Paladin DD 101

[Weeeekujata]

Re: Paladin DD 101

so now that i got everyone`s intrest tell me hwat you think of my new avatar & Signature

[Gwynn]

Re: Paladin DD 101

so now that i got everyone`s intrest tell me hwat you think of my new avatar & Signature

>.> well not that I've participated in the convo at all (though it is quite interesting) I think your sig is pretty badass ^^

[JP_Ikari]

Re: Paladin DD 101

If you have time to do it, and have people willing enough to join in, it's all worth it. I tried something stupid last night, and found out SA + Savage Blade works. I did about 789 on EP to my lvl last night and ended a Frag for 489. And majority of my gear is VIT and was subbing THF. What about SA/TA Spinning Slash as a PLD with STR and INT gear. That can work since Spinning Slash's (if I remember right) follows STR and INT anyway. But again, that's just me. I wouldn't think of going DD anyway, cause if I'm gonna DD, i might as well turn into a WAR/NIN/DRK/RNG/MNK to do dmg.

Though it looks like a fun experiment. GJ Wee, always fun to see how you like messing around with yer PLD. BTW, I finally got a Cassie, finally broke the 1500HP plateau with a BQ ring. Still farming the damn Bloodbead ring cause I like it better than the BQ ring (no -75Fire = always a good thing). And Celestial Nexus is by far my most favorite EXP spot for my PLD. I get about 6-7k an hour with the right set up. People hate me though cause I keep too much hate, so i try and let up whenever i'm there. I'm 25k til 75 woot, how about you Wee?? I haven't visited this place in SO LONG (drama with LS in Allakhazam and KI is too good to not read).

JP

P.S. Also btw, I have an LS member that's trying this out, I dunno if she has a company Sword, but i dunno to be honest. Even if we stack ourselves with all the STR, if I remember's Solidsnakes' SS, our VIT caps at 71 (hume) at 75 and str is stuck at 70 (which is where my str is now). /shrug. Again, fun to play around with, but I wouldn't really look forward to it. :-D.

[Weeeekujata]

Re: Paladin DD 101

I'm 25k til 75 woot, how about you Wee??

Son have you checked my new sig and avatar ^^y(lol dont mind the son thing its a ls chat habit )
Ya I forgot to make a Official I am lvl 75 announcement ^^. Been about 1 1/2 week as of today, also with a nice 20k buffer ._. I lost some xp in dynamis windy ._., I also have been fully switched from RDM main-> PLD main in my LS and currently Getting ready to start hosting dynamis to upgrade my relic sword.

Hume Vit Cap's @ 70 btw @ 75

My LS mithra pld and me discovered we have same base VIT @ lvl 75 ._. the main difference was the mp and hp, which is by about 100hp amd 100mp. In case your wondering my Base VIT is 67.

My HP is currently 1590, with my turtle soup I achieve 1749.

Weakened I had almost 800 hp. I still tank weakened, and survive real long
We had zero wipe in windy once again ^^

ANYWAYS sorry thats off topic lol

I wanted to thank everyone in this thread for making this discussion a succesful one. I am trying to stir up some things for people to read.

anwyays back to work

[Omni]

Re: Paladin DD 101

just my 2 gil, you cant just look at ws formulae and determine what ur dmg output will be. we know that those weapon skill formulae are helpful in helping us setup our gear but they are not 100% acc. there's still a lot of unknowns. savage blade is one of the most disappointing skills around. i have rarely seen savage blade do great dmg even on too weak mobs, and definately not on xp mobs.

and, omgarsh meph is still playing wtf.

[Weeeekujata]

Re: Paladin DD 101

just my 2 gil, you cant just look at ws formulae and determine what ur dmg output will be. we know that those weapon skill formulae are helpful in helping us setup our gear but they are not 100% acc. there's still a lot of unknowns. savage blade is one of the most disappointing skills around. i have rarely seen savage blade do great dmg even on too weak mobs, and definately not on xp mobs.

and, omgarsh meph is still playing wtf.

do savage blade 300 tp and do a SA savage on the mob :D

while in many circumstances it doesnt look great at all it does have his advantage.

[Omni]

Re: Paladin DD 101

noted. it does have its advantages. but i feel overall, savage blade is a poor ws. i rather have a pld use swift, vorpal or spirits rather than savage blade.

[Weeeekujata]

Re: Paladin DD 101

WS's can all be exploited in someway, savage blade is @ 300% tp(best would be martial analace + joyeuse in that case) but waiting for 300% would be worthless even 200% with martial in a xp pt. and to SA with pld DD well, your loosing your offhand joyeuse tp gain as well as dual wield.

