD only being able to nullify damage without the constant strain on having to use Utsusemi.

Just think of the possibilities that they could do if you focus improving what happens with Shields. There's a whole slew of possibilities if they are looking to give PLDs new stuff with the shield being a center focus to it.

I you could have like:

Skillful Shielding = All successfull shield block nullify damage.
Aggressive Shield = Successfull shield block deals deflected damage back on opponent.
Mana Shield = Spell cast on PLD improves amount of TP gained (Coupled with Cover and the Enhance "Cover" that allows them to take a Spell hit, gives more options)

etc....

That's what I understood it as anyway from reading what was posted here with the PLD possible improvements. Add in that Ageis is a Size 1 shield so it blocks very frequently consider that with these effects and you can see how it could be a powerful improvement. Even make it were PLDs can successfully shield themselves better as an always active trait, so even the largest size shield drops down to better possibilities and even Size 1 shields going even beyond what they do now.

[Kaickul]

Re: Holy Crap

I you could have like:

Skillful Shielding = All successfull shield block nullify damage.
Aggressive Shield = Successfull shield block deals deflected damage back on opponent.
Mana Shield = Spell cast on PLD improves amount of TP gained (Coupled with Cover and the Enhance "Cover" that allows them to take a Spell hit, gives more options)

While I cant see them offering PLDs a form of counter-attack those options would make shield far more useful. The last change to shield was an improvement on the skills use, but making PLDs take MORE damage was not good for making the class more favorible. Also I can count on my hands how many times over the course of about 1.5 years being a PLD that I actually saw a mob get stunned with Shield Bash.

I think the biggest thing to overcome is having PLDs take less damage that the MP cost of keeping them alive, doesnt outwiegh them tanking. So if they had shield block do 1 of 2 things:

Full Successful Block - No Damage is taken.
Partial Block - Partial Damage from hit and TP is gained.

But adding onto what you mentioned:

Aggressive Shield Block - Hit is blocked with partial damage and you autmatically bash them (and get a higher chance to stun) with Shield Bash.

That would seem to help a lot.

[heero79]

Re: Holy Crap

i am only a low lvl pld but i have centaly noticed that one probem is the dmg that u do like being in a drg at my lvl just kills my chance to keep the hate cos he hitting like 30 - 50 a go and i hitting like 10 - 20 but misisng a lot and voke + cure just can't keep up they do need more strgenth

[dirtyclown]

Re: Holy Crap

i am only a low lvl pld but i have centaly noticed that one probem is the dmg that u do like being in a drg at my lvl just kills my chance to keep the hate cos he hitting like 30 - 50 a go and i hitting like 10 - 20 but misisng a lot and voke + cure just can't keep up they do need more strgenth

Paladins have the 3rd highest strength growth rate of all the jobs IIRC. Strength isn't a problem, it's your sword's Damage that's low. At lower levels you just need to spam your abilities to keep hate, and you should do fine. Stick with swords, you'll be pleased when you can start using the heavy swords that do decent damage. And pick up a Grudge Sword at 39, you'll love it.

An improved form of Shield Bash would be nice, maybe one that actually stuns mobs with a decent frequency. I've seen countless gobbie bombs and other interruptable abilities still go through after I bash them, regardless of perfect timing. If any of the things mentioned in the newspost or here are implemented, I'd jump for joy. We've generally been left alone for the most part, and a boost would make it even more satisfying to play this job.