BUT

It's sooooooo coool loooking i still like it after 2 years!

lol Anyways night out ^^

[JP_Ikari]

Re: Paladin DD 101

LOL, yea I re-checked on Kurokikaze's SS. We do max 72 at str. Kinda annoying though that I have to wait to 75 to see 70VIT base. T_T. Btw, I forgot to check, congrats on getting to 75 hehe, I guess i don't know how I missed your SIG (it's SOOO HUGE). At any rate, you see some significant dmg increase with Savage with more TP. I can't afford anelace in my server (2mil), and again, no joy = really pointless to try.

JP

[Weeeekujata]

Re: Paladin DD 101

new thing, from what i hear, the new double atk earring works without /war, and has a 5%-10% proc rate.. so a supponoi + boraka earring might be very nice. double atk proc with vorpal blade would be very very very impressive.

in case your wondering you joyeuse ignores double atk traits, but your company sword wont.

hence more tp gaain, high ws dmg possibilities.

Unfourtunatly, i've been saving all my limbus run coins for my AF+1 body(which will be my main body until i get my koenig... a koenig very far)

for leg's dusk might be better as well, switch in your royal for vorpal.


oh ya, remmeber we can equip bow's so u can pull in a xp pt too ^^y

[csBahamut]

Re: Paladin DD 101

I've been looking at two different setups for PLD/NIN DD. A sushi + attack gear and an attack food + Homam set. I started thinking about this when I finally leveled NIN to 37 and saw how much more Vorpal Balde did with NIN sub than WAR. With WAR sub: 400-600 most of the time, with rare 700-800. With NIN sub: 600-800, with rare 900+. These numbers are for with using Company + Joy-toy.

Sushi + Attack Gear:
Company Sword
Joyeuse
Tiphia Sting (+2 Atk, +2 Acc) or Anything else.
Optical Hat (+10 Acc) or Homam Zucchetto (+4 Acc, +4% Haste)
Merman's Earring (+6 Atk) or Suppamoni (+0.1% haste?)
Brutal Earring (+5% double attack)
Byrnie (+20 Atk)
Tarasque Mitts (+10 Atk)
Assailant's Ring (+5 Atk)
Any Acc ring (+4-7 Acc)
Fortitude Torque (+7 Sword skill) or Royal Gaurd's Collar (+4 Atk, +4 Acc)
Forager's Mantle (+15 Atk) or Charger Mantle (+20 Atk) or Amemet Mantle (+10 Atk)
Swordbelt (+10 Atk)
Dusk Trousers (+14 Atk) or Royal Knight's Breeches (+4 Atk)
Tiger Ledelsens (+3 Atk) or Homam Gambieras (+6 Acc, +3% Haste)
Totals: +76-99 Atk (~390-410+ Atk), +14-29 Acc (+14% additional Acc from sushi), and +0-7% Haste
That doesn't take into account +STR/DEX and switching gear for WSes.

Attack Food + Accuracy Gear:
Company Sword
Joyeuse
Tiphia Sting (+2 Atk, +2 Acc) or Anything else.
Homam Zucchetto (+4 Acc, +4% Haste) or Optical Hat (+10 Acc)
Assault Earring (+5 Atk, +2 Acc) or Suppamoni (+0.1% haste?)
Brutal Earring (+5% double attack)
Haubergeon (+10 Atk, +10 Acc), or Homam Corazza (+15 Acc, +~1% Triple Attack)
Homam Manopoles (+4 Acc, +3% Haste)
Any Acc ring (+4-7 Acc)
Any Acc ring (+4-7 Acc)
Fortitude Torque (+7 Sword skill) or Royal Gaurd's Collar (+4 Atk, +4 Acc)
Forager's Mantle (+15 Atk) or Charger Mantle (+20 Atk) or Amemet Mantle (+10 Atk) or Settler's Cape (+10 Acc, -10 Attack)
Lifebelt (+10 Acc)
Homam Cosciales (+3 Acc, +3% Haste) or Galliard Trousers (+5 Acc) or Dusk Trousers (+14 Atk)
Homam Gambieras (+6 Acc, +3% Haste)
Totals: +1-44 Atk (+75-90 Atk from attack food), +56-72 Acc, and +0-13% Haste
That doesn't take into account +STR/DEX and switching gear for WSes.

Of course, neither of these setups, nor a combination of the 2 for optimization, would compare to a fully decked out regular DD, but would be comparable to most avearge regular DD's. If only I could get a party as PLD/NIN to test how well a PLD/NIN could do as DD.

I have tested tanking as PLD/NIN, but only on NMs. I've done main tanking for WSNM, and duo tanked Hakutaku with a NIN/WAR. In both situations, I had to hold back so that the main tank, or secondary tank could take hate off me. For the WSMNs, I used Sushi and +attack gear (Byrnie and Amemet Mantle) and kept hate through damage, flash, and +emnity. For Hakutaku, Flash, full +emnity, and a bit of DD stole hate off the NIN tank. Would be neat to try tanking in an EXP party as PLD/NIN too, but that will be tested after I try DD PLD/NIN.

[Lmnop]

Re: Paladin DD 101

suppa is supposedly 5% less delay when dual wielding. i.e. 5% pseudo-haste. Sarashi is the 1% piece.

If homam's in the equation, I'm of the mindset that full homam and +STR/attack in every other slot would be ideal. so basically: spike necklace, str rings, warwolf, amemet mantle (I'm not picky enough to say forager's), suppa and any attack earring (brutal ideal). I haven't seen anything about the homam body, btw. if you happen to have a link handy to testing with it, i'd love to see it. I was expecting it to be a good activation rate like the earring. Even with that set up, you could probably eat meat dishes.

[Weeeekujata]

Re: Paladin DD 101

Remember attack is for consistency and STR is to actually up that dmg cap, mix and match @_@

[csBahamut]

Re: Paladin DD 101

From what I've read in other threads, the Triple Attack rate on Homam body is pretty low. Less that 5% for sure. Possibly 1% only.

I have not played a DD job to high levels before, so I really don't know how to mix and match +STR and +Atk gear. Generally though, I've seen more benifits from +Atk during TP building, and +STR during WS. Other DD jobs get more gear with +Atk/STR/Acc combinations on them than PLD does. The only thing PLD has going for it is the naturally high STR.

Based on my current experience against VTs, my Company Sword hits for ~40-60 damage range a swing with around ~360 Atk. I figure that breaking 400 Atk would be sufficient for consistent enough damage, but still won't make VTs Low Defense. Based on this, I think the Attack food + Acc/Homam gear would work the best for DD'ing, similar to how THFs go Acc gear and Atk food. Though the sushi + atk gear is a lot more reasonable to obtain (except that stupid Dusk Trousers that just went out of my price range). I just don't know how much +Acc is enough though.

So I figure the best gear setup would be:
Company Sword
Joyeuse
Tiphia Sting (+2 Atk, +2 Acc)
Homam Zucchetto (+4 Acc, +3% Haste)
Assault Earring (+2 Acc, +5 Atk) *Other might prefer Suppamoni, but I like the Knight's Earring I picked.
Brutal Earring (+5% Double Attack)
Haubergeon (+10 Acc, +10 Atk, +5 STR, +5 DEX)
Homam Manopoles (+4 Acc, +3% Haste)
Sniper Ring (+5 Acc)
Sniper Ring (+5 Acc)
Fortitude Torque (+7 Sword Skill)
Forager's Mantle (+15 Atk, +3 STR)
Lifebelt (+10 Acc)
Homam Cosciales (+3 Acc, +3% Haste)
Homam Gambieras (+6 Acc, +3% Haste)

So adding up all the +effects, and accounting for the effects of +STR/DEX/Skill/Food, the totals are: +118 Atk (~458 Atk), +60 Acc, +12% Haste, +8 STR, and +5 DEX. For on WSes, the Homam head, hands, legs, and feet can be switched with Hetacomb pieces, and the Warwolf Belt for the Lifebelt, for a lot of +STR. I don't see any way to sacrifice a little Atk for more +STR in that setup. I think that +60 Acc is minimum to keep up with the hit rate of other jobs as well. Going with +50 Acc might be pushing the hitrate and TP building rate. Would be best to ask a DD about that.

*EDIT*
Fixed Haste on Homam head.

[Lmnop]

Re: Paladin DD 101

According to mysterytour, the head piece is +3% haste. Ace's helm is the 4% one. That minor adjustment aside...

A quick forum jump:
http://ffxi.killvoid.com/forums.php?m=posts&q=88967

While a lot of DDs are really only happy with rediculous accuracy, Nny says he runs on 33 acc +5 from food (attack food at that). Since the sushi explosion, no one's really heeded diminishing returns very well. People are basically wearing the same acc gear as before (even more, warriors always wearing snipers when they never used to... ) as well as eating sushi. I agree with Nny on this one, and worthy of note is that he's using his B rank sword but he may have that meritted. At any rate, I think you should risk letting your acc drop and see how you perform. I'd rather actually deal damage with 89% accuracy than just feed the mob tp @95% acc